OK why does this happen?

I'm a reasonably competent windsurfer. I can sail all day, make most of my gybes, done 6000km in GPSTC. When conditions get really rough however, and small boards and sails are required (5m and lower), it all falls apart. Suddenly I'm a gumby, wobbling round the corners, unable to get the sail to settle, timing all off and unable to settle down and enjoy sailing.

I'm in Qld and most used sizes for me are 7.5 and 6.5. 5m and sub conditions aren't frequent. Is sailing in those conditions THAT different? If not it must be me

Sailing in 25 knots is a different thing than sailing in 20 knots. At 20 knots, it's comfortable and cruisey, but a true 25 knots packs some punch. At 25 knots, there is a lot more power on tap, gusts hit hard, the water is a lot more choppy. Everything is more intense and active.

What size board do you use in the high winds. I'm certainly getting uncomfortable with my 105 litre in 25 knot winds, but on the 78 litre I'm having a ball.

My smallest board is an 85 litre fsw.

Just taking a guess..... But assuming the 6.5/7.5 are more free race/slalom orientated?? Then going to a 5m or smaller. Rigging and set up ,May be a whole lot different? I found that I was over downhaling/out hauling my 4.5 wave sail, making it very hard to use/sail.

Good suggestion but my entire set is wave and camless free ride sails.

I've been working on same issue over the last 6months... Biggest thing for my improvement was timing in swells, make sure you gybe on a large swell, or keep an eye out for smooth patches to turn on.

In terms of technique I found really exaggerating sheeting in to initiate turns made the rig much more controllable, and pushing down hard on the boom made the board push through chop.

Possibly nothing new , but somehow for me
Gibing on my slalom 118L and 8.0 in strong winds I found that intuitively now I keep foot in the strap as long as possible during all the gybe, and press down the boom.
This give me total control over the board even in the chop.
Then relatively to the wind speed I could dig rail more or less. This allow me to gybe at 25 ktn -that never happen before

Something I've learned of late is, if you just want to have fun - SLOW DOWN! Last week we had some wicked wind and even on a 116 litre board (ok, I'm a bit heavier than you Ian) I was having a ball with a 4.7 sail. One of our local windsurfing elders said to me at the time something like, "Anything more than 25 knots (GPS speed) is just not fun in high winds"... but if you're on the speed strip at Burrum, then that's a different story!

Correct down haul/out haul is essential otherwise the sail will be twitchy and heavy, really take the time to get it right. Also don't overlook batten tension, Make sure you've got most of the wrinkles out of your sail. Last but most likely the problem, Your over finned. If your still running the standard fin that came with the board you'll be over finned for the conditions and the board will try and kill you. Drop 2-4 cm in fin size and all will be nice again.

My 2 cents

I used to freeride and seemed to spend all my time going upwind. Now I realise maybe it was because it was easier to control going upwind than off. Now I'm starting to do more speed ( pretty slow really c..28kts odd ) I hate to think what it will feel like going off the wind at speed in chop.
Have to wait and see but I do feel more comfortable less powered up out in B & J conditions than on flat water - I suppose the smaller the board the better too although they can be fast!

Yeah you need to hang out with Macroscien. Sailing with his 8m sail and 118L board in 25 knots we can all learn from him.

Seriously I think once the wind starts getting towards 25 knots its a different sort of windsurfing. Belows this its all about maximising lift from fin, board and sail. Above this there is plenty of power so its about control, especially in choppy water.

Go somewhere you can sail in 40 knts and then the 25/30 knts wind will seem easy after that.

Queens is a fairly wild spot when the wind is pumping. I tend to gybe before you get into the 2m swell.
Maybe also have a look at your sails. your description of not settling down sound familiar to my experience with ezzy many moons ago.

Could also be you are rigging them to flat which will make them twitchy

Ian your not alone here, lots of Sailors find 25 knts + challanging, particularly in open bay conditions when the water state begins to resemble a washing machine. There are also lots of mag articles saying the same. A problem is as the wind increases is that the apparant wind changes and all of a sudden during gybes, you are'nt going as fas as the wind and it is much harder to depower your rigg to the do the flip, puling the back hand in to depower the rig is a lot more important in these conditions.

