Hi all,

I'm getting used to and stoked about riding a Slingshot Wizard 90L freestyle board with the Slingshot 103W Package (PFI 730 and Stab PS 400).

To be honest, it took me some time to get used to the tiny board and, most of all, to find the right trim - mainly positioning the foil and the mast base. Now, I still change it a bit but am really getting the hang of it.

And it is a very good experience.

The foil, the PFI 730, is rock solid to my taste, maybe even a bit too solid. So, I thought I could make it a bit more playful and faster with the smaller stab, the PS 325.
Do you have any experience with that?

I am a solid windsurf foiler, light weight 70kg, doing steady foil gybes, some jumps, downwind turns, and some 360s. I mainly use 5.1 and 4.0 sails.

I have limited experience on Slingshot foils but spent some time on them on holiday. The 325 maybe a little loose. Maybe rhe PS340 would be a better fit. Compared to the 400 it was more reactive but yaw was not as dramatic as the 325. Was on the PFI684, freestyle 87 in 20+.
Or get both

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Mr Keen said..
I have limited experience on Slingshot foils but spent some time on them on holiday. The 325 maybe a little loose. Maybe rhe PS340 would be a better fit. Compared to the 400 it was more reactive but yaw was not as dramatic as the 325. Was on the PFI684, freestyle 87 in 20+.
Or get both

Oh, thanks! I did not even know that there is a PS340! Being too loose and unstable is my greatest concern for the 325. Will I also loose lift with little wind, will I start to foil much later?

I can't really answer for the 325, but didn't notice much difference between the 400 and 340.
I use Sabfoil and went from the 430 stab to the 399 and added 2 degree shim and find no difference in lift.
The main difference for me is a loose controllable smaller stab is quicker, more control in rough water as small adjustments in pitch and direction come easier.
A mate went from the PS400 to PS340 and enjoys it alot.
I would definitely get a smaller stab if you want your set-up to be more playful.

I went from the 400 to the 340. I mainly use PTM 899 and 926 front foils. The. 340 is looser but not uncontrollably so. Your legs will be sore after your first session as you need to work harder on pitch control, but muscle memory soon kicks in and you don't notice after a few sessions. I had to move my foil mast slightly forward to counter the reduction in lift. I also shim my stab to further reduce lift and increase speed.

I tried the 340 with the Sab 796 Medusa. quite pitchy in gusty winds, but you will get used to it after a few rides. Moved my mast 1cm further forward. Depends on what you like. Locked in, or slippery and loose. I actually went back to the 400 with a 1.5 degree shim for less lift. That setup with the 796 has been what I like most. Locked in Yaw, carves great. 23 knot speeds. What I didn't expect was how much the 400 rear wing improves stall speed over the 340 with the 700cm front wing.

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WsurfAustin said..
I actually went back to the 400 with a 1.5 degree shim for less lift.

Do you know the final angle of the stab?

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BullroarerTook said..

WsurfAustin said..
I actually went back to the 400 with a 1.5 degree shim for less lift.

Do you know the final angle of the stab?

According to a Slingshot video, the default "angle of attack" is 3 degrees, so I would be at 1.5 degrees with the selected shim.

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John340 said..
I went from the 400 to the 340. I mainly use PTM 899 and 926 front foils. The. 340 is looser but not uncontrollably so. Your legs will be sore after your first session as you need to work harder on pitch control, but muscle memory soon kicks in and you don't notice after a few sessions. I had to move my foil mast slightly forward to counter the reduction in lift. I also shim my stab to further reduce lift and increase speed.

By the way: The PTM 899 also sounds very interesting. It might be hard to compare, but what do you think: PTM 899 in comparison to the PFI 730?

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Freetz said..

John340 said..
I went from the 400 to the 340. I mainly use PTM 899 and 926 front foils. The. 340 is looser but not uncontrollably so. Your legs will be sore after your first session as you need to work harder on pitch control, but muscle memory soon kicks in and you don't notice after a few sessions. I had to move my foil mast slightly forward to counter the reduction in lift. I also shim my stab to further reduce lift and increase speed.

