So it looks great, but why do it? I think I heard it was for dumping excess power before gybing or maybe to help get a tricky slalom board through the turn.

Any opinions? Is it worth learning for freeriding?

...because it looks cool!

I prefer my own version - the 'fall-off' gybe.

Gybes are like aeroplane landings.

Every one that you get away from standing up is a good one.

yeah as mentioned, people do them because they look cool and if you pull it off at that speed it's even coolerer. And just as cool is a fully plaining duck gybe

sadly i can't do either but i will not give up

As far as I'm concerned. It's to look soooooo cool. And it does. If ya can do it! Not me but

Great way to try laydown jibe is to oversheet the sail and let go with the front hand - and remembering to really bend your legs... Nothing bad will happen - obviously you won't complete the jibe but you will get an idea what it feels like.

The real challenge is to plane out of the laydown. They're easy enough to initiate.

Bjorn is the master:

The purpose is to keep pressure on inside rail.
and they are relatively easy. it's the commiting at start that is hard.

when the boom skips the water let the sail rotate, which it does maybe easier than if you were upright.
it sort of leaves you with sail rotated but you still facing water, and feeling as if you could sail out toeside.
but as you switch your feet you are already planning on reverse tack with nothing to do but hook in.

when you start Gybe and move back foot to leeward rail with bent knees, aim to hit your shin with the sail.

get one done and you'll be hooked.

I forgot to point out that keeping pressure on inside rail calms the board down and makes it run smooth through turn.
In above video note how after unhooking the board is bouncing. then see how much it bounces when he lays it down.

A laydown jibe allows you to get your wieght out side the board during a hi speed turn. The g force in the turn makes you lean inward and get the board to bank steep but there is a sail in the way.
The best way is to slice the sail above the water .
Laying the sail down looks good but it feels natural when your powered up.

Its a great way to off load the power and create a tighter arc,,,the foot of the sail will often brush your shin. I feel the power surge through my body and at times released through vocal cords

Just do it

Plus it allows you to step your feet through before releasing the rig, so the gybe is smoother and you fall less.

Main advantage is that you can turn really tight by sheeting in hard, you can control the power by laying the rig down further, so in light winds you will see good sailors laying down about 45%, in high winds they will lay it down so that the mast tip is touching the water.

The advantage is that when you get it right you can turn tightly and exit gybes really fast, this is clearly a big advantage when racing - when I watch people like Ross Williams, I am staggered by how tight he can gybe around a buoy without seeming to loose much speed

The disadvantage is that you really don't have much ability to control the turn once committed, when racing with the amateur fleet, if the sailor in front falls, you don't have many options other than to bail out

Initiating a laydown is easy - move both hands towards the end of the boom just before you go into the gybe, sheet in hard and lean forward. I find the tricky bit is getting the timing right; bring the rig up a fraction too early and the sudden loss of mastfoot pressure will make the board bounce and the increase in power in the rig will take you over the front. However, wait a fraction of a second too late and you will struggle to bring the rig back up, if you do manage, you will be sailing clew first and struggle to control the exit, and will almost certainly come off the plane or fall in.

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ikw777 said..
So it looks great, but why do it? I think I heard it was for dumping excess power before gybing or maybe to help get a tricky slalom board through the turn.

Any opinions? Is it worth learning for freeriding?

Cos its great fun !!!!

Great way to dump power when you tip it in doing high 30kt runs, not so good when you drop the boom into the water.

The laydown gybe?

Well one thing is for sure; kiters can't do it!

Interesting. I don't find them every elegant to watch compared with a strap to strap no-handed gybe (or whatever they are called these days). Maybe I'm too used to shorter booms and nobody does them any more. Switching feet before flipping the sail just looks ugly to me.

It lets you see the coral and fish through the monofilm as it drags over the water!

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scottydog said...
It lets you see the coral and fish through the monofilm as it drags over the water!

Mono film young enough to see through! Luxury!!

Its fun. An old Vid of mine but the water hasn't changed

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AUS1111 said..
The laydown gybe?

Well one thing is for sure; kiters can't do it!

You think so? You've never seen a kiter do a toeside carve? Kiters and windsurfers do it for exactly the same reason.Maximum engagement of the rail. Come to think of it, surfers and snowboarders do it too.

Skiers and snowboarders lie their rigs down?

Damnit, now I know what I've been doing wrong.....I don't take a sail onto the slopes. Now I just have to work out how to get the rig onto the chairlift.

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Gorgo said..

AUS1111 said..
The laydown gybe?

Well one thing is for sure; kiters can't do it!

You think so? You've never seen a kiter do a toeside carve? Kiters and windsurfers do it for exactly the same reason.Maximum engagement of the rail. Come to think of it, surfers and snowboarders do it too.

I would think it rather different - it is not just about max rail engagement - this is all about how hard it is to do so and why...... do kiters completely depower the kite and rely upon pure momentum to maintain that carve, then bring the kite power back into play late on, then to make it even even harder the kite has to switch sides so just after you bring the power back on the game changes all over again. I think not. They carve with power all the way (mostly)

A real good planing laydown gybe in chop takes years. Kiters carve a turn with the nice constant power and no need to swap feet or flip the rig, in half a season.

Pilot vs passenger analogy again.

My vid with laydownish gybe.

15 - 20 years ago used to be much more proficient at slalom sailing and doing much more aggressive laydown gybes on the tricky DSB's. Would have been way more fun on the current isonic which I only get out on maybe 5 - 8 times a year on.

I used to find it was a case of keeping weight and sail as far forward as possible and dropping it down for only a short time at high speed. If you left it down for longer you had to keep the arc more drawn out.

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Mark _australia said..

Gorgo said..

AUS1111 said..
The laydown gybe?

Well one thing is for sure; kiters can't do it!

You think so? You've never seen a kiter do a toeside carve? Kiters and windsurfers do it for exactly the same reason.Maximum engagement of the rail. Come to think of it, surfers and snowboarders do it too.

I would think it rather different - it is not just about max rail engagement - this is all about how hard it is to do so and why...... do kiters completely depower the kite and rely upon pure momentum to maintain that carve, then bring the kite power back into play late on, then to make it even even harder the kite has to switch sides so just after you bring the power back on the game changes all over again. I think not. They carve with power all the way (mostly)

A real good planing laydown gybe in chop takes years. Kiters carve a turn with the nice constant power and no need to swap feet or flip the rig, in half a season.

Pilot vs passenger analogy again.

I would suggest a lay down gybe is the only way to initiate a gybe. The real issue is how far and how aggressively you lay down depending on the conditions. Perhaps approaching gybes with too much hesitation is the reason so many people find gybing difficult.

Kites depower going through a gybe. As you ride at the kite the lines lose tension and as the kite moves to the edge of the window power is reduced, or lost completely if your timing is bad. If you ride with too much power and insufficient engagement of the rail you're going to spin out, same as a sailboard. Kiters on directionals can and do change feet mid gybe. At the optimum point of depower there is little force on the board and rider and swapping feet is easy, also the same as a sailboard. It is possible to do powered transitions on a kite in very strong conditions, and of course a twin tip doesn't need to swap feet.

All that is irrelevant. The reason to lay down gybe is to approach the turn with sufficient power, engage the rail fully and with power, and to oversheet to depower the sail at the critical moment.

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Gorgo said..

AUS1111 said..
The laydown gybe?

Well one thing is for sure; kiters can't do it!

You think so? You've never seen a kiter do a toeside carve? Kiters and windsurfers do it for exactly the same reason.Maximum engagement of the rail. Come to think of it, surfers and snowboarders do it too.

Video. Or it didn't happen.