Whole bunch of new gear being announced...

F4 Foils have a new EU production facility and R mast - largely layup changes and improved bases.
www.f4foils.com/2022/09/07/the-new-2023-windsurfing-race-mast-is-here/

Phantom introduce a major update to our Racing foils - 5cm shorter and skinnier for Slalom.
www.phantom-windsurfing.com/

Z-Foils did OK at the Sylt PWA event! still showing 2022 model.
zfins.eu/windfoil/windfoil-pwa-slalom/

Starboard Evo foils from 2022... don't expect major changes this year!?
starboardfoils.com/pages/2022-wind-foils-overview

Loft Sails looking good. also SkySkape freefoil with nocams.
www.loftsails.com/windsurf-gear/sails/skyblade

Patrik sails offer some good solutions for dedicated foiling... and also a Slalom fin or Foil SF sail range which others might thing is too much of a compromise.
patrik-windsurf.com/race-sf/

Duotone being coy on race gear but also have a freefoil option with 2 or without cams.
www.duotonesports.com/windsurfing/sails/

Phantom droping from 10.0 to 9.5 despite rules allowing 11.0!
www.phantom-windsurfing.com/sails/p/iris-r-mk2

Starboard once again mixing things up:

New Evolution MK2 fuse with 2 bolts for the rear wing

www.nbwindsurfing.com/shop/Foils/Starboard-Foils/p/Starboard-Foils-Evolution-MkII-Fuselage-x65264787.htm

New 2 bolt rear wing:

www.nbwindsurfing.com/shop/Foils/Starboard-Foils/p/Starboard-Foils-SLR-Tail-Wing-Evo-MkII-2-bolt-x65264861.htm

New front wings (880 & 750)

www.nbwindsurfing.com/shop/Foils/Starboard-Foils/p/Starboard-Foils-SLR-Front-Wing-x65264814.htm

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berowne said..

Z-Foils did OK at the Sylt PWA event! still showing 2022 model.
zfins.eu/windfoil/windfoil-pwa-slalom/

Anyone have a ranking of results with foil brand listed for slyt?

Phantom is also releasing a new 100 fuselage to go with the new mast which, like the Z, has the front wing closer to the mast (so somewhat reversing the previous trend of front wings moving ever further forward)

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berowne said..
...Phantom droping from 10.0 to 9.5 despite rules allowing 11.0!
www.phantom-windsurfing.com/sails/p/iris-r-mk2

Wonder if this is because of the likelihood that lighter wind races will be slalom?

generally I think we won't see much investment anymore in open foil course race gear development going forward. slalom development budgets are thoroughly squeezed already, and open foil CR is no longer drawing in big numbers (only a handful of pros showed up for the Azores Open Foil last year; Garda had slightly bigger numbers this year but many were racing on their iQ set)

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Dishpet said..
Starboard once again mixing things up:

New Evolution MK2 fuse with 2 bolts for the rear wing

www.nbwindsurfing.com/shop/Foils/Starboard-Foils/p/Starboard-Foils-Evolution-MkII-Fuselage-x65264787.htm

New 2 bolt rear wing:

www.nbwindsurfing.com/shop/Foils/Starboard-Foils/p/Starboard-Foils-SLR-Tail-Wing-Evo-MkII-2-bolt-x65264861.htm

New front wings (880 & 750)

www.nbwindsurfing.com/shop/Foils/Starboard-Foils/p/Starboard-Foils-SLR-Front-Wing-x65264814.htm

How come STARBOARD customers always have to find out through all but the official manufacturers website about these new developments ?
VERY unprofessional IMHO.

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Bellerophon said..

