I've seen claims on the forum that Severne is basically constant curve now. I have a bunch of Nolimitz skinnies. Would they work well or just OK? I don't want to second guess my equipment and worry that my setup is wrong - windsurfing is hard enough as it is. And getting the best sail, only not to get the most out of it seems pointless to me. Conversely, windsurfing is expensive enough as it is, and this mast curve monkey business is annoying as hell.

NoLimitz is a good solid mast. Not sure if you have any NoLimitz Sumo masts or just standard NoLimitz, but I would go with Goya or Sailworks sails. They are hard core sails that want a hard core mast. I don't think Severne sails will deliver the performance off a NoLimitz mast. In other words, you want a good solid performing sail to match up with your NoLimitz mast.

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Magic Ride said..
NoLimitz is a good solid mast. Not sure if you have any NoLimitz Sumo masts or just standard NoLimitz, but I would go with Goya or Sailworks sails. They are hard core sails that want a hard core mast. I don't think Severne sails will deliver the performance off a NoLimitz mast. In other words, you want a good solid performing sail to match up with your NoLimitz mast.

No, not the Sumos, the originals. FWIW, this gave me hope: purewindsurfing.blogspot.com/2014/11/2015-severne-freek-review.html

But maybe freestyle sails with their super-tight leech are a different animal altogether.

I just haven't had good luck with Severne sails. The quality is nothing compared to Goya. I think Sailworks is up their in quality as well. But the stitching, thread and how Severne sails are assembled is pretty poor in my opinion. I had a brand-new Severne sail a few years ago and the batton pocket near the mast opened up and the thread came unstitched after one season. I sent the sail back, to have it repaired. They repaired it for no charge. Later on, parts of the leach, luff sleeve and all batton pockets started showing excessive wear, especially in the stitching coming undone. Seems like a lot of Ausies like Severne sails. Maybe I just had a lemon. It just seems to lack performance compared to Goya, Ezzy, Naish, Sailworks to name a few.

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Magic Ride said..
I just haven't had good luck with Severne sails. The quality is nothing compared to Goya. I think Sailworks is up their in quality as well. But the stitching, thread and how Severne sails are assembled is pretty poor in my opinion. I had a brand-new Severne sail a few years ago and the batton pocket near the mast opened up and the thread came unstitched after one season. I sent the sail back, to have it repaired. They repaired it for no charge. Later on, parts of the leach, luff sleeve and all batton pockets started showing excessive wear, especially in the stitching coming undone. Seems like a lot of Ausies like Severne sails. Maybe I just had a lemon. It just seems to lack performance compared to Goya, Ezzy, Naish, Sailworks to name a few.

What Severne sail was that? Yes, I've heard "Severne sails are super-light, but that comes at a cost" usually from adepts of a certain big brand. Yet I've also been told that Blades last from people who actually use them regularly in the surf, not just back and forth sailing.

Severne might have had problems with construction 10 years ago. I regularly see 5 year old Severne Blade and S1s sitting in on the beach here in WA that still look flawless. I think these days pretty much every company has their manufacturing sorted. Yes there will always be some products coming of the line that have problems but that's to be expected. From my experience pretty much every brand will recognise this and replace or repair a product with manufacturing problems without question.

I had the Convert. Always used it in fresh water at my lake with no sand, always rigged on grass dryed it with a towel after every session. As you can tell I take pride in caring for my gear.

I have Severne Blades and Gators, 0 to 5 years old, never had any problems with quality. They do rig better on Severne masts...

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Simonzee said..
I have Severne Blades and Gators, 0 to 5 years old, never had any problems with quality. They do rig better on Severne masts...

Well the North site lists their masts and sails as fully compatible with Severne. And North has always been constant curve. Some people swear that Severne has pretty much gone CC as well recently, yet the Unifibre website has Severne as borderline hard-top/constant curve - same as Point7. But North says it is only partially compatible with Point 7 (30-40% performance loss). I've also heard that masts can be really variable in their bend characteristics from the same manufacturer - you may spend spend $1000 on a 100% mast only to get a lemon. It also seems like the newer sails are less reliant on luff curve produced by the mast and more on seam shaping (hello Mr Ezzy!), so they should be less reliant on the precise curve, but high carbon content is still useful for lightness and quick flex response...

www.windsurf.co.uk/5-3m-wave-sail-test-2017/

tldr; All I can say is that my NPs looked like rubbish rigged on Gaastra masts (hard top - no wonder), and even on the nolimitz CC masts they looked wrong. Hence my concern. But then I heard that flex top sails are really really reliant on a precise mast bend.

You may be successful for a while and get lucky with mix and matching sails and masts together, but eventually you will purchase the wrong combination and that's when it hits you. Yup this happend to me!! So now I don't second guess It anymore. I get the sail that matches the mast. Brand to brand = best performance possible!

