Will a North sail with a 489 luff work with a NP 100% 490 mast when recommended mast is a 460?

If it was a North or other CC mast and you are heavier (like me) I would say go for it
Some NP masts are still flextop
Older ones are supposed to be CC, but I am not convinced
With older NP mast it would be worth the try ...
My SW Retro 8.0 rigged better with a NP mast than with an MS mast
ie flex versus hard top ...

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joe windsurf said..
If it was a North or other CC mast and you are heavier (like me) I would say go for it
Some NP masts are still flextop
Older ones are supposed to be CC, but I am not convinced
With older NP mast it would be worth the try ...
My SW Retro 8.0 rigged better with a NP mast than with an MS mast
ie flex versus hard top ...

It's an old used mast I bought recently. It has CC stamped on it

As Joe said , give it a go.
I also am heavier than average and prefer NP at and over 460 on my north sails.
I have both to choose from.
Even though NP are meant to bo flexier than North and heavy guys should use stiffer masts , NP seem to be less work , go figure
One thing I can say is is NP masts are awesome even the old ones.
If u can downhaul and have less than 75 mm gap , give it a go.
Old NP work like majic

That mast is very flex top, despite the cc written on it. Give it a go, but I doubt it will suit the sail. Will be too full and loose up top.

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Yves said..
That mast is very flex top, despite the cc written on it. Give it a go, but I doubt it will suit the sail. Will be too full and loose up top.

Tend to agree with Yves. You will lose some of the sails potential.
of course if tge North is old and clapped out it may make little difference

I learned the hard way, be safe and not sorry and do yourself a valuable favor and get the mast that matches up with the sail size. You want the sail to fit and perform properly on the correct size mast.

Or buy the correct sail to fit your NP mast that you have.

I also learned the hardway. All my gear was NP - bought a north sail to use with my NP masts - used it a couple of times and no matter how I rigged it would not rotate the bottom battens. So sold it and bought another NP sail.

I used the same mast in my north warp didnt work just snapped at the bottom batton ,thought idd save money but cost me a mast and a repair to my sail and 2 battons

Dear Friend,
General rule for 489 luff is 460cm mast plus 29 cm extension. If you have got 490 cm mast then you need zero extension. Just adjust your extension to min size and insert it to your mast thats all. Don't pay attention to pruducer rules. Good luck...

Thanks all for the helpful advice. Looks like I'll keep looking for a NP sail. This may be a stupid question, but, if I end up buying a new NP, ie a 2016 or 2017, will this old mast work with it? Have the NP mast curves changed over the years? I don't even know what year the mast is.

If the mast is in good condition it should be ok

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Imax1 said...
If the mast is in good condition it should be ok

I would not risk a new sail in an old SDM mast.

Hey OW, just rig it and see what it looks like. I've got a 7.8m KA Koyote that's supposed to use a 460 mast with 30 extension and I use Brad's old NP 490 mast in it and it rigs and works just fine even though the purists thought the sky was going to fall in.

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MrCranky said..

Imax1 said...
If the mast is in good condition it should be ok

I would not risk a new sail in an old SDM mast.

Why Cranky ?

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Paddles B'mere said...
Hey OW, just rig it and see what it looks like. I've got a 7.8m KA Koyote that's supposed to use a 460 mast with 30 extension and I use Brad's old NP 490 mast in it and it rigs and works just fine even though the purists thought the sky was going to fall in.

NP is less flex top and more constant curve in bigger masts. Which makes sense - you want a stiffer mast in lighter winds.

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Imax1 said...

MrCranky said..

Imax1 said...
If the mast is in good condition it should be ok

I would not risk a new sail in an old SDM mast.

Why Cranky ?

Temperament is genetic. Nothing I can do about it.

Ok let's get into it !
This is only my idea on this topic,
Sails should be matched to their own masts,
This is where there development revolves around, to win events , that's what sells , I appreciate that.
Extreme 75-80 kg riders and testers set a mark because that is average top sailing , except the heavy really fast guys.
For us average it isn't always that simple,
We vary a LOT ,
We could be
average ,
light,
heavy ( like me )
skilled ,
average ,
or spastic,( like me )
What I read and am told mostly works , but there are gaps.
Experiment , that's the only way,
Not easy but totally worth it

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Paddles B'mere said..
Hey OW, just rig it and see what it looks like. I've got a 7.8m KA Koyote that's supposed to use a 460 mast with 30 extension and I use Brad's old NP 490 mast in it and it rigs and works just fine even though the purists thought the sky was going to fall in.

Mate, I bought the 490 mast first and am now looking for a sail. The plan was to get a NP sail, saw a North advertised that might have fitted the brief, hence the question. Happy to get a Pryde, new if I have to, didn't consider an old Pryde mast wouldn't work with a new Pryde sail.

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MrCranky said..

Imax1 said...

MrCranky said..

Imax1 said...
If the mast is in good condition it should be ok

I would not risk a new sail in an old SDM mast.

Why Cranky ?

Temperament is genetic. Nothing I can do about it.

What does that mean ?

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Orange Whip said..

Paddles B'mere said..
Hey OW, just rig it and see what it looks like. I've got a 7.8m KA Koyote that's supposed to use a 460 mast with 30 extension and I use Brad's old NP 490 mast in it and it rigs and works just fine even though the purists thought the sky was going to fall in.

