Until now we have tried windfoiling on on my supfoil rig with an old Simmer Mission 5.3

The rig was quite heavy in light winds esp for my wife and daughter.

We want to ride strapless, no harness, low to medium speed and in as light winds as possible...

Any recommendations for mast , boom and sail? Or perhaps a bigger foil?

Being supfoilers we would love to flag the sail a lot.

We windsurf for a long time and have a quiver of Simmer Icon and Mission sails and our booms and masts are not very light...

Naish Lift? Or should we just get e 5.3 blacktip with a light mast and boom, would be nice on our old school boards as well?

You don't need a bigger foil. The Large is perfect for that.

The Lift is light, but the boom is very long, so it doesn't feel light uphauling due to that long boom length. The 5.7 does have good power for light wind foiling.

Sounds like you have aluminum boom. Get carbon.

Also make sure your uphaul is new and long for easy uphauling. Not some short uphaul with extra knots because you hadn't used it in years

Your wife and daughter probably don't need a bigger foil but I would consider the NP XL when it comes out as you already are invested in the NP system. I'm also a SUP foiler and have gravitated to using big downwind foils and smaller sails. It just depends on your style. I also have the JP 7' and love it. Sounds like you are already leaning towards a WWF style...which means just using a little sail power to get up and then using the waves or chop to get the glides.

I second the notion of just getting a light sail, carbon boom rdm, and a light 400 mast for a 5.3 or 5.7. I use the new Ezzy Elites and the rig is so light. I agree with the previous comment that you might want a LIFT for really light days, but any of the super light wave sails work and will be smoother in the transitions. Once I'm up it makes it more comfortable to hold the rig off to the side or when your just one handing it. I only hook in the harness to relax going back up wind to do it all over again. ;)

You'll love strapless. I put the strap back on the other day and it just kept getting in my way. ;)

There's a little trick to the JP 7' to pump up on a plane. Very different then your traditional windsurf foil board which will have a flatter rocker line and more side force leverage. You really only need a 11 knot gust. Going w the chop, you keep the board flat and micro-pump, and I mean micro pump, then when you synch up with a piece of chop pump hard and up she comes. I also keep the track just forward of center as when I'm SUP'n. Works really well for strapless.

FYI. I'm 6'1" 185 lbs and my go to rig is the 5.3 Ezzy Elite for 10-15 knot days. If it's light, I sometimes put the 6.1 on. I use the Naish XXL most of the time and smaller foils if there's any significant waves. I just bought a 4.0 for 15-22 knot days. Hope this helps. Main thing is...w/ the JP 7' you really won't be able to go bigger than 6.1 before it gets out of balance.

In summary, on a SUP foil type board, go big on foil, light and small on rig. If you really want to punch the lower limits you'll need a more windsurf foil type board w a larger sail. Hope all this helps and isn't too confusing.

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Camarillo said..
Until now we have tried windfoiling on on my supfoil rig with an old Simmer Mission 5.3

The rig was quite heavy in light winds esp for my wife and daughter.

We want to ride strapless, no harness, low to medium speed and in as light winds as possible...

Any recommendations for mast , boom and sail? Or perhaps a bigger foil?

Being supfoilers we would love to flag the sail a lot.

We windsurf for a long time and have a quiver of Simmer Icon and Mission sails and our booms and masts are not very light...

Naish Lift? Or should we just get e 5.3 blacktip with a light mast and boom, would be nice on our old school boards as well?

Approx how big are the ladies (no need to mention if the answer isn't one they wouldn't want to share). A general reminder that a 5.3 in the hands of a 45 kg under 160 cm person is like a 9.5 to an average guy. I'm not familiar with the Mission. I know that some older wave and freestyle sails were pretty heavily built vs a newer sail.. Go as much carbon and rdm as you can afford, too. If they are happy, you are happy.

Also, miind that proper downhaul/outhaul also make the sail feel lighter.

