Hello guys!

I have been following this amazing forum for a while - thanks a lot for the enormous source of information!
Just a short introdution: I am generation 1967, from tiny Croatia, windsurfing on fin for almost 40 years (with many forced long-time breaks in between) and recently decided to join the foil community, mainly to be able to get on the board in lighter winds.

Due to my limited budget, I reinforced the finbox on my formula board and bought a 2nd hand Starboard GT foil.
- the "old" one: 75 cm aluminium mast, 75 cm fuselage, 800 front wing, 330 stab.
After some research, I thought it might be easier to learn on adapted gear: I have found a discounted 1100 Starboard Freeride front wing and a 95+ fuselage and I used this instead of the "original" fuse and front wing.

My first two sessions went surprisingly well, therefore I felt very confident for the third one.
(spoiler: overconfidence is a bitch!)
After 3 or 4 30m flights the wind picked up a little bit and I had a very nice lift off, gained some serious speed (well, at least it felt like that for me!) ... flying above the water like that - now I know why so many foilers have this expression when coming back to the shore!
So, flying above the water for a mile (I had lost the feeling for time and space - accurately it might have been 150m) I experienced the most sudden catapult in my entire "career"!

First thought: check the nose!
Due to the surfbent and additonal nose protector there is no damage on the board.
The surfbend is bent in a bit (unfortunately, as I am new to the forum, I can't post a picture - if there is any interess, I can do that later, once I am allowed!)
My boom survived too, only the attachmet rope (which fixes around the mast) has been ripped off!

BUT ... the board was turned upside down and it took me a couple of seconds to realize, that there is something not as it should be!
The 95+ fuselage (with attached 1100 front wing and 330 back wing) has been swallowed by the Adriatic Sea!

I went there with my SUP-board to try to see if I could find something, but no chance!
Although our sea quality and visibility is exceptional, the depth at the presumed location is 30-50 m and the bottom is fully coverd with vegetation.

Again, as I am new here I can't post a picture of the mast, but corrosion is to blame for my mishap.
Due to my lack of experience with (alu-)masts, I did not check under the plastic cover - maybe the loss could be prevented.

Now my question:
Would a tether around the fuselage work?
I know some guys use a thether around the mast to avoid losing the complete foil...
but how would a thether attached to the fuselage affect the waterflow and flight stability?

Greetings from the Croatian coast.
eightbft

PS: why eightbft? Because I am a big buy (not to say "fat") and I need force 8 to get me planing easily ;-)

PPS: The next PWA event will be in Bol, Island of Brac (say brah- (like in wonderBRA) -tch (like in DeuTSCHland), Croatia from Jun02 to Jun07, - probably the very big names will skip it, but last year it has been one of the very rare PWA events.
Google "Bol - Croatia - PWA Slalom Highlights - 2020"
(sorry, can't post a link ... you know, new member...)

**** you lost your plane...

I dont think a fuselage thether will work well. Ofcourse you can try (can never hurt right?), I would in that case put the thether on the fuselage behind the mast somewhere and tension it thight so theres as little flutter as possible.

I doubt it will work well though because even the tiniest strands of seaweed have huge impact on foil performance.

On the other hand, moths have a wire running down the front to adjust the foil in flight, if you tension it thight inough and use 1mm dynema you might actually be just fine, especially if its behind the mast, because it doesnt really interfere with much of the foil there.

Thanks a lot for your advice WhiteofHeart.

As I am still at "B" of my Beginner Lvel I very probably won't sense much of a difference,
but I will give it a try once I receive my new foil...

Hi eightbft,

bunmer about your foil but glad you are having fun.

the starboard fuselage attaches to the mast via three screws that go under the fuselage and two screws that go through the fuselage and mast. Did you have those bolts? I cannot imagine those two bolts were sheared off or that the mast holes were also sheared. Is your mast intact? Any left bolts? Curious about it.

Hi WillyWind,

i appreciate your compassion!

Yes, I still do have the mast - I wanted to post a picture, but as a rookie member of the forum I am not allowed yet!
Both horizontal bolts were ripped off and there is a gap (or two gaps) from the bolt position towards the mast bottom (the part which is inserted into the fuselage).
Two vertical screws are missing - the threads are sheared from corrosion. Corrosion has litteraly eaten the threads!
The third bolt is still in, but broken in half.
Only the mast has been 2nd hand (used), the fuselage and the bolts were brand new (ok, third session, maybe 2 hours in seawater).
The bolts I used were the original ones which came with the 95+ fuse, not the ones from the "old" 75cm fuseelage.
Before assembling, I treated all bolts with marine anti-seize lubricant.

I don't know if it is allowed by the forum rules, but if I could PM a picture of my mast to somebody who would post it here on my behalf?

eightfbt sent me the pic:

Looks pretty corroded.

@WillWind Thanks a lot for helping out!

@LeeD Yes, definitely!
Unfortunatley everything was covered by a plastic piece - I did not realize it is this bad!

Lesson learned!
The wallet way!

I have tried to google if someone else experienced a fuselage loss before - apparently I am the first one!

