Despite holding a 15 ft red/orange/yellow flag in my hands, visibility to local boaters is still a concern*.

I'm exploring anything that might encourage boaters to pay attention including an orange rash guard over my impact vest and even some sort of led strobe at the mast head similar to what cyclists use - a rechargeable led would be great. I've seen some lights but they either aren't very bright, not likely fully water proof or seem like a burden to attach to mast head.

This is a clever group - any ideas? Bonus points if it's something wingers can use, too.

* Not something I want to get into here but let's say it's not an idle concern.

All of my close encounters have been a result of an inattentive pilot. Even a strobe light on the top of the mast won't help if the pilot isn't looking at the water in front where the boat is going...

Loudspeaker with an activation button on the boom?

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ozzimark said..
All of my close encounters have been a result of an inattentive pilot. Even a strobe light on the top of the mast won't help if the pilot isn't looking at the water in front where the boat is going...

Loudspeaker with an activation button on the boom?

I'll add to that, also, to maintain situational awareness.

I'm guilty of not always checking and clearing behind my sail when there is only me or a small number of other sailors out, as I know that the sailors aren't nearby. Especially in some spots where there are almost never boats. Here's an example, starting at 3:46. It was windy enough that I couldn't hear the boat or the motor that was not that far off from me and I didn't see until I started to jibe around 4:00. I have to remind myself to always clear that side regularly.

Take a signal mirror out with you and shine it directly at the potential customers face (briefly) but that'll only help you out when the conditions and directions are right.

unfortunately, the only good offence is a good defence. Keep a good look out and sail away from potential collisions, not towards them.


Most boat owners forget to take the horse blinkers off when they step out of their car and jump behind the helm of their boat. Not too much we can do about it.

Report them every time if you can. i was almost cleaned up by a big boat and could clearly see the two guys on a flybridge chatting and it was on autopilot.

A dive-boat operator here in QLD had a crew of divers in the water, while the boat was anchored up. The dive-boat captain could see another boat motoring towards him - after some time the captain could see it was on a collision course. He tried radioing, he sounded the boat-horn, waving bright things... nothing worked. Practically speaking, its not simple to up-anchor while there are divers in the water. The motoring boat eventually hit the dive-boat with a glancing blow. The dive-boat is a RIB, so iit luckily didn't result in any damage.

Turns out the motor-boat captain set a course, then went down below. It was determined that he hadn't been at helm for at least 10mins, while motoring at about 15-20kn... you can cover a lot of distance in that time.

True story.

-> which goes to say, there isn't anything you can do if the boat operator isn't paying attention.

If you search this forum, there have been some windsurfer vs boat collisions on the Swan River, Perth -> Boat operators must be vigilant ... they dont realise they are operating a gun. I feel for those that have suffered due to negligence.

I like to repeat a motorcycle phrase that was told to me just after I got my bike-learners -> you are going to be in more pain and injury during any type of collision with anything bigger than you, so try as hard as you can to not put yourself in the situation in the first place.

Edit: I should add... the dive-boat comfortably holds 20 people and all their dive gear, it is about as tall as windsurf-mast and quite long. It is a red-color, with flags up for diving, and so on. It can been seen from at least 2km away.

I like the idea of being more visible but using (strobe) lights is likely illegal as we're still a watercraft and have to adhere to the laws. We can probably only have navigation lights and one white light on top of the mast and potentially a white or yellow at the aft. Strobing is probably an emergency signal or very close to it so you might find a rescue vessel pull up alongside one day

For visibility when sailing with others, I found that a bright colour helmet (orange/yellow) makes a massive difference. You can have the brightest colour sail, but it won't help when you're in the water after a crash or something. The helmet would still be visible from quite some distance while the rig completely disappears in the lightest of chop and swell from a visibility perspective.

I don't think anything will work but if you want lights I used a strobe light on top of my mast and Ay-Up bike lights on my helmet for my night windsurfing. Just set the Strobe to on.

you already have a huge sail which is ultravisible.
These people set the autopilot on and then play on their phone or smth. if you see that they won't avoid a collison then you will need to get out of the way. Some people also do it deliberatley.

My parents >55 foot yacht got hit the other day anchoring in a bay by a boat (being the only boat near by with good/sunny weather) which was being towed by 3 ships. How none of the 4 boats saw them is still unclear till today.

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kato said..
I don't think anything will work but if you want lights I used a strobe light on top of my mast and Ay-Up bike lights on my helmet for my night windsurfing. Just set the Strobe to on.

It was the blinky bike tail light that originally inspired me - we use them for road rides. Honestly, getting in trouble for having a blinky light would be the least of the concerns (US inland lake) as on the water law enforcement is much more concerned with boaters under the influence.

How did you attach the strobe?

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Kit3kat said..
you already have a huge sail which is ultravisible.
These people set the autopilot on and then play on their phone or smth. if you see that they won't avoid a collison then you will need to get out of the way. Some people also do it deliberatley.

My parents >55 foot yacht got hit the other day anchoring in a bay by a boat (being the only boat near by with good/sunny weather) which was being towed by 3 ships. How none of the 4 boats saw them is still unclear till today.

It's very common for fixed objects such as anchored boats, trees, lamp posts and parked cars to jump in front of people. /s Hearing the other stories is depressing me even more than I already am. I certainly have a handful of my own personal encounters including one that still gives me ptsd.

I do appreciate the thoughts and input, though. Thank you all

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ptsf1111 said..
I like the idea of being more visible but using (strobe) lights is likely illegal as we're still a watercraft and have to adhere to the laws. We can probably only have navigation lights and one white light on top of the mast and potentially a white or yellow at the aft. Strobing is probably an emergency signal or very close to it so you might find a rescue vessel pull up alongside one day

For visibility when sailing with others, I found that a bright colour helmet (orange/yellow) makes a massive difference. You can have the brightest colour sail, but it won't help when you're in the water after a crash or something. The helmet would still be visible from quite some distance while the rig completely disappears in the lightest of chop and swell from a visibility perspective.

