Why use different boxes? Surely a deep Tuttle box can fit any board and the cost can't be that different so why do some use something else?
Is there some reason a power box works better in some cases?
Just think how nice it would be if all your fins fit all your boards

We we have the same issue with BB standards in bikes, several different versions that all do the same job.

Unfortunately a deep tuttle box would be to deep for smaller slalom freeride and speed boards.

How about Tuttle in everything?

Select to expand quote

Ben1973 said..
How about Tuttle in everything?

I don't think wave sailors would be happy with that also some boards the front bolt clashes with the back foot straps. Also some prefer just to have to screw up one bolt.

Ok how about a slightly different question, big slalom, race, free ride board that could all take a Tuttle why do some use something else?

Select to expand quote

Ben1973 said..
Ok how about a slightly different question, big slalom, race, free ride board that could all take a Tuttle why do some use something else?

It is easier to do up one bolt rather than two!

If the board has a thick enough tail and uses a big fin it is better to use a deep tuttle box .

It is pretty much the case slalom boards use tuttle or deep tuttle boxes.

In most cases Freeride boards use power box

Maybe your solution would be to have a fin that can fin in a power box or a tuttle box.

Select to expand quote

legless said..

Ben1973 said..
Ok how about a slightly different question, big slalom, race, free ride board that could all take a Tuttle why do some use something else?

It is easier to do up one bolt rather than two!

If the board has a thick enough tail and uses a big fin it is better to use a deep tuttle box .

It is pretty much the case slalom boards use tuttle or deep tuttle boxes.

In most cases Freeride boards use power box

But why do most Free ride boards use power box

Or better still, why don't all boards have the correct fin box installed? Every one knows it's the power box!!

Select to expand quote

legless said..
Maybe your solution would be to have a fin that can fin in a power box or a tuttle box.

The fangy fin does that.

A powerbox fin and box is lighter.
A deep Tuttle is strongest and heaviest .

I always wondered why do people use Tuttle boxes? and not power box.

Agreed. We are the closest we have ever been to 3 easy standards. Tuttle is pretty much irrelevant now, we could have deep tuttle for race n formula, PB for all freeride and smaller slalom boards, and slot box for wave boards IF they are built right.

Select to expand quote

Mark _australia said..
Agreed. We are the closest we have ever been to 3 easy standards. >>>

How many tuttle fins have you seen fitting exactly???? Tuttle boxes alone have more than 3 standards, each manufacturer seems to have their own version. Metric, imperial and just wrong.

Select to expand quote

Mark _australia said..
Agreed. We are the closest we have ever been to 3 easy standards. Tuttle is pretty much irrelevant now, we could have deep tuttle for race n formula, PB for all freeride and smaller slalom boards, and slot box for wave boards IF they are built right.

Now that would make a lot a sense to me. But do you really need stronger than power box for anything other than foil?

Select to expand quote

decrepit said..

Mark _australia said..
Agreed. We are the closest we have ever been to 3 easy standards. >>>

How many tuttle fins have you seen fitting exactly???? Tuttle boxes alone have more than 3 standards, each manufacturer seems to have their own version. Metric, imperial and just wrong.

How many of any fin type actually fit any box right.. Quality control and manufacturing tolerances is a whole other story

Select to expand quote

Mark _australia said..
Agreed. We are the closest we have ever been to 3 easy standards. Tuttle is pretty much irrelevant now, we could have deep tuttle for race n formula, PB for all freeride and smaller slalom boards, and slot box for wave boards IF they are built right.

Ahhumm. Mini Tuttle, USBox, Starbox, Mini USBox are being installed still.

For multi finned boards slot box is a nice option. Not so good as the center fin box, limited size and is not overly strong for a single, nor adjustment like a USBox.

When I install I always seem to fiddle with tuttle to secure the screws, whereas powerbox is cake. USBox takes a procedure , but easy enough.

To answer the OP question, we have the different boxes cause some dont fit due to depth on all tails. The preference between tuttle, deep or not and powerbox to me is a grey area. Tiuttle being stronger no doubt, the weight different would be offset by this.

Select to expand quote

Ben1973 said..

decrepit said..