Dishpet said..
Starboard once again mixing things up:

New Evolution MK2 fuse with 2 bolts for the rear wing

www.nbwindsurfing.com/shop/Foils/Starboard-Foils/p/Starboard-Foils-Evolution-MkII-Fuselage-x65264787.htm

New 2 bolt rear wing:

www.nbwindsurfing.com/shop/Foils/Starboard-Foils/p/Starboard-Foils-SLR-Tail-Wing-Evo-MkII-2-bolt-x65264861.htm

New front wings (880 & 750)

www.nbwindsurfing.com/shop/Foils/Starboard-Foils/p/Starboard-Foils-SLR-Front-Wing-x65264814.htm

How come STARBOARD customers always have to find out through all but the official manufacturers website about these new developments ?
VERY unprofessional IMHO.

They also really should have a chart like Phantom on sail/foil/fuse/stab compatibility and suggested wind range

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bel29 said..
generally I think we won't see much investment anymore in open foil course race gear development going forward. slalom development budgets are thoroughly squeezed already, and open foil CR is no longer drawing in big numbers (only a handful of pros showed up for the Azores Open Foil last year; Garda had slightly bigger numbers this year but many were racing on their iQ set)

Agree.
i'm sure they'll still produce something for the course race nutters (like me) and they'll still be producing iq foil, but i can't see them investing to much time/money in something that has become as niche as formula gear was/is.

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Subsonic said..

bel29 said..
generally I think we won't see much investment anymore in open foil course race gear development going forward. slalom development budgets are thoroughly squeezed already, and open foil CR is no longer drawing in big numbers (only a handful of pros showed up for the Azores Open Foil last year; Garda had slightly bigger numbers this year but many were racing on their iQ set)

Agree.
i'm sure they'll still produce something for the course race nutters (like me) and they'll still be producing iq foil, but i can't see them investing to much time/money in something that has become as niche as formula gear was/is.

Right there with you. I'm currently running an IQ setup with a custom mast but hope some of the tech will spill over from the broad reaching slalom nuts. It's good to see that Z-foil guys offer their full carbon fuse setups for CR foiling (960/850 frontwing) and the wing geometry looks considerably different from starboards more carved wingtips.

So ZFINS and AFS are very similar, all carbon foils, but AFS has one piece T-bar mast/fuselage while ZFINS has a two piece mast/ fuselage. They have a similar design of wings. AFS uses a saddle mount for wings, while ZFINS uses what looks like a flat mount. I think a flat mount may be easier to get wing and stab. perfectly aligned with each other and at 90 degrees to the mast, but I have never assembled a foil with them and checked for alignment.

Zulu fins will have a completely redesigned foil. Freeride and slalom fuselages and wings ranging from 1450cm2 to 635cm 2 ( at this stage).... heres a few renders off the CAD

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Sandman1221 said..
So ZFINS and AFS are very similar ...

only apparent similarity to me is that they're both made of carbon... but even that doesn't say much.

back on topic: the evolution towards more slalom/speed oriented foils risks us falling into old traps: with two front wings you can cover pretty much any feasible foil course racing conditions, but you need at least three wings to cover the slalom range. ditto with sails: you need at least three (more likely four) sails to cover the slalom range while two course racing sails do the trick.

don't get me wrong, I like speed around the course as much as the next guy, whether it be up/down, figure-8 or downwind slalom, but there's a cost.

and ofc I'm aware of iQ foil, which has a lot going for it, but OD racing is not my thing (yet...)

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bel29 said..

Sandman1221 said..
So ZFINS and AFS are very similar ...

only apparent similarity to me is that they're both made of carbon... but even that doesn't say much.

They are both made of 100% carbon, with a fuselage that extends to the wing and stab. (versus what Lokefoil does), the wing and stab. mount to the fuselage with screws, and the largest of each's front wing has a similar shape.

What other windfoils have full-length 100% carbon fuselages? That alone is a big similarity IMO

But for some reason, AFS (Foilandco.com) no longer have English as a language option on their website

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Sandman1221 said..

bel29 said..

Sandman1221 said..
So ZFINS and AFS are very similar ...

only apparent similarity to me is that they're both made of carbon... but even that doesn't say much.