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MrCranky said..
I've seen claims on the forum that Severne is basically constant curve now. I have a bunch of Nolimitz skinnies. Would they work well or just OK? I don't want to second guess my equipment and worry that my setup is wrong - windsurfing is hard enough as it is. And getting the best sail, only not to get the most out of it seems pointless to me. Conversely, windsurfing is expensive enough as it is, and this mast curve monkey business is annoying as hell.

You should tell us more about where you sail and what type of sailing you do. Nevertheless using a sail and mast combination that are known to match is one of the best things you can do to help your windsurfing. If you aren't sure about the match don't go there!

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Shifu said..

MrCranky said..
I've seen claims on the forum that Severne is basically constant curve now. I have a bunch of Nolimitz skinnies. Would they work well or just OK? I don't want to second guess my equipment and worry that my setup is wrong - windsurfing is hard enough as it is. And getting the best sail, only not to get the most out of it seems pointless to me. Conversely, windsurfing is expensive enough as it is, and this mast curve monkey business is annoying as hell.

You should tell us more about where you sail and what type of sailing you do. Nevertheless using a sail and mast combination that are known to match is one of the best things you can do to help your windsurfing. If you aren't sure about the match don't go there!

90% of the time in the choppy/swelly Port Phillip bay. Most sessions this season on an 86l fsw. (I want to do more proper wave sailing, but I don't see myself doing much in the foreseeable future.) In 18+ knots lots of guys on blades in the bay raving about how stable and forgiving they are in gusts and chop. Anyway, I don't know how any of this matters regarding mast/sail compatibility.

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It just seems to lack performance compared to Goya, Ezzy, Naish, Sailworks to name a few.

Define performance. Fairly confident that they are the highest preforming sails in pwa waves. That's if you use results as performance. Build and durability wise not a stitch out of place on any of my blades or s1's.

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MrCranky said..
...

tldr; All I can say is that my NPs looked like rubbish rigged on Gaastra masts (hard top - no wonder), and even on the nolimitz CC masts they looked wrong. Hence my concern. But then I heard that flex top sails are really really reliant on a precise mast bend.

The Unifiber chart shows the Severnes as just a little bit hard top. That's nothing like the difference between a NP and Gaastra. What's more a sail for a hard top rigged on a cc works better than the other way around. If your cc mast is true cc and the sail is looking for a couple of points harder it just means that the top will set a little looser and/or the bottom a bit flatter.
Borrow one. I think it's worth testing.

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MrCranky said..

Shifu said..

MrCranky said..
I've seen claims on the forum that Severne is basically constant curve now. I have a bunch of Nolimitz skinnies. Would they work well or just OK? I don't want to second guess my equipment and worry that my setup is wrong - windsurfing is hard enough as it is. And getting the best sail, only not to get the most out of it seems pointless to me. Conversely, windsurfing is expensive enough as it is, and this mast curve monkey business is annoying as hell.

You should tell us more about where you sail and what type of sailing you do. Nevertheless using a sail and mast combination that are known to match is one of the best things you can do to help your windsurfing. If you aren't sure about the match don't go there!

90% of the time in the choppy/swelly Port Phillip bay. Most sessions this season on an 86l fsw. (I want to do more proper wave sailing, but I don't see myself doing much in the foreseeable future.) In 18+ knots lots of guys on blades in the bay raving about how stable and forgiving they are in gusts and chop. Anyway, I don't know how any of this matters regarding mast/sail compatibility.

Sounds like you want a blasting sail rather than a wave sail. Plenty of those around that will go on the masts you have.

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Magic Ride said..
I just haven't had good luck with Severne sails. The quality is nothing compared to Goya. I think Sailworks is up their in quality as well. But the stitching, thread and how Severne sails are assembled is pretty poor in my opinion. I had a brand-new Severne sail a few years ago and the batton pocket near the mast opened up and the thread came unstitched after one season. I sent the sail back, to have it repaired. They repaired it for no charge. Later on, parts of the leach, luff sleeve and all batton pockets started showing excessive wear, especially in the stitching coming undone. Seems like a lot of Ausies like Severne sails. Maybe I just had a lemon. It just seems to lack performance compared to Goya, Ezzy, Naish, Sailworks to name a few.

You joking, right? Lack performance! Did you have it on the correct mast? Id put it down to user error. I cant believe you suggested to use Goyas or Ezzy on a nolimitz mast.
Pfft forum experts hey.

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mclovin said..

It just seems to lack performance compared to Goya, Ezzy, Naish, Sailworks to name a few.

Define performance. Fairly confident that they are the highest preforming sails in pwa waves. That's if you use results as performance. Build and durability wise not a stitch out of place on any of my blades or s1's.

"highest preforming" does this mean they set faster than other sails ?

I do note that the top 5 sails in 2016 PWA Wave overall results were:

1. North
2. RRD
3. Goya
4. GA Sails
5. Severne

Not sure they are highest performing. Certainly a lot of top sailors use them. The sailor is probably more important.

