Posting a new topic so not to totally hijack another thread here: www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Windsurfing/Foiling/Board-for-medium-to-lower-aspect-foils?page=2

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mr love said..
Just wondering how many "freeride windfoilers" are out there. By that I mean people chasing swell and pulling tricks as opposed to blasting on faster foils. I get the impression that there are not that many but maybe I am wrong. Nearly all the guys that were windfoiling at my local ( except for the iQ crew) have swapped to winging. Are we a dying breed?

Oh, wow... I've been trying to avoid climbing on this soapbox but here we go anyway.

First, people should do what brings them happiness. My comment isn't to say there's only one way to do things. Ride the style that brings you joy. Yet, I see variations of this comment all the time and I think it causes people problems: "I'll get X wing (usually between 1200-1600cm2)) and then get a smaller wing later on as I get better for higher winds." I saw this comment a couple of weeks ago and I saw this comment over and over from two, now banned, accounts including one that said my personal favorite 1100cm2 wing was unfoilable over 20kts of wind speed while I merrily use it in 30. I'm not a big nor heavy guy either. btw, this isn't a "wings suck" post. I've winged a few times and it does have it's moments. But even my winging friends look at how I ride and get why windfoiling is my first go-to.

I'm not opposed to smaller foil wings. The smallest in my current quiver is a whopping 475 which I promise to get wet soon. And, yes, a smaller wing also allows you to carry a bigger sail since you aren't bumping into the drag wall and having to deal with both the wing and sail as winds pick up. But for intermediate windfoilers, smaller wings (say <750ish) bring challenges as conditions get more difficult, the same conditions where freeriding gets more enjoyable (say 18-30 kts). Ripping through deep swell on a 600-700cm2 swell in the middle of a jibe is hard. It's easy to get too high over a trough and it's just as easy to not maintain enough speed and stall the wing. The guy/gal who has trouble making a jibe in lighter winds on an 1100 probably isn't going to be nailing them in 25 kts on a 650-700cm wing.

From my observations, part of the challenge is that we windsurfers ride those conditions like we are still windsurfing instead of freeride foiling. If you just charge ahead and try to solve the issues brought by higher winds and swell/chop by adapting high wind windsurfing techniques, yeah, I can see why you'd want to wing instead. Instead, consider taking advantage of what a windfoil does well.

1) Don't automatically grab the smaller foil in higher winds. Consider a mid-aspect 1000-1600 wing. That's why wings like the SAB 799/940/950, Slingshot G800-900, PTM 926(iirc) have become popular. You are still fast enough not to bang into the drag wall quickly like you would with a big shovel wing in higher winds but you have enough lift that you can bridge lulls in gusty conditions, glide through transitions and actually "ride" the foil.
2) Do use a smaller sail. The key to making this work is consistent jibes so you aren't having to relaunch each time you change direction. But even if you aren't and using a floaty enough board, you'll get enough gusts to get off the water.
3) Don't mow the lawn. The two easiest ways to deal with too much wind pressure is go either deep upwind or downwind. You can kill an amazing amount of wind doing this. And by deep, I mean really deep. If you are going 20 kts deep downwind and get hit by a 25 kt gust, that's only about 5-7 kts of wind going past your rig which is a lot less than if you are just on a reach getting blasted by the 25. Get good at this upwind/downwind stuff because it's more than just bleeding excess wind.
4) Now the fun begins and why my winging friends are absolutely psyched about how I ride: you get to play, especially downwind. Upwind is like the ski resort gondola delivering you to the top of the slope. Now you get to ride downhill and play on every bit of chop/swell. You get to turn, carve, etc. This is where the bigger wing comes in handy - not outrunning all the fun stuff and often the water provides enough power on it's own to keep you going. This is where being trapped in the "windsurf" paradigm can be restricting. I imagine those who wave sail a lot (which is definitely not me) probably grasp this better than those that bang back and forth all day.
5) The bigger mid-aspect wings make it easier to start to play with transitions as you have enough glide to through but enough lift not to fall off the foil halfway through. Balz is doing his maneuvers on a bigger wing, not a 650. His latest "signature wing is a 1000. sabfoil.com/en/products/WMP909-BM His previous wing, the 799, is about 1100 and according to their website "optimized for freestyle and finds its best use in wing and wind foiling with medium-strong wind conditions."
6) Be careful. If you are really doing the upwind/downwind thing, you'll be crossing all the BAFers at a 45 degree angle many times so keep your eyes open for traffic.
7) Back to that jibe thing. If you don't have yours wired yet, keep at it. One of the great things about even a big windfoil is how hard you can put them over and go through a turn and even our wing friends notice this. Yes, it's easier to learn how to change directions on a wing but the windfoil jibe has it's own payoff. And, learning on a bigger mid-aspect is a * ton easier than on a small, speedy wing.