On the Lifts, they are pretty powerful but not so rangy - for smaller riders, that might be a bigger concern.

See my post regarding the Hydra 8.5. If what you want to do is sail/foil in the lightest winds possible, you'll need a larger sail and a large front foil wing.

As for light, you should look into the Ezzy Hydra, with a carbon boom and RDM mast. All Hydra's use a much shorter mast than most sails their size. My Hydra 7.0 uses a 430 mast and I can also use a much shorter boom. The entire rig uphauls like a 5.0, but there is plenty of power once you get moving.

Another reason the Hydra is recommended is that it handles gusts very well and keeps the power very low in the sail. This is an excellent combination for beginning foilers.

my 2 cents.

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Camarillo said..
Until now we have tried windfoiling on on my supfoil rig with an old Simmer Mission 5.3

The rig was quite heavy in light winds esp for my wife and daughter.

We want to ride strapless, no harness, low to medium speed and in as light winds as possible...

Any recommendations for mast , boom and sail? Or perhaps a bigger foil?

Being supfoilers we would love to flag the sail a lot.

We windsurf for a long time and have a quiver of Simmer Icon and Mission sails and our booms and masts are not very light...

Naish Lift? Or should we just get e 5.3 blacktip with a light mast and boom, would be nice on our old school boards as well?

My recommendation would be to upgrade the rig, as having a really light weight rig is a real treat especially when foiling. Rig: 90-100% carbon mast (rdm) which compliments a light weight wave sail (4batten) or foil sail and carbon boom. The only challenge will be the upgrade price for premium gear.

Before you "upgrade", what is your current mast and boom?
Learning to foil requires crashes, and light gear doesn't always survive.
How much weight can you really save at what cost?

All 3 of us will benefit so why not spent some money!

We need another boom anyway what is the best lightest skinny or RDM boom available?

I think we will get a Simmer Blacktip 5.3, 2020 is just out...we can also use it on our normal waveboards.
And perhaps a Naish Lift 5.7 for low end.

Mast: Simmer 400 SX10 RDM (1,6 kg), only not sure if it will work with the Lift?

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Camarillo said..
All 3 of us will benefit so why not spent some money!

We need another boom anyway what is the best lightest skinny or RDM boom available?

I think we will get a Simmer Blacktip 5.3, 2020 is just out...we can also use it on our normal waveboards.
And perhaps a Naish Lift 5.7 for low end.

Mast: Simmer 400 SX10 RDM (1,6 kg), only not sure if it will work with the Lift?

I fell in love w my new Chinook RDM carbon. I was like.....where was this 30 years ago. ;) They've made some changes from previous years to some little things that would annoy me. Every time I go back to my regular carbon boom for larger sails I miss the rdm. The girls will love it.

Went out with a 4.7 Simmer Icon yesterday. Wind was 20 knots when I was rigging but dropped to 12 knots when I got out.
And 3 knots current same direction as the wind.
Walking back with the whole shabam is hard work!

When supfoiling I have the foil far to the front of the tracks and completely in front when the waves are very small.
How far back should I position the foil for windsurffoiling?
The further back the foil is the more is it pointing down , the JP 7'0 has quite a bit of rocker.....
I use a wedge when supfoiling to change the angle of attack of the foil.

Most JP 135 users go just forward of center, but they are using straps.
Strapless, maybe same?

Sorry, my mistake.
Thought you had JP 135, which is tuttle box.
Slingshot does allow switchfuse to change foil position

Because I am still not sure where I should put my NP Glide (L or M) foil in the tracks of my JP 7'0" board I ask again:

When sup foiling I have the foil far to the front of the tracks and completely in front when the waves are very small.
How far back should I position the foil for windsurf foiling?

All the way back?

The further I put the foil back , the more it is pointing down due to the rocker of the board.....