Ocean Air Sports Windsurfing shop sets all their Goya sails on NoLimitz masts, and recommends that mast for Goya sails. Jason, head designer for Goya Sails, says NoLimitz masts will work well in Goya sails, but says Ezzy masts would perform better. I have a newer Goya sail, and use an Ezzy mast and it performs excellent. But I can still say, Ezzy and Goya sails are much higher quality, durable sails than Severne. Huge difference. Just putting the sails side by side would blow anyone's mind.

Severne is used in the competitions I'm sure because of the huge weight reduction, but that comes at a cost or trade off.

Another disadvantage to Severne is that where the sail panels are sewn together, they don't glue the edges to the sail to prevent the edges from catching and freying. Also reading up on the latest Severne sails, they aren't even using scrim in their sails. If there are changes in that, I would like to know. But it still says they are using 100% X-Ply. But I still stand strongly behind Goya and Ezzy, whole world of difference in quality, performance and precision on a completely different level.

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Magic Ride said..
I had the Convert. Always used it in fresh water at my lake with no sand, always rigged on grass dryed it with a towel after every session. As you can tell I take pride in caring for my gear.

There is your problem Magic not enough salt.

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Magic Ride said..
Ocean Air Sports Windsurfing shop sets all their Goya sails on NoLimitz masts, and recommends that mast for Goya sails. Jason, head designer for Goya Sails, says NoLimitz masts will work well in Goya sails, but says Ezzy masts would perform better. I have a newer Goya sail, and use an Ezzy mast and it performs excellent. But I can still say, Ezzy and Goya sails are much higher quality, durable sails than Severne. Huge difference. Just putting the sails side by side would blow anyone's mind.

Severne is used in the competitions I'm sure because of the huge weight reduction, but that comes at a cost or trade off.

Another disadvantage to Severne is that where the sail panels are sewn together, they don't glue the edges to the sail to prevent the edges from catching and freying. Also reading up on the latest Severne sails, they aren't even using scrim in their sails. If there are changes in that, I would like to know. But it still says they are using 100% X-Ply. But I still stand strongly behind Goya and Ezzy, whole world of difference in quality, performance and precision on a completely different level.

From the Goya website.
Answer: Thanks for your mail and question. Simmer mast should be OK.Nolimitz original skinny 400 is stiffer in the top, softer in the bottom than the Goya mast. This will make your sails a bit tighter in the head, and softer (flatter) in the bottom.

Question: Does the Goya Nexus rig satisfactorily on No Limitz Skinnys or Powerex RDMs in the appropriate length? Are your masts considered constant curve or flex-top?Answer: Goya masts are considered flex top in lengths 370, 400, 430, and more of a constant curve bend in the lengths 310, 340, 460 and 490. Nolimitz masts tend towards constant curve in every length listed here. So, to answer your question- Nexus requiring 460 or 490 will rig OK on NL, 430 is not as good but basically OK. Nexus 4.3 and 4.9 really do much better on a Goya mast.

From Ezzy site
Ezzy mast bend curves are tip: 75% to 79% and base: 62% to 65%

Goya require flex top No limitz are constant curve

Yeah and 3 batten sails are the best for freeride

Here is some more info on NoLimitz masts from this last issue of "Windsurfing Now"Magazine.


Below, is the 2017 Unifiber mast selector chart for sh!ts n giggles!

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tobyr said..

Magic Ride said..
I had the Convert. Always used it in fresh water at my lake with no sand, always rigged on grass dryed it with a towel after every session. As you can tell I take pride in caring for my gear.

There is your problem Magic not enough salt.

Salt or Iodine

I think I will order sushi tonight and load up on soy sauce and wasabi Or, maybe I should just order take out and have a sushi fest all over the Severne Convert. It would be a sure fire salty sail after that.

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MrCranky said..
I've seen claims on the forum that Severne is basically constant curve now. I have a bunch of Nolimitz skinnies. Would they work well or just OK? I don't want to second guess my equipment and worry that my setup is wrong - windsurfing is hard enough as it is. And getting the best sail, only not to get the most out of it seems pointless to me. Conversely, windsurfing is expensive enough as it is, and this mast curve monkey business is annoying as hell.

Severne sails might be constant curve, you should email them and ask. Windsurf Systems has been the Australian distributor of Nolimitz masts for the past four years and they do make a good product and there's no better way to check than ask Mike Burns - Team rider for Nolimitz and Severne sailor, his contact details are available at nolimitz.com/team Mike uses and recommends the SUMO 400 and tests with the Gorilla have proven the mast bend is the same.

Its interesting to note as "Magic Ride" has pointed out that Nolimitz also makes masts exclusively for the following brands, Sailworks, Goya and Ezzy under their guidelines. Their own successful models are: SUMO, Original Skinny and the FAST which all work well in different combinations to suit sails that are flex and hard top.