By the way: The PTM 899 also sounds very interesting. It might be hard to compare, but what do you think: PTM 899 in comparison to the PFI 730?

I have not foiled the pfi 730 so can't directly compare. The 730 has a great reputation.

I really like the 899, it's my go to foil in anything over 12 kts. I particularly like the glide, pointing ability, speed and carve.

A short update from my side: I contacted Slingshot and they would not recommend PS325 for windsurf foiling. So it is remaining the 340 or 360 (V-Tail) stabs: I tend for the 340 as I would like more speed, more pitch and roll, but not too much yaw ... but have not decided yet.

I am very happy with 325 + ptm1001. It makes the wide wing easier to turn, and probably faster.

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Freetz said..
A short update from my side: I contacted Slingshot and they would not recommend PS325 for windsurf foiling. So it is remaining the 340 or 360 (V-Tail) stabs: I tend for the 340 as I would like more speed, more pitch and roll, but not too much yaw ... but have not decided yet.

I like the 360 vee tail but I ride it with the ptm 926, haven't tried the smaller tails. It made a big difference in control with riding swells

I have tested all 4 rear wings for wind foil (and I made a video review but that was for winging).

my weight right now 188-190lbs.

PS400 - I use in the light winds 8-13mph because of the surface area it gives you the lift to get up and out the water, at those wind speeds nothing to radical is happening so the 400 is a great allrounder.

PS360 - You give up a little bit of earlier lift, but you do not lose any pitch stability and it will make any front wing carve super well, once you use the 360, I doubt you'll ever go back to the 400.

PS340 - For my weight I wouldn't use unless the wind is a steady 15+ mph, its slippery quick, turns well and has the best glide out of all the rear wings.

PS325 - My least favorite rear wing and again that's probably because of my weight, it will make your foil livelier, you will turn fast but if you go into transitions half assed it will drop on you like a stone, it can get pitchy as well. It took more aggressive pumping technique.

I generally pair the PS360 with the G-series front wings and the PS340 with the PTM front wings

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CoreAS said..
I have tested all 4 rear wings for wind foil (and I made a video review but that was for winging).

my weight right now 188-190lbs.

PS400 - I use in the light winds 8-13mph because of the surface area it gives you the lift to get up and out the water, at those wind speeds nothing to radical is happening so the 400 is a great allrounder.

PS360 - You give up a little bit of earlier lift, but you do not lose any pitch stability and it will make any front wing carve super well, once you use the 360, I doubt you'll ever go back to the 400.

PS340 - For my weight I wouldn't use unless the wind is a steady 15+ mph, its slippery quick, turns well and has the best glide out of all the rear wings.

PS325 - My least favorite rear wing and again that's probably because of my weight, it will make your foil livelier, you will turn fast but if you go into transitions half assed it will drop on you like a stone, it can get pitchy as well. It took more aggressive pumping technique.

I generally pair the PS360 with the G-series front wings and the PS340 with the PTM front wings

Thanks Dean,
I think the 360 will be next on my list. The jump from the 400 to the 340 was a bit of a leap. I got used to it and had many sessions on it, but I missed the hard turning ability of the 400. Sounds like the 360 could be the ticket.

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WsurfAustin said..

CoreAS said..
I have tested all 4 rear wings for wind foil (and I made a video review but that was for winging).

my weight right now 188-190lbs.

PS400 - I use in the light winds 8-13mph because of the surface area it gives you the lift to get up and out the water, at those wind speeds nothing to radical is happening so the 400 is a great allrounder.

PS360 - You give up a little bit of earlier lift, but you do not lose any pitch stability and it will make any front wing carve super well, once you use the 360, I doubt you'll ever go back to the 400.

PS340 - For my weight I wouldn't use unless the wind is a steady 15+ mph, its slippery quick, turns well and has the best glide out of all the rear wings.