Again, there's no one right/wrong way to rig or ride. But if you aren't having fun windfoiling, maybe think about how you are windfoiling first before thinking that a new set of winging gear is going to solve your problems.

Agreed and I'll note a few things:

*The hardest thing to learn was dealing with gusty overpower on a foil and realizing just how much I had to step down a sail size. My earliest flights were with an 8.0 cheetah, 6.6. goya mark and the infinity 76. It took some time to realize that I really needed a much smaller sail than those when it was really windy, often stepping down to either 5.6 or 4.4 (my smallest) to finally get comfortable. It was hard for me to gauge just how small I had to get as we were all kind of still learning and a variety of different setups here, with a mix of finners, and we were all experimenting. When I played with smaller foils it sometimes seemed "easier" with a bigger sail but I was sailing very suboptimally with a lot more sail than I needed.

*I've had the ptm 926 for about 2 years now and I love it and don't really see a lot of need for a lot more speed with that setup as it's very forgiving. My favorite upgrade was just getting something with narrow straps and a track mount as it is helping me figure out really where the foil should go, and I like it even more forward as it helps a lot in jibes. A different stab loosened it up a bit but I'm still exploring with it.

*Even 2-3ft bumps are rideable but you have to find out where to find those conditions.

*A big mistake I made was sticking to the all out iqfoil setup (900, 9.0, etc.) in all conditions even in higher wind when I decided to go with a race setup. I can ride that somewhat comfortably up to 20kts if it's not too gusty and flat water, but add chop or gustiness and it's much more stressful. An example was this weekend when we had an interesting side/off wind which made it gusty but flat, and the 9.0 was feeling a bit hectic. I downsized to the 7.0 FG and it made everything about 10x less stressful and it ended up being one of my favorite sessions I ever had. A small group of us went on a 3mile upwind ride to an island that I've never been to, and I just screamed back downwind and found the absolute groove. I would not have been anywhere near as comfortable with 2m2 more sail to deal with, even if I could have done it.

Sail size is the key to Windfoil fun in high winds and swell. My current smallest is 4.0 which I use in 15 to 20kts. I'm looking for a 3.5 to use on 20+ days. My go to foil is the PTM899. At 925 mm2 surface area is slightly smaller than Paducah's preferred range of 1000 to 1600, but it works for me in anything over 12 kts. In comparison to my PTM926 and Sabfoil WO940 it points higher to windward and gets me to the "top of the slope" for downwind fun faster.

Nicely put, I'm in agreement too.

I did lots of learning on freeride kit (SB foil freeride 125 etc and 1100/550 & 800/330 sets) but more recently been mainly Predator and more the Sabfoil 799/769 route. Love the manoeuvrability(4.4m / 5.3m rigs) but still ride the freeride kit now and again (5.5m to 7m) which feels huge now but the more connected power and sheer speed upwind/downwind performance is lots of fun in its own way too!

The more foils the merrier...

Also agree with the above. The smallest sail you can get away with to get you to the top of the "hill" makes the transitions down hill more fun. Wing size depends on wind for me. Ride Sabfoil 899, 940, 769 all with 399 stab. Sails 4.8, 4.0, 3.3.
Below was on 3.3 in 20-25 knots

Yes, the reason I freeride foil is because can use smaller sails. Most used wing is the Naish 914, smallest sail a 3.4 cut from a 4.6 wave sail,I use it over 20 knts wind if its consistent enough. Around 25 knts is my limit and have more fun with the fin.

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Mr Keen said..
Also agree with the above. The smallest sail you can get away with to get you to the top of the "hill" makes the transitions down hill more fun. Wing size depends on wind for me. Ride Sabfoil 899, 940, 769 all with 399 stab. Sails 4.8, 4.0, 3.3.
Below was on 3.3 in 20-25 knots

Your honor, we'd like to enter this as Exhibit A.

Exhibit B:
Wind: 15 to 20kts
Board: Predator 110
Sail: 4.0
Foil: PTM899
Stab: PS340

Agreed a good medium size wing can handle a lot of wind, with the right sail. If you like depowered swell glides then a wing with a lower stall speed is pretty important irrespective of wind strength

I've been experimenting with different wings, but all on a 3.7 sail. 114L board. I only go out if the winds are> 17 knots. I've used up to 5.3 in lower winds, but just not as much fun, and get easily over powered in gusts. I've spent a good deal of time recently on the sab 769 medusa and SS turbo tail. The surface area is 1/2 of my 730 PFI. It does slips up to speed easier, but also a bit more pitchy and harder to ride. I've gotten used to it now, but the interesting part is my max speed isn't that much better than the 730 despite being much smaller. At least at my skill level with the same sail and wind speeds. With both wings, I push it until there's no sail pressure, and that's were I'm at. Not like the big rigs that do 1.5 times the wind speed using apparent wind (I've chased the IQ foil guy a couple times). It's great to have cross compatability with SS and Sabfoil to experiment. I'm having an absolute blast in my free ride setup and not interested in sails >4.0.
The thought of uphauling a 9.0 makes my 62yo back hurt.