They are both made of 100% carbon, with a fuselage that extends to the wing and stab. (versus what Lokefoil does), the wing and stab. mount to the fuselage with screws, and the largest of each's front wing has a similar shape.

What other windfoils have full-length 100% carbon fuselages? That alone is a big similarity IMO

Tip: I have one, actually

But that's besides the point; having actually seen it in real life I can assure you the Z Foil is very different from
the AFS

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bel29 said..

Sandman1221 said..

bel29 said..

Sandman1221 said..
So ZFINS and AFS are very similar ...

only apparent similarity to me is that they're both made of carbon... but even that doesn't say much.

They are both made of 100% carbon, with a fuselage that extends to the wing and stab. (versus what Lokefoil does), the wing and stab. mount to the fuselage with screws, and the largest of each's front wing has a similar shape.

What other windfoils have full-length 100% carbon fuselages? That alone is a big similarity IMO

Tip: I have one, actually

But that's besides the point; having actually seen it in real life I can assure you the Z Foil is very different from
the AFS

You have said that before, I believe! So in what ways are they very different? I would really like to know, thanks.

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berowne said..
Whole bunch of new gear being announced...

F4 Foils have a new EU production facility and R mast - largely layup changes and improved bases.
www.f4foils.com/2022/09/07/the-new-2023-windsurfing-race-mast-is-here/

Phantom introduce a major update to our Racing foils - 5cm shorter and skinnier for Slalom.
www.phantom-windsurfing.com/

Z-Foils did OK at the Sylt PWA event! still showing 2022 model.
zfins.eu/windfoil/windfoil-pwa-slalom/

Starboard Evo foils from 2022... don't expect major changes this year!?
starboardfoils.com/pages/2022-wind-foils-overview

Loft Sails looking good. also SkySkape freefoil with nocams.
www.loftsails.com/windsurf-gear/sails/skyblade

Patrik sails offer some good solutions for dedicated foiling... and also a Slalom fin or Foil SF sail range which others might thing is too much of a compromise.
patrik-windsurf.com/race-sf/

Duotone being coy on race gear but also have a freefoil option with 2 or without cams.
www.duotonesports.com/windsurfing/sails/

Phantom droping from 10.0 to 9.5 despite rules allowing 11.0!
www.phantom-windsurfing.com/sails/p/iris-r-mk2

patrik-windsurf.com/race-sf/ is the slalom sails?

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bel29 said.....and ofc I'm aware of iQ foil, which has a lot going for it, but OD racing is not my thing (yet...)

The whole area the health of course racing is a separate topic which is worthy of its own thread. From a product development POV, the two most visible racing disciplines currently are Olympic e.g. IQFoil and slalom at the local/pro level so that's where the funds and energy are being drawn to. I will say I kind of miss the semi-course racing they had in the PWA before they trusted foils to do slalom. It's a shame that there isn't the time or money to continue that as it would push development of up/downwind capable gear a bit.

As for OD, one merit of open class is it encourages local cottage industry which is vital in many places due to the expense of imported gear (taxes, duties, transportation). So many of these smaller players were the ones who, in the early days of foiling, really pushed things along and were able to respond to the rapid growth ie they were more responsible for the revolution part of things.

There are others, too, but LP came out with a 100% carbon full length fuselage in 2016 already. I still have one, the FRS. It is the lightest foil I have ever lifted.

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segler said..
There are others, too, but LP came out with a 100% carbon full length fuselage in 2016 already. I still have one, the FRS. It is the lightest foil I have ever lifted.

Are you sure it was solid carbon?, I heard they used wood cores in their masts and wings, never asked about the fuselage, but they are no longer available as far as I can see. A wood core wing, mast, and fuselage, will be lighter than the same in solid carbon.

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Sandman1221 said..
You have said that before, I believe! So in what ways are they very different? I would really like to know, thanks.