PS325 - My least favorite rear wing and again that's probably because of my weight, it will make your foil livelier, you will turn fast but if you go into transitions half assed it will drop on you like a stone, it can get pitchy as well. It took more aggressive pumping technique.

I generally pair the PS360 with the G-series front wings and the PS340 with the PTM front wings

Thanks Dean,
I think the 360 will be next on my list. The jump from the 400 to the 340 was a bit of a leap. I got used to it and had many sessions on it, but I missed the hard turning ability of the 400. Sounds like the 360 could be the ticket.

Hey Matt,

The PS360 is perfect for hard carving, you can really push it without fear of a foil out. I don't like short fuses or pitchy foils for wind foil
so, the V shape of the rear wing creates a smooth, consistent feel but will bank over hard when you want it too.

Here also some feedback I got from 360-Wizard Greg Glazier: "I have always used the 400 and never used the 325 or 340 I cannot directly give my personal opinion on them. I find the 400 in combination with the PFI 730 fast enough if you push it to go faster and I can turn and maneuver very tight and quickly by leaning very hard and throwing my weight around."

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CoreAS said..

WsurfAustin said..

CoreAS said..
I have tested all 4 rear wings for wind foil (and I made a video review but that was for winging).

my weight right now 188-190lbs.

PS400 - I use in the light winds 8-13mph because of the surface area it gives you the lift to get up and out the water, at those wind speeds nothing to radical is happening so the 400 is a great allrounder.

PS360 - You give up a little bit of earlier lift, but you do not lose any pitch stability and it will make any front wing carve super well, once you use the 360, I doubt you'll ever go back to the 400.

PS340 - For my weight I wouldn't use unless the wind is a steady 15+ mph, its slippery quick, turns well and has the best glide out of all the rear wings.

PS325 - My least favorite rear wing and again that's probably because of my weight, it will make your foil livelier, you will turn fast but if you go into transitions half assed it will drop on you like a stone, it can get pitchy as well. It took more aggressive pumping technique.

I generally pair the PS360 with the G-series front wings and the PS340 with the PTM front wings

Thanks Dean,
I think the 360 will be next on my list. The jump from the 400 to the 340 was a bit of a leap. I got used to it and had many sessions on it, but I missed the hard turning ability of the 400. Sounds like the 360 could be the ticket.

Hey Matt,

The PS360 is perfect for hard carving, you can really push it without fear of a foil out. I don't like short fuses or pitchy foils for wind foil
so, the V shape of the rear wing creates a smooth, consistent feel but will bank over hard when you want it too.

Thanks, sounds like what I'm looking for.

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Freetz said..
Here also some feedback I got from 360-Wizard Greg Glazier: "I have always used the 400 and never used the 325 or 340 I cannot directly give my personal opinion on them. I find the 400 in combination with the PFI 730 fast enough if you push it to go faster and I can turn and maneuver very tight and quickly by leaning very hard and throwing my weight around."

Ya, it's amazing how hard he can push the 730/400 and it's a great combo. He has the strength and skills I don't. 21 knots is the max I can push it in any wind. I was looking for a rear wing for the Sab 796 which is 1/2 the surface area of the 730. The 340 is fine for larger radius jibes, but tilt the board over and press hard on the back foot and it's easy to blow it out.
The 400 tail with a 1.5 degree shim is what I'm using with the 796 and has been a blast got me up to 23 knots. I do like experimenting though, so the 360 will be the next thing to try. It's more a high speed carving setup though. The 730/400 can turn on a dime at any speed and has huge range .

Select to expand quote

CoreAS said..

WsurfAustin said..

CoreAS said..
I have tested all 4 rear wings for wind foil (and I made a video review but that was for winging).

my weight right now 188-190lbs.

PS400 - I use in the light winds 8-13mph because of the surface area it gives you the lift to get up and out the water, at those wind speeds nothing to radical is happening so the 400 is a great allrounder.

