So I picked this Ultra Kode up for not much as I wanted to see if I liked the 86 ltr which I do. It is in good nic except for a couple of super ugly deck repairs. Also there are 2 or 3 cracks in the deck now around 3 to 5 cm long.
I want to repair the cracks and see if I can redo the previously done repairs ( i did not do them originally so know nothing about how they were done).
I have done some basic fiberglass repairs previously. I was going to sand these areas back ( the big area on the port side is proud) and reglass. Same with the cracks, sand back and add a couple of layers of glass.
As said I am a bit of a novice so looking for advice and happy to add some progress pics.
TIA

Ugly or sitting proud - maybe redo

SOFT - definite redo and needing a lot more effort than the first insufficient effort.

So how is it structurally? Obviously push on it. If solid, then its up to you.

id inspect all the cracks first. If theres no give way at all you can put fibreglass over it.
If there is give way then you need to excise a hole in it - stuff that full of styrofoam etc whatever and glue it in place with epoxy. Then seal with epoxy. Then fibreglass over it.
this all really doesnt look that bad.

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Kit3kat said..
id inspect all the cracks first. If theres no give way at all you can put fibreglass over it.
If there is give way then you need to excise a hole in it - stuff that full of styrofoam etc whatever and glue it in place with epoxy. Then seal with epoxy. Then fibreglass over it.
this all really doesnt look that bad.

^^ that is really bad advice for a soft area in a sandwich layup. Fair enough this area is not *all that* structural but to cut thru a PVC layer stuff in styro with epoxy and then glass over is super dodgy.

I'm a real novice with this sort of stuff, but I'll add my tuppnence worth. I had a hand-sized soft area on my deck and used expanding two pot resin-foam mix, injected into the area with just two small holes and one syringe in each hole. A real easy repair to be honest, and the deck is now as firm as it should be from new

The very exciting part was injecting the resin-foam mix, as you have only 3 minutes working time before it sets, but MUCH more importantly than this - when I injected ithe mix nto my board the whole flipping deck area expanded like a balloon !!! Luckily I was able to release the pressure with both syringes and 'work' the expanded area back to the right shape (pressing using my knees!). I genuinely thought the board was totally screwed for a moment though. I'm sure Mark - in all his wisdom - will tell me I was doing something absolutely wrong here. It seems to have worked anyway and everything looks prefect now.

Once set, I filled both the tiny 4mm syringe holes in the deck with Solar Resin and the whole result both looks and feels totally bomber now. (I know that this is not what you are 'supposed' to do with deck holes - but IME Solares is tough as diamonds with all its amazing embedded micro-fibres, so no fibreglass seems to have been needed!). With two tiny injection holes and no fibreglass, you can barely see the repair, which is awesome.

Out on the water, I could immediately feel the difference - the board felt much more positive and very 'zingy'. I also reached my highest ever top speed on it with immediately that first session - 52 kmh - so Isomething seems to have worked - I was very pleased with the outcome.

I did a similar repair with the expanding foam on the deck and had a good result. The deck did expand out a bit but because it was on the top and the deck was curved anyway it was not a problem. I tried a similar method on the bottom of a board which was weighted with bricks (what could possibly go wrong I hear your say). Unfortunately, it puffed up like a balloon and now that board just sits in the shed as an example of what not to do!!!!

Polyurethane expanding foam expend a lot with lot of strengh, when you use it drill free holes around the place where you want it to stop spraid then injected less than you think it's good, while expanded you ll see foaming through free holes so reduce in core pressure. I would more use expanding epoxy resin, it foam with near no pressure so don't push core and skin, only fill but need one's with really low exothermic temp set.

Yeah looks like a classic repair.
Soft? Drill and inject pu glue then trim, sand and glass over area.
If hard, pluck off loose material then glass.

Hi All,

Thanks for the advice. I think ill sand it back to prepare to repair the cracks and will see how soft it is.

Cheers Ant

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Mark _australia said..

Kit3kat said..
id inspect all the cracks first. If theres no give way at all you can put fibreglass over it.
If there is give way then you need to excise a hole in it - stuff that full of styrofoam etc whatever and glue it in place with epoxy. Then seal with epoxy. Then fibreglass over it.
this all really doesnt look that bad.

^^ that is really bad advice for a soft area in a sandwich layup. Fair enough this area is not *all that* structural but to cut thru a PVC layer stuff in styro with epoxy and then glass over is super dodgy.

what else do you suggest to do with it. the fibreglass bridges the area. Of course you cant replace the whole board just with a fibreglass layer. it is a repair.

If it's gone soft, it's probably because it gets a regular load on it. So a repair needs to be able to withstand that load.
I'd recreate the sandwich tied securely into the deck on both sides, inner and outer.

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Kit3kat said..

Mark _australia said..

Kit3kat said..
id inspect all the cracks first. If theres no give way at all you can put fibreglass over it.
If there is give way then you need to excise a hole in it - stuff that full of styrofoam etc whatever and glue it in place with epoxy. Then seal with epoxy. Then fibreglass over it.
this all really doesnt look that bad.