I use the board without straps and with Simmer Blacktips up to 6,0 m2

I windsurf foiled my JP Australia 7' once about 6 months ago (need to get out again) and think i had the NP foil L, mid way to slightly back of midway. I was using the standard NP surf fuselage. Are you using the surf fuselage or the windsurf fuselage on your NP foil? My preference on the foil position is to have sufficient amount of front foot pressure.

When sup foiling my JP7,0 I have the foil 3/4 forward (rear right screw over decal line) and have plenty of lift and allow my feet to be aligned nicely over the footstrap area (riding strapless). I have been using the Starboard Ocean 2000 foil which is a slightly bigger more high aspect wing (super stable). Im still at the early stage with 6 or 7 sup foiling sessions under the belt. Pumping the foil and feeling the board glide along after the wave has gone is a blast. Cant wait for the next session.

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Camarillo said..

The further I put the foil back , the more it is pointing down due to the rocker of the board.....

If you weren't already aware of this, you don't want the foil level with the bottom of the board - somewhere around 2 degrees is a good angle (link below suggests range of 1.5-2.5). This gives the board a bit of an upward tilt vs the foil which a) limits drag when subplaning and taking off (since the board will be tail down) and b) mitigates the "slap" factor when touching down while foiling. Of course, like all things, there is "too much" so you may already have enough angle.

Use Google or Google chrome to translate the French: marseille.glissattitude.com/blog/reglages-windfoil-le-rake.html

COE of front wing exactly centered between the straps is a good starting point.

Invest in the sail. I got Lift 6.4 and 5.7 and use my normal wave sails below those as its windy enough. The lifts are super light and really really good for early foiling. I use them on a 70 percent RDM mast which they set ok on. Ive invested in a carbon boom and extension because every little bit of weight makes a difference in the lightest of wind.
The biggest foil you can get is also a winner if you truly want to get going in light winds. You won't be fast but the silence is amazing and being slow you have more time to enjoy it.

Warning. After using the lifts you will feel that all your "Windsurf" sails will feel like you always want more wind when foiling. They just don't feel powerful enough compared to the lifts.

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IWB said..
I windsurf foiled my JP Australia 7' once about 6 months ago (need to get out again) and think i had the NP foil L, mid way to slightly back of midway. I was using the standard NP surf fuselage. Are you using the surf fuselage or the windsurf fuselage on your NP foil? My preference on the foil position is to have sufficient amount of front foot pressure.

When sup foiling my JP7,0 I have the foil 3/4 forward (rear right screw over decal line) and have plenty of lift and allow my feet to be aligned nicely over the footstrap area (riding strapless). I have been using the Starboard Ocean 2000 foil which is a slightly bigger more high aspect wing (super stable). Im still at the early stage with 6 or 7 sup foiling sessions under the belt. Pumping the foil and feeling the board glide along after the wave has gone is a blast. Cant wait for the next session.

I have the JP 7' as well and the Naish Foil system. For SUP foiling I'm like you and like the foil 3/4 of the way forward or a 1/4 of the way back. I've windsurfed the board with the SUP fuselage in the same position and it gets a little squirrley when pumping up on a plane...which makes sense as the position is approaching that of a keel vs a rudder. Other than that...once up its very loose and fun.

I get better performance though by using the Naish windsurf fuselage as it places the front wing 4-5 inches forward, which allows me to move the mast back to mid-point or 3/4 of the way back. The result is easier pumping the board up on a straight line w just a little loss of looseness.

It really hit me a few months ago when I left the SUP fuselage in and moved the mast back to windsurf position...I wasn't coming up as easy and it was harder to pump on a straight line without going in a circle. ;0 Switched to the windsurf fuselage and boom....up right away and pumping line was better. All these positions work great for the foot against the kick pad position.

My more advanced position is the mast 3/4 forward with windsurf fuselage. I'll use this when it's not a bottom end day and I'm really focusing on just riding chop and little swells. Then my front foot is right behind the mast base, rear foot 4-6 inches forward of kickpad and upright surfing stance.

Hope all this helps.