A white light at the top of the mast indicates that you are at anchor. Probably not the best choice for when you are sailing.

Like you said, Paducah, we are holding a huge bright flag so you won't find anything more visible than that. You could maybe have an air horn but I just prefer to change my course and keep enjoying g my day.

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jdfoils said..

....

A white light at the top of the mast indicates that you are at anchor. Probably not the best choice for when you are sailing.

The boaters I'm dealing with don't even know the basic right of way rules even with other powerboats. Not worried about confusing them with a strobe thinking I might be anchored.

My current thinking is trying two blinky bike lights on my boom tails. I'm not going to be ducking my 8.0 foil sail anyway.

Are you actually sailing at night/evening?

thats keen

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Paducah said..

kato said..
I don't think anything will work but if you want lights I used a strobe light on top of my mast and Ay-Up bike lights on my helmet for my night windsurfing. Just set the Strobe to on.

How did you the strobe?

I used a piece of PVC , heated and moulded to the mast top. Strobe was then bolted to the pipe. Had a cable tie to stop it flicking off

Avoidance is the best option, i.e. don't sail where there is a concentration of motor craft. If you do, then keep your head on a stick and assume all boats are driven by idiots and give them a wide berth.

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jdfoils said..

ptsf1111 said..
I like the idea of being more visible but using (strobe) lights is likely illegal as we're still a watercraft and have to adhere to the laws. We can probably only have navigation lights and one white light on top of the mast and potentially a white or yellow at the aft. Strobing is probably an emergency signal or very close to it so you might find a rescue vessel pull up alongside one day

For visibility when sailing with others, I found that a bright colour helmet (orange/yellow) makes a massive difference. You can have the brightest colour sail, but it won't help when you're in the water after a crash or something. The helmet would still be visible from quite some distance while the rig completely disappears in the lightest of chop and swell from a visibility perspective.

A white light at the top of the mast indicates that you are at anchor. Probably not the best choice for when you are sailing.

The white light is a really odd rule which seems to pop up again and again in various literature around the world - even though the rules should be fairly similar. I used to think it was a myth which stemmed from that small and slow motorboats are allowed to have a white toplatern at night but only if in an emergency - even though it is always people in dinghys going back to their yacht when they leave the habourpub... I always thought the rule was that you had to just carry a torch with you if you are a small sailing vessel but A LOT of literature does show a white latern either halfway up the mast or on the hull if <7m.

edit: ok i just had a look. this is in german but international rules 1972 so will be same for aus:
It says that you "must, if possible" carry the correct position lights. It then gives you the alternative which is either a latern or a light "at hand" and "present if necessary to prevent a collision".

So I presume that's where the white top latern thing comes from. Interestingly the wording uses the german colloqualism that it needs t obe "held at hand" which could either mean that it's mounted on the boat "readily to be shown" or that it has to be in your hand. Bit unclear - i read this as that you need to hold it in your hand rather than i.e. attach a light on the mast or on the boom etc.

Also interesting that in german lantern usually refers to a 360 light but in those rules latern specifically says "a latern (manually) lit on fire or an electric light".

Obey the water rules
Report offenders straight away
look before jibing
Don`t sail at night , so forget about port , starboard and centered white light . you can only do 7knts anyway .
I don`t know , what else ..... just use some common sense probably wouldn`t hurt either .

I only sailed at night chasing distance records and the mast top light was just to give me a faint light to see the board. It was useful for the crew to gauge where I was too. Not sure about only doing 7kts , I think my peak speed might be mid 30s..maybe

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Yawning said..
Obey the water rules
Report offenders straight away
look before jibing
Don`t sail at night , so forget about port , starboard and centered white light . you can only do 7knts anyway .
I don`t know , what else ..... just use some common sense probably wouldn`t hurt either .

It's fairly common to sail at dusk in some countries in winter. It's just not really avoidable in winter when you do not have much daylight to start with. It's pretty easy to say that when the earliest the sun sets is 1700 here in Aus.

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Kit3kat said..

Yawning said..
Obey the water rules
Report offenders straight away
look before jibing
Don`t sail at night , so forget about port , starboard and centered white light . you can only do 7knts anyway .
I don`t know , what else ..... just use some common sense probably wouldn`t hurt either .

It's fairly common to sail at dusk in some countries in winter. It's just not really avoidable in winter when you do not have much daylight to start with. It's pretty easy to say that when the earliest the sun sets is 1700 here in Aus.

Well put your navigations lights on and keep under 7 knots then .
The Law is there for a reason ..... safety .
Your choice to break the law .
I didn`t make the law so I`m not sure why you are not voicing your concerns to the legislators instead of me .
If everyone followed the water rules then there wouldn`t be a problem .

You were asking for advice not me , I was just giving you a starting point , you know , trying to help .

I sail near a harbour in the uk although it's not very busy apart from the peak summer. I do own a small handheld radio for when I'm on my rib as a safety precaution. Never used it but I could easily take it windsurfing if I needed to radio other boat users.

Reading the 10cm high registration number on the bow as the boat speeds away at 50 kph. If it were only that easy.
Also, this is the only open body of water within two hours in a metro area of 5m people. Not everyone lives a short distance from the beach.
As to the regs, imho, it's similar to cycling which in places say one can't cycle on the sidewalk. If my choice is the sidewalk vs the busy and congested 4-6 lane road with 70 kph traffic, guess which I'm choosing.