PS360 - You give up a little bit of earlier lift, but you do not lose any pitch stability and it will make any front wing carve super well, once you use the 360, I doubt you'll ever go back to the 400.

PS340 - For my weight I wouldn't use unless the wind is a steady 15+ mph, its slippery quick, turns well and has the best glide out of all the rear wings.

PS325 - My least favorite rear wing and again that's probably because of my weight, it will make your foil livelier, you will turn fast but if you go into transitions half assed it will drop on you like a stone, it can get pitchy as well. It took more aggressive pumping technique.

I generally pair the PS360 with the G-series front wings and the PS340 with the PTM front wings

Thanks Dean,
I think the 360 will be next on my list. The jump from the 400 to the 340 was a bit of a leap. I got used to it and had many sessions on it, but I missed the hard turning ability of the 400. Sounds like the 360 could be the ticket.

Hey Matt,

The PS360 is perfect for hard carving, you can really push it without fear of a foil out. I don't like short fuses or pitchy foils for wind foil
so, the V shape of the rear wing creates a smooth, consistent feel but will bank over hard when you want it too.

Confirmed Dean.
Rode the 360 today. Fast, stable and turns really well. No shim required. Sings loudly below 10 knots, but goes quiet when the speeds increase. My other wings have been the opposite. The G800 was very loud before I sanded the trailing edge to 30 degrees (60 degree included angle). Took care of the noise. I'll sand the 360 a tad. This is a great combo in winds >18 knots.

Select to expand quote

WsurfAustin said..

CoreAS said..

WsurfAustin said..

CoreAS said..
I have tested all 4 rear wings for wind foil (and I made a video review but that was for winging).

my weight right now 188-190lbs.

PS400 - I use in the light winds 8-13mph because of the surface area it gives you the lift to get up and out the water, at those wind speeds nothing to radical is happening so the 400 is a great allrounder.

PS360 - You give up a little bit of earlier lift, but you do not lose any pitch stability and it will make any front wing carve super well, once you use the 360, I doubt you'll ever go back to the 400.

PS340 - For my weight I wouldn't use unless the wind is a steady 15+ mph, its slippery quick, turns well and has the best glide out of all the rear wings.

PS325 - My least favorite rear wing and again that's probably because of my weight, it will make your foil livelier, you will turn fast but if you go into transitions half assed it will drop on you like a stone, it can get pitchy as well. It took more aggressive pumping technique.

I generally pair the PS360 with the G-series front wings and the PS340 with the PTM front wings

Thanks Dean,
I think the 360 will be next on my list. The jump from the 400 to the 340 was a bit of a leap. I got used to it and had many sessions on it, but I missed the hard turning ability of the 400. Sounds like the 360 could be the ticket.

Hey Matt,

The PS360 is perfect for hard carving, you can really push it without fear of a foil out. I don't like short fuses or pitchy foils for wind foil
so, the V shape of the rear wing creates a smooth, consistent feel but will bank over hard when you want it too.

Confirmed Dean.
Rode the 360 today. Fast, stable and turns really well. No shim required. Sings loudly below 10 knots, but goes quiet when the speeds increase. My other wings have been the opposite. The G800 was very loud before I sanded the trailing edge to 30 degrees (60 degree included angle). Took care of the noise. I'll sand the 360 a tad. This is a great combo in winds >18 knots.

Hey Matt

Sounds like its working for you

What's the surface area and AR of the SAB front wing? looks quick

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CoreAS said..

WsurfAustin said..

CoreAS said..

WsurfAustin said..

CoreAS said..
I have tested all 4 rear wings for wind foil (and I made a video review but that was for winging).

my weight right now 188-190lbs.

PS400 - I use in the light winds 8-13mph because of the surface area it gives you the lift to get up and out the water, at those wind speeds nothing to radical is happening so the 400 is a great allrounder.