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eightbft said..
@WillWind Thanks a lot for helping out!

@LeeD Yes, definitely!
Unfortunatley everything was covered by a plastic piece - I did not realize it is this bad!

Lesson learned!
The wallet way!

I have tried to google if someone else experienced a fuselage loss before - apparently I am the first one!

I lost a fuselage before, was due to using too short schrews to attach the fuse to the mast. Not with SB though..

I hope you're also getting a new mast?? This one does not look usable anymore.

WOW! Just WOW!

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WhiteofHeart said..

eightbft said..
@WillWind Thanks a lot for helping out!

@LeeD Yes, definitely!
Unfortunatley everything was covered by a plastic piece - I did not realize it is this bad!

Lesson learned!
The wallet way!

I have tried to google if someone else experienced a fuselage loss before - apparently I am the first one!

I lost a fuselage before, was due to using too short schrews to attach the fuse to the mast. Not with SB though..

I hope you're also getting a new mast?? This one does not look usable anymore.

Ok, so I am not the first one...
and probably not the last, but I hope my mishap will help prevent the same thing happen to others!

Check your aluminium masts for corrosion, people!!!

The only thing I could do with this mast is to put it into a picture frame and hang it onto a wall!

Yes! definitely getting a complete new set!
What is left is the 800 front wing and the 75 fuselage (which I will inspect for corrosion very, very thoroughly!)
I may use the 800 fw later in my progression.
Fellow forum members, from that you can see I don't miss self confidence!

The GT mast was supposed to be used during my Phase 1 of windfoiling, later I planned to pass on a carbon mast, because I have learned from many sources +100kgs pilots put a lot of stress on (aluminium-)masts and fuselages!

Yes a wire tether from the fuse will work just fine, a local guy in Dallas has one on his Slingshot fuse after losing a Naish foil.

Makes no difference to the performance, but you can hear it hum when he is flying on it..

AFS foils, 100% solid carbon mast (as of 2020), solid carbon fuselage, solid carbon wings. 100% use in salt water for 2 years with plenty of hard impacts, and still looks like new, screws and anchors all clean with no corrosion. I knew corrosion was going to be an issue with an aluminum foil, and there are only a few brands offering all carbon foils for wind surfing. Yes, it is more expensive at the beginning, but you could of got an all carbon foil for the price of your first foil and now second replacement foil.

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CoreAS said..
Yes a wire tether from the fuse will work just fine, a local guy in Dallas has one on his Slingshot fuse after losing a Naish foil.

Makes no difference to the performance, but you can hear it hum when he is flying on it..

two 1/8" wide strands of seaweed wrapped around the fuselage/stabilizer junction messed up my foil, very noticeable, have heard the same for one strand of seaweed wrapped around the mast at the fuselage junction.

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Sandman1221 said..
AFS foils, 100% solid carbon mast (as of 2020), solid carbon fuselage, solid carbon wings. 100% use in salt water for 2 years with plenty of hard impacts, and still looks like new, screws and anchors all clean with no corrosion. I knew corrosion was going to be an issue with an aluminum foil, and there are only a few brands offering all carbon foils for wind surfing. Yes, it is more expensive at the beginning, but you could of got an all carbon foil for the price of your first foil and now second replacement foil.

I do agree 100% Sandman1221!
My plan was to use the aluminum mast during this summer and switch to a carbon mast during fall.
I bought the GT set 2nd hand and intended to use the front wing and stab later too.
The modular system which Starboard offers was very attractive and SB is the brand which locally has the almost exclusive monopol.
Slingshot -just to mention an example- is impossible to get, not to speak about AFS foils you mentioned.
Ok, buying via internet is always an option...
But the pandamic and Brexit made everything much more comolicated and difficult!

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Sandman1221 said..

CoreAS said..
Yes a wire tether from the fuse will work just fine, a local guy in Dallas has one on his Slingshot fuse after losing a Naish foil.

Makes no difference to the performance, but you can hear it hum when he is flying on it..

two 1/8" wide strands of seaweed wrapped around the fuselage/stabilizer junction messed up my foil, very noticeable, have heard the same for one strand of seaweed wrapped around the mast at the fuselage junction.

Lukily seaweed is not an issue here in the Adriatic ... plastic bags might have the same negative effect, but since they are not free of charge anymore (I really can see the difference looking back a couple of years) and they will be banned completely very soon!
Which IMHO is an absolute overdue decission!

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CoreAS said..
Yes a wire tether from the fuse will work just fine, a local guy in Dallas has one on his Slingshot fuse after losing a Naish foil.

Makes no difference to the performance, but you can hear it hum when he is flying on it..

Thanks for the info CoreAS!

Do you know how and where he fixed that wire?
I presume close to the mast, not near the stab, or?

I guess a wire would be more suitable than a rope?

A general lesson learned when using aluminum components in saltwater. You MUST disassemble, rinse with fresh water, and grease the fittings FREQUENTLY. The photo above is shocking.