^^ that is really bad advice for a soft area in a sandwich layup. Fair enough this area is not *all that* structural but to cut thru a PVC layer stuff in styro with epoxy and then glass over is super dodgy.

what else do you suggest to do with it. the fibreglass bridges the area. Of course you cant replace the whole board just with a fibreglass layer. it is a repair.

Indeed it is
but just stuff some styro in there or whatever is not sound advice.

I think this is what Mark is trying to say.

Since you _are_ concerned with appearance - ie pointing out that there is a raised area on an existing repair - then simply layering glass over the soft area, or injecting some expanding foam, is bad advice.

As he said, if you weren't concerned with its appearance... then "its up to you" as a non-soft-repair doesn't need any further work. My take -> if it is water tight, then it really doesn't matter as there is an even-money chance that you will bash the nose at some point

The soft-area could use a quick-fix or a good-fix.... what you choose to do really does depend on your wanted outcome.

^^^ well yes but also

why plonk something in that leads to inconsistency then glass over it and have a void - still soft
or add weight with a lump of ill fitting foam and resin
or risk resin cooking the core?
use proper 2 part foam, or a very well shaped piece of styro - but then the latter means redoing sandwich perhaps.
i would never stuff foam in a hole with resin and hope it filled up bits you can't see
it's a decent board, make it nice

Maybe a little over kill but I would sand the damaged areas back in a staggered way that you see each part of the construction. You need to be careful that you don't sand through and make it worse in places.
Then rebuild each part like for like , making sure each layer ties in nicely to the existing material.I think the glass under the pvc is important that it laps onto the existing glass nicely.
Take your time and be precise.

Ok, so a bit of an update.
I have sanded back a bit to see whats going on as I need to repair the cracks ( that are definitely letting in water as they weeped leaving a salt stain after use ).
So found around 3 or 4 cracks in total.
Soft spots are limited to some small ones that are around 20c piece size and dont seem too major.
So looks like really its about repairing the cracks as far as I can tell.

2 scenarios here.
1 the old leaking repair, never sealed properly.
2 the old repair, has cracked under use.
If it's 1 you just need to seal it properly.
If it's 2 you have to restore the original structural integrity. Just sealing a crack with resin is only going to crack again, very soon.

Agree and am planing to restore properly. Not just resin.

Decrepit would mean redoing sandwich when saying restore it
do you have access to 3mm pvc is the big question

Ok, so now your talking about something I dont know much about.
I was intending to add 2/ 3 layers of glass to the area.
Do I need to do the 3mm PVC or can glass it?

Again - depends how soft.
How bad cracks are.
If you're not going to jump it, then you prob can just glass over (after removing the crappy work) and be fine.
Or treat this as a great chance to learn the major repair for when it counts. Go read all the BoardLady site

I'll post you some PVC offcuts.

The "repair" on the starboard side might be much larger than you think, and certainly more than 3-5cm long.
Those Starboard stickers are likely hiding something bad/ugly and there is a line, from poor colour matching, in the light-blue area towards the front. I think you'll need to remove some of the paint before you can decide on appropriate repairs on this one.

^^^ I noted that too
Previous repair not big enough and I assume it was so as to leave the logos - in trying to make it still look nice, it's failed again
when u start a repair, sometimes it gets bigger and bigger and u just have to go with it

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Ok, So I have done some sanding back. Like Mark suggested, as I was sanding back it just seemed to get bigger. I only sanded back what I felt was enough. Enough being remove the paint / stickers and transfer.
Yes, it will be jumped.

I also took the advice and looked up the "board lady" and am a lot wiser on sandwich construction.
The starboard side where the stickers were only has a soft spot around 20c piece size besides the cracks. Under the "starboard stickers" is was very sticky???

If I have this right, then given no major soft spots, I can repair soft spots using urethane foam. Then reglass where the cracks are?

Also happy to be corrected. If I need to open the areas up and redo the sandwich then so be it

There is a crack in the middle of this around 5cm long, and the 20c piece sift spot.




Crack through here.



The Port repair seems solid, but just UGLY. It also did not have any cracks, so happy there.
There is a soft spot about 7cm long 2cm wide near it though (far left of this area).



Also happy to be corrected. If I need to open the areas up and redo the sandwich then so be it. But given no Major cracks or soft spots is it necessary?


TIA Anthony--

It's hard to give a definitive answer to that.
So just understand, that any place that is less stiff than it surrounds can flex.
There's a lot of bending twisting forces on the board when sailing hard.
If these forces play upon a less stiff spot it will flex more than it's surrounds.
This flexing will lead to fatigue of that structure and possible cracking.
A good repair will keep the whole area with the same stiffness, that way any flexing is spread evenly over a big area.

Just a small spot shouldn't be a problem, it's where it's a longer line that flexing can occur.

^^ agreed

By the look of it, it was well massaged before the repair, the sanding has shown just how many small depressions there was (Starboard's 'innovation' with new constructions leading to their idea of 'quality' doesn't help )

I would sand a lot more than that so its mostly foam not just mostly laminate. JUST BARELY hitting foam. Then glass with about 3x 4oz.
Getting it flat after glass will take a bit, its had a lot of belting...

Thanks Mark

I am going to move forward with that advice.

Cheers Anthony