Mark _australia said..
Agreed. We are the closest we have ever been to 3 easy standards. >>>

How many tuttle fins have you seen fitting exactly???? Tuttle boxes alone have more than 3 standards, each manufacturer seems to have their own version. Metric, imperial and just wrong.

How many of any fin type actually fit any box right.. Quality control and manufacturing tolerances is a whole other story

A gent on the Windsurf UK forum , has a new Styarbaor Air, they installed a USBox as the center of a multi fin, but its smaller in length than standard , of which 2 exist, its Only 14cm long. The fin they'd sent twice , the fin base is longer than 14cm so it doesnt fit. Twice. Replacement is some variation of a slot box , to fit now.

Select to expand quote

forceten said..

Mark _australia said..
Agreed. We are the closest we have ever been to 3 easy standards. Tuttle is pretty much irrelevant now, we could have deep tuttle for race n formula, PB for all freeride and smaller slalom boards, and slot box for wave boards IF they are built right.

Ahhumm. Mini Tuttle, USBox, Starbox, Mini USBox are being installed still.

My point exactly. Slot is adjustable, lighter and strong enough.

A slot box 90 or 100mm base going into a 130mm hole will have adjustment ,otherwise and most bases are 130mm,so no adjustment . Cobra and others installed a smaller slot boxon the sides or forward (quad) set of boxes. Not always consistent

So can we agree on,
If the boards big enough fit a deep Tuttle, if it's not fit a power box unless it's a wave board then fit a slot box.

Still need regular Tuttle for serious sailors using 32-44 cm blade fins.

An advantage of the tuttle is that by differential tightening of the two bolts you can have a little bit of rake adjustment. Not that that was part of the original design consideration.

Also if the tang is sitting a little in the slipstream you've got two bolts to really crank it in. ( Not envisaged in the original design either.)

Likewise if it sits a little deep you can loosen the bolts and tap it back. There's a good chance it'll stayput while sailing.

The rear bolt is really useful for foiling where it works hard under tension. Not envisaged at design but where would foiling development be now if we all had have used power boxes?

Tuttle vs power box for fins to 50cm is a bit illogical. The boards generally have deep tuttle cavities, the top of a standard tuttle tang levers midway up the wall just where it is most flexy? The power box tang is close to the same length but at least it jams up against a boxed in corner which you'd think would be a more rigid connection - gram for gram.

(Yes all those large slalom boards we bought with deep tuttle cavities fitted with standard tuttle fins. Why? Then all those slalom boards just happened to come on the market cheap to help fuel the foil revolution. Was this a marketing conspiracy? I think so the evidence is there.)

Select to expand quote

LeeD said..
Still need regular Tuttle for serious sailors using 32-44 cm blade fins.

Why? PB would do that size just fine? I'm missing something ?

I push hard on a wide 52 in a powerbox and is fine so far . There making foils for PB now , I would think a PB would be as strong as a Tuttle . In fact I would think PB would be stronger because it's locking on all four sides and the bottom whereas the Tuttle just on the ends .The bolts shouldn't be taking any strain unless hitting ground .

Select to expand quote

Mark _australia said..

LeeD said..
Still need regular Tuttle for serious sailors using 32-44 cm blade fins.

Why? PB would do that size just fine? I'm missing something ?

Power box works fine for anything under 50cm it would probably take bigger fine as well

now what we need is 3 board tail ends made exactly the same except for the box then stick a big fin in them all them, put them on there side then jump and and down on the end of the fin to see if there really is any difference.

Im guessing that under a 50kg of load which is probably the most any fin gets Power and Tuttle are about the same.

You only need to ride a few of each back to back to know short Tuttle is more solid than Pb. For foiling, both need bottom flanges but 2 screws is much more solid than one screw. No slalom racer would agree that both are the same in solidity and strength, but for rec freeriders, Pb is adaquate.

Perhaps we need less feedback from engineers and theorists, and more from windsurfers with experience.

^^^^
That would make sense .

Select to expand quote

LeeD said..
Perhaps we need less feedback from engineers and theorists, and more from windsurfers with experience.

We haven't got any feedback from experienced sailors who have tried Tuttle to PB back to back yet , so the best we have is engineers and theorists . Engineers and theorists got us to the moon before moon experience was a thing . Clamp on booms would definitely be an theorized and then engineered thing . No amount of experience would make a tie on boom better