Believe it or not, this also applies for carbon since there are metal fittings. Yes, you can have electrochemical voltage couples between metal and carbon, which will corrode the metal. This is really bad for aluminum, but not much problem for stainless steel and titanium. The Boeing 787, which is an all-carbon airplane, has no aluminum anywhere for exactly this reason. All the fittings are titanium.

Divide all this by 100 for fresh water. Almost a non-problem for fresh water. I still disassemble and grease, but not as frequently.

Hey eightbft, you can order AFS foils through their website with worldwide shipping, (complete foil shipping is 120 euros to US, should be cheaper to you), they use DHL which is good.

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segler said..
A general lesson learned when using aluminum components in saltwater. You MUST disassemble, rinse with fresh water, and grease the fittings FREQUENTLY. The photo above is shocking.

Believe it or not, this also applies for carbon since there are metal fittings. Yes, you can have electrochemical voltage couples between metal and carbon, which will corrode the metal. This is really bad for aluminum, but not much problem for stainless steel and titanium. The Boeing 787, which is an all-carbon airplane, has no aluminum anywhere for exactly this reason. All the fittings are titanium.

Divide all this by 100 for fresh water. Almost a non-problem for fresh water. I still disassemble and grease, but not as frequently.

Very useful informatin, thank you segler!!

As I mentioned before, I bought this set used ...
and had no clue how used it has been!
Lack of experience, but I will surely pay attention in the future with my new equipment!

With my normal windsurf stuff, I did not disassemble everything everytime, but am using lubricants on srews and bolts (motorcycle chain oil)!

Foil gear seems to be very demanding regarding aftercare... noticed!

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Sandman1221 said..
Hey eightbft, you can order AFS foils through their website with worldwide shipping, (complete foil shipping is 120 euros to US, should be cheaper to you), they use DHL which is good.

I had a look at their website already, Sandman1221!
Looks pretty awesome!
Wish I would have heard of AFS foils earlier...
but my replacement foil (SB Freeride Plus) is scheduled for delivery tomorrow.

Might immerse the mast and fuselage threads in grease overnight!

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eightbft said..

CoreAS said..
Yes a wire tether from the fuse will work just fine, a local guy in Dallas has one on his Slingshot fuse after losing a Naish foil.

Makes no difference to the performance, but you can hear it hum when he is flying on it..

Thanks for the info CoreAS!

Do you know how and where he fixed that wire?
I presume close to the mast, not near the stab, or?

I guess a wire would be more suitable than a rope?

I recently moved from Texas to Florida so I had to text him for the info...He recently changed from wire to cord because it was scratching up the board.

He uses a slingshot foil so there are holes in the fuse from different wing mount positions, then runs the cord up to the back straps and ties it off. I know he has done this for quite a while now as he lost a 2018 Naish foil and it was a long way out.

I lost a Slingshot fuse & foils when the bolts sheared. I now use a 60 kg fishing trace through the back of the mast & around the fuselage. I also have a thin rope line around the top of the mast up to a rear footstrap. I'm not worried about drag as am no racer. They don't make any noise.

@CoreAS
@grewho

Wow, guys! Many, many thanks for your contribution!

Drilling holes into new equipment ... my knees are already feeling weak!
But these solutions look really neat!

I am no racer neither, so drag isn't an issue for me!

Hi. A lot of the AL masts have a hole the right way through. .
Perhaps pass the fishing line all the way from top to bottom, maybe along the centre hole.
The hard part is how to attach at either end.
I'll leave that to someone who has one to play with.

Bol would be an awesome foiling spot! Croatia is awesome!

Understandably you're worried about loosing another foil, but a tether is a band-aid solution; literally.
The most reliable way to keep the foil from coming off is via preventative maintenance:
- Check the aluminium parts for corrosion regularly. That will require periodic, full disassembly. I do it once every couple of months.
- Fresh water rinse after every session.
- Make sure you're using A4-70 (316) grade fasteners. Marine grade anti-seize. Replace every year. Torque correctly for each session.

Great to hear that you're stoked on foiling!

@berowne
@nikita

I am very grateful for your support and good advice!!
Thanks a lot!

Offtopic: yesterday it was day one in Bol:
enough wind, so guys & girls did all emininations on fin.
Today the wind forecast is even better...
Unfortunatey there is no live stream, but as per PWA website, there will be summary videos every morning after (GMT +2).

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Nikita said..
Bol would be an awesome foiling spot! Croatia is awesome!

Understandably you're worried about loosing another foil, but a tether is a band-aid solution; literally.
The most reliable way to keep the foil from coming off is via preventative maintenance:
- Check the aluminium parts for corrosion regularly. That will require periodic, full disassembly. I do it once every couple of months.
- Fresh water rinse after every session.
- Make sure you're using A4-70 (316) grade fasteners. Marine grade anti-seize. Replace every year. Torque correctly for each session.

Great to hear that you're stoked on foiling!

Yes, this!

Now that I have moved from fresh water location back to ocean the need to strip down, clean and refresh with anti-seize is essential.

Also I read a lot of foilers stripping bolts, that's over tightening of the bolts etc.