Pretty much everything about it is different: different outline, different chord length and profile thickness, different sectional thickness, etc

What stands out most imho is the quality of finishing, clearly made to some of the lowest tolerances that I've seen, in any of the high-end race foils.

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bel29 said..

Sandman1221 said..
You have said that before, I believe! So in what ways are they very different? I would really like to know, thanks.

Pretty much everything about it is different: different outline, different chord length and profile thickness, different sectional thickness, etc

What stands out most imho is the quality of finishing, clearly made to some of the lowest tolerances that I've seen, in any of the high-end race foils.

Okay, thanks, and any differences in foiling?

the Z is a slalom machine, so a bit more backfoot favored and optimized for off the wind speed

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bel29 said..

Sandman1221 said..
So ZFINS and AFS are very similar ...

back on topic: the evolution towards more slalom/speed oriented foils risks us falling into old trap

The windsurfing industry is extremely consistent - it's been falling into the same over-specialisation trap since the early '80s. No wonder it falls into the trap so well, it's had so much practise at it. :-)

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thedoor said..

berowne said..

Z-Foils did OK at the Sylt PWA event! still showing 2022 model.
zfins.eu/windfoil/windfoil-pwa-slalom/

Anyone have a ranking of results with foil brand listed for slyt?

at 40 min Jordy runs through the brands. Lot of z-foil

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Chris 249 said..

bel29 said..

Sandman1221 said..
So ZFINS and AFS are very similar ...

back on topic: the evolution towards more slalom/speed oriented foils risks us falling into old trap

The windsurfing industry is extremely consistent - it's been falling into the same over-specialisation trap since the early '80s. No wonder it falls into the trap so well, it's had so much practise at it. :-)

Nobody is forcing anyone to buy specialist kit.
ZFins only to high performance fins and foils.
AFS do freeride.
There is loads of freeride kit on the market.

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Dishpet said..
Starboard once again mixing things up:
New Evolution MK2 fuse with 2 bolts for the rear wing

Another year, another new fuse from Starboard. While the Evolution fuse was a reasonable improvement, it seems the primary benefit of changing the tail is that Starboard will make more money from selling new fuses.

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boardsurfr said..

Dishpet said..
Starboard once again mixing things up:
New Evolution MK2 fuse with 2 bolts for the rear wing

Another year, another new fuse from Starboard. While the Evolution fuse was a reasonable improvement, it seems the primary benefit of changing the tail is that Starboard will make more money from selling new fuses.

Well good thing I didn't grab a mark I evo fuse...

I think I'll be good with my older 725 and 650 front wing until I start to really get some speed. At the moment I don't see me using the SLR wings until my skills improve quite a bit. By then they'll have an Evo II mk III fuse.

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boardsurfr said..

Dishpet said..
Starboard once again mixing things up:
New Evolution MK2 fuse with 2 bolts for the rear wing

Another year, another new fuse from Starboard. While the Evolution fuse was a reasonable improvement, it seems the primary benefit of changing the tail is that Starboard will make more money from selling new fuses.

Thats why I never buy anything from Starboard.
Even their basic freeride boards, Atom Q 'rocker from iSonic for speed' then a few years later 'the secret is a longer planing flat'. They're full of bulls1t. But, they plant a few mangroves

It's a shame that course racing is dying on the foils. The upwind performance of foils is my favourite thing about foiling. Personally I am totally disinterested in foil slalom but I seem to be in the tiny minority on that one.

of course the IQ foil racing scene has tons of course racing but I would love to see it in the pwa as well.

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PhilUK said..
Nobody is forcing anyone to buy specialist kit.

didn't intend to suggest otherwise. my only point perhaps not clearly made is that especially in a shrinking market it will be increasingly difficult to maintain an (any) open fleet when, as soon as it matures in development, it is effectively abandoned by the industry

in the meantime, I'm as partial as anyone to the next new piece of carbon, so I'm probably part of the problem