I think a Wave board instead of a FSW makes things easier as FSW's generate a lot more lift. These are the conditions for which I love to use my Acid 86. Moving the mast forward and boom down can also really help to maintain control. My 2 cents and I also would love to improve my skills in these conditions, just give me some bleedin wind !

like others have said, make sure your gear is rigged correctly. The other major thing IMO is probably technique. With bigger sails in marginal conditions, you can get away with having a dodgy/average gybing technique - slow non-committed entry, average rig flip & footwork etc. In stronger winds really need to get these right, bear off, oversheet your sail, engage your rail and carve - pick your spot in the swell/chop too.

Some great suggestions here. Hmm, I'd be very surprised if anyone could find anything wrong with my rigging skills. I am getting the picture though that sail size and board selection, and sailor technique will be where I'll find some improvement.

Harden up princess

I'm no pro but have found that occasionally I get the right commitment to the harness and the weight off the board and voila, she just goes over the top of the chop.

I've also found it is mentally more difficult to "commit" to a gybe in higher winds / rougher water but with the right gear and right mental state it is easier than what my mind says.

I also find that I spend most of my time on bigger gear and when on smaller gear the timing required is faster, this takes a bit of getting used to.

One problem is TOW, most people seldom sail in 20+ knots so you don't get a chance to tune your gear & get comfortable with it.
I have noticed lately that fin size can be more critical than board size in higher winds, within reason.

Some people change down to a 4.7 & wave board as soon as it's over 15 knots

Even with TOW I find we don't get a consistent 20kts + very often!

eat more pies.

20 knots is a light breeze to a heavy weight.

Select to expand quote

Gestalt said..

eat more pies.

20 knots is a light breeze to a heavy weight.

How do weight belts work? Wouldn't you sink when you went to waterstart?

for speed sailing the ratio is 1lt volume in your buoyancy vest for 1kg of weight.

Select to expand quote

Paul Kelf said..
Some people change down to a 4.7 & wave board as soon as it's over 15 knots

Hey wait a min....

Select to expand quote

Gestalt said..

for speed sailing the ratio is 1lt volume in your buoyancy vest for 1kg of weight.

So special vests? How do you attach the weights? I could do with some in 30kts..

the ka impact vests are pretty good. they have flotation and pockets for lead weight.

you might want to just get a camel water pack though. it's weight neutral in the water and you can have a drink on the fly. 2 litres of water is 2kg. back in the days where I raced longboards camel packs were banned because of the weight advantages when the wind was up.

Select to expand quote

Gestalt said..

the ka impact vests are pretty good. they have flotation and pockets for lead weight.

you might want to just get a camel water pack though. it's weight neutral in the water and you can have a drink on the fly. 2 litres of water is 2kg. back in the days where I raced longboards camel packs were banned because of the weight advantages when the wind was up.

I already wear one and fill it with the full 2ltres when I know I'll be overpowered.. Might have a look at the KA vests..Be good in those westerly gales!64kgs gets blown around like a leaf.. I wear a Neil Pryde vest at the moment.

does the neil pryde vest have pockets for weights?

if it does just use that. be careful of course. you don't want to drown.

Select to expand quote

Gestalt said..

does the neil pryde vest have pockets for weights?

if it does just use that. be careful of course. you don't want to drown.

MM maybe.. I have a mesh area at the front where I put the end of the camel back and some spare downhaul line in case something breaks. I'll have to have a look. Lead weights? Isn't lead poisonous? Where do you get them?

sinkers from a fishing shop. you can get some pretty big ones.

Select to expand quote

sboardcrazy said..

[
How do weight belts work? Wouldn't you sink when you went to waterstart?

Sue, be careful using a weight jacket as it will,

- Raise your centre of gravity making you top heavy

-Wear you out quicker so not as much t.o.w

-Increase the pressure on your back

-Increase the difficulty in jybing

-Make it harder to swim and perform a self rescue

-In event of a crash it may increase the damage you do to you body/board

But they do help in stabilising your upper body when sailing in gusty conditions allowing you to go faster
and you can hold down a larger sail in more wind. You need to be fit with good core strength and a safe place to start practicing using the extra weight. But a smaller board and rig that suits the person might work better than extra weight