PS360 - You give up a little bit of earlier lift, but you do not lose any pitch stability and it will make any front wing carve super well, once you use the 360, I doubt you'll ever go back to the 400.

PS340 - For my weight I wouldn't use unless the wind is a steady 15+ mph, its slippery quick, turns well and has the best glide out of all the rear wings.

PS325 - My least favorite rear wing and again that's probably because of my weight, it will make your foil livelier, you will turn fast but if you go into transitions half assed it will drop on you like a stone, it can get pitchy as well. It took more aggressive pumping technique.

I generally pair the PS360 with the G-series front wings and the PS340 with the PTM front wings

Thanks Dean,
I think the 360 will be next on my list. The jump from the 400 to the 340 was a bit of a leap. I got used to it and had many sessions on it, but I missed the hard turning ability of the 400. Sounds like the 360 could be the ticket.

Hey Matt,

The PS360 is perfect for hard carving, you can really push it without fear of a foil out. I don't like short fuses or pitchy foils for wind foil
so, the V shape of the rear wing creates a smooth, consistent feel but will bank over hard when you want it too.

Confirmed Dean.
Rode the 360 today. Fast, stable and turns really well. No shim required. Sings loudly below 10 knots, but goes quiet when the speeds increase. My other wings have been the opposite. The G800 was very loud before I sanded the trailing edge to 30 degrees (60 degree included angle). Took care of the noise. I'll sand the 360 a tad. This is a great combo in winds >18 knots.

Hey Matt

Sounds like its working for you

What's the surface area and AR of the SAB front wing? looks quick

Medusa 769, 700 cm'2, AR 8.44.

It's slides up to speed pretty quickly. My typical max speed is 23 knots with my 3.7 wave sail. So only 2 knots faster the the 730 in the same conditions despite being 1/2 the surface area of the 730PFI. Handles and carves beautifully at high speed. The tail males a huge difference is take off and stall speed. The PS400 with a 1.5 deg shim makes takeoff and stall speed great albeit a little draggy compared to the 360. But it's also stable as a sidewalk. The 360 seems a great compromise, need to get more time on it.

I finally bought the PS360 V-Tail and my experience is:It largely depends on the front wing thus on the combination of front wing and stabilizer.PS360 plus PTM926: a game changer, faster, more agile, more fun, perfect match (compared to PS 400 stab)PS 360 plus PFI730: more nervous, more free, a bit faster but overall PFI730 and PS400 seems a perfect match;

My favorite after using for long long time the ptm730 with the 125l wizzard (optimized custom board) is:
i'm foiling quite every second day in spain, often >30kt.for sails 4.7m - 5.6m: balz medusa pro 909 + ps400. ps360 was too nervous.
for sails 2.8m - 4.2m: g800 + ps400.balz medusa pro 909 vs Sab 796 Medusa:
quite similar. same topspeed, agil, but comes up earlier. and more forgiving

Do you mean the PTM 730 (665 cm2) or PFI 730 (1437 cm2)? If you mean the small HA wing PTM 730, why are you no longer using it?
I just bought that front wing to pair it with my SS Freestyle 87 L board.

Where in Spain do you live to have such strong winds? Is it Tarifa?

Ptm730 has quite low stability in roll, especially if you slow down. Run it wide open and it can be lots of fun...Definitely not a beginner foil.

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Erasmus said..
I am very happy with 325 + ptm1001. It makes the wide wing easier to turn, and probably faster.

Thanks Erasmus, I'll give this combo a go. What board were you using? I had a shocker with the 325 +730 LA Levi 150.

Got a 125,rake seem a bit different

I use the 125 in the same base position as the w103.

Thanks

How do you measure the rake?
Personally I find the long masts have to much drag in winds under 18 mph.
I ride the PTI 730/ SAB 430 with a SAB/ 115 mast
I can hold my ground with almost everyone on the water Foil or Fin.
I only ride in 18 mph or more off of Treasure Island in the middle of San Francisco Bay.