Mate, I bought the 490 mast first and am now looking for a sail. The plan was to get a NP sail, saw a North advertised that might have fitted the brief, hence the question. Happy to get a Pryde, new if I have to, didn't consider an old Pryde mast wouldn't work with a new Pryde sail.

Take the mast and rig the potential sail,
If its a flat sail and if all the battens flip good it's worth a try.
If it's cammed ( extra degree of difficulty ) and bang happily from side to side its also worth a try.
How it will work depends on a lot of factors.
Still trying to figure things out.
Big guys need less downhaul ( fuller ),
now big guys need more downhaul ( because we bend masts creating fuller ) ????
Im confused
I know this didn't help,
The journey is yours , experiment , and then let me know

Bear this in mind....sails rig best on the mast they are designed on, however someone who knows how to rig can usually tweak the rigging to make lot of brand combinations work acceptably and not necessarily what website graphs and claims are.

Some are just not compatible and are just glaringly obvious that the combo will not work.
If you rig a sail on the correct mast and then go for a few runs in constant wind then re rig the sail on a 2 year old mast that has had regular use and go for a few runs then you will notice the older combo feels spongy by comparison to the crisp feel of the new mast.

Masts fibres break down and the resin dries out over time, something to think about with really old masts, not that the human holding it can't compensate for the different feel.

I was the same OW. I already had the 490 mast and the 7.8 Koyote came up for sale, I rigged it with the guy at the shop and got it to look ok so I bought the sail. It's highly likely that the correct mast would make it rig better, but for a squid like me, I wouldn't notice the difference.

Sometimes you get lucky and it's great when that happens. I'm trying my best to match up with the same name brand mast and same name brand sail. I have mixed and matched different sails and mast before and have always done fine until my most resent setup. Which was using my old 5.3 North sail on a 400 Ezzy mast. Didn't work at all. The luff was way too big for my 400 mast. I purchased a 2013 Goya Eclipse Power Wave 6.8 sail which sails very well on my Ezzy 460 mast. I got lucky with that setup, but that was before I had the issue with the 400 mast and old 5.3 North sail. Ended up getting a 5.2 Ezzy Legacy to fit on the Ezzy 400 mast. The numbers all match up with this setup. I find the more you windsurf, the more fine tuned details you look for, in which becomes more critical in your sailing.

It is interesting I recently asked the same question about whether an old NP SDM has the same bend curve as the newer ones. Nobody really knew for sure, but seems it is probably actually constant curve.
But if we ask about an old NP mast with a North sail then everyone seems to know for sure?

Given I have a NP sail that sets funny on a NP mast that is only a couple of years older then yeah things change. So unless the North sail is sooo cheap or free and you get to test it plenty AND see it rigged on the correct mast for reference, then I'd give it a miss.
Cos anything, even the same brand on a mast that is 15 years older than the sail, well that is a gamble.

Thats where the big sail manufacturers get you.they say it works better with their new revised masts.is there such a thing as a universal mast.maybe in 10 years.

oh boy - now the mast discussion really starts ...

first masts had IMCS, which does not seem to mean much to mere mortals (same lengths now seem to have same IMCS)
then they started with "mast bend" which in human terms turned into flex top, constand curve and hard top
and now we are saying that the sail year needs to match the company AND the year
this may sound crazy, but is close to the truth
Maui Sails just recently went from hard top to CC - some said previous masts were ok and others said NON !!
Barry Spanier worked for NP before - were they hard top then ??
etc
etc
as far as universal mast bend - when they were all epoxy - were they not all similar in curve ??

like forceten says in next post - it WILL work - depends on OP
i have gone to chalet and put together whatever I could JUST to get on the water
would I use that combo EVERY day - NO WAY
will or would I do it again and be FULLY satisfied - YES WAY

people are blaming equipment and wind far too much
here people are always complaining that it is gusty or winds up n down
well, hate to tell 'em - that is the NORM - get used to it and rig accordingly
winds are often too light - rig accordingly - get light wind equipment

when i go on ice and snow ANY combo will do !!!

I find this a riot.

orange whip
has NOT, NOT. Disclosed any info on said North sail.

with a portion of the info available how the jeeves cornflakes
can you made opinions.

the sail and mast WILL , work, the degree of performance that it will
depends on how much range the sail( again't it's a North ..that's all we know)
Has to begin with and how much range you are willing to give up.

if the sail is old clapped and clapped out it may make little difference.

for the poster with the theory that the longer NP masts become more constant curv, as a very general not rule but trend, this is so, but 460 is more aligned with the smaller mast sizes. Where 490, 520 ,550 and really stiff for a NP a 580.



Caps meant to emphasize a point not rudeness.

The sail I was looking at was a 2013 S-Type 8.4m. It is 2,325.8 kms from me to the shop that has it on consignment, so not an option to try it. Goal is to have a sail that sets really well on the mast, if not perfectly.

If it's perfection you're after and you can't try it then there's only one option, a matching sail and mast of the same manufacturer and year.

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forceten said..


for the poster with the theory that the longer NP masts become more constant curv, as a very general not rule but trend,

No not a general rule, it is fact. Robert Stroj says so and I think he would know.