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WsurfAustin said..
The thought of uphauling a 9.0 makes my 62yo back hurt.

The 9.0 is awesome for 8-10kts when not much else will work for someone my weight, and I was lucky that I only dropped it once the past 3 sessions with it. It tends to move real slow in jibes and maneuvers compared to the smaller sails (big difference from the 7.0 or 6.0 foil glides I use!), which helps you catch it before it falls...usually.

For the ptm 926 it's really easy to chill and cruise in the 12-14kt range and stay there, make jibes dropping down to 8-9kts or so and keep going. I think I pushed it to 18kts max in flat water that was a bit weedy and shallow but I sent it because those factors kept it not choppy. The smaller people here (40-60something kg) are riding those sub 900 freeride wings and are killing it in jibes, but even with a bigger front wing (900) I can reel them in without trying too hard, probably because I have so much weight on them. I really do want to know why sometimes the smaller wings just don't feel that much faster, as I've noticed similar, but my skills are a barrier. With the winds here though, frequently going out in 10kts or so, I care more about low end than upper end and my 550/650/725 front wings don't get that much use.

Absolutely agree...for swell riding there is no need to go for a really small foil, infact I have found that it can hinder you. When I ride my small front wing I find it too fast and I am trying to slow everything down so I am not constantly outrunning the swell. My medium size wing is way more fun, even when its gets really windy. You dont overpower the bigger foil wings if you dont try to go too fast, wing lift is relative to speed so you can stay on a larger wing and just continually downsize the sail. I have used my 960 in 35 knots. With this wing I have a really nice speed that is comfortable on the swells, and lots of glide and it has a lower stall speed which is always a bonus in the transitions. So for swell riding type foiling dont automatically jump for a smaller wing when the wind comes up ( unless you want the extra speed) , you may be better off downsizing the sail for maximum fun factor.
NB....My Zulu 960 front wing is not slow, my mate did 24 knots on it on his ding a few weeks ago.

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aeroegnr said.....
The 9.0 is awesome for 8-10kts when not much else will work for someone my weight, and I was lucky that I only dropped it once the past 3 sessions with it. It tends to move real slow in jibes and maneuvers compared to the smaller sails (big difference from the 7.0 or 6.0 foil glides I use!), which helps you catch it before it falls...usually.

For the ptm 926 it's really easy to chill and cruise in the 12-14kt range and stay there, make jibes dropping down to 8-9kts or so and keep going. I think I pushed it to 18kts max in flat water that was a bit weedy and shallow but I sent it because those factors kept it not choppy. The smaller people here (40-60something kg) are riding those sub 900 freeride wings and are killing it in jibes, but even with a bigger front wing (900) I can reel them in without trying too hard, probably because I have so much weight on them. I really do want to know why sometimes the smaller wings just don't feel that much faster, as I've noticed similar, but my skills are a barrier. With the winds here though, frequently going out in 10kts or so, I care more about low end than upper end and my 550/650/725 front wings don't get that much use.

The sub 60kg crowd riding the smaller wings are still, effectively, using about the same wing loading (ie body weight/ wing area) so that makes sense. As for hitting a wall with your 900, at 10 kts of wind, you probably can't saturate the wing since 10kts only generates a limited amount of power and the 900 is capable of 30+ under the right hands. As well, sail efficiency is an issue for squeezing a lot of speed in lighter winds from a smaller foil. The apparent wind is pretty far forward requiring a pretty slippery sail (e.g. deep luff sleeve, etc) The IQ is a relatively fast sail but more rec type sails are certainly going to be more limited in squeezing out more speed from a smaller foil.

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Paducah said..

aeroegnr said.....
The 9.0 is awesome for 8-10kts when not much else will work for someone my weight, and I was lucky that I only dropped it once the past 3 sessions with it. It tends to move real slow in jibes and maneuvers compared to the smaller sails (big difference from the 7.0 or 6.0 foil glides I use!), which helps you catch it before it falls...usually.

For the ptm 926 it's really easy to chill and cruise in the 12-14kt range and stay there, make jibes dropping down to 8-9kts or so and keep going. I think I pushed it to 18kts max in flat water that was a bit weedy and shallow but I sent it because those factors kept it not choppy. The smaller people here (40-60something kg) are riding those sub 900 freeride wings and are killing it in jibes, but even with a bigger front wing (900) I can reel them in without trying too hard, probably because I have so much weight on them. I really do want to know why sometimes the smaller wings just don't feel that much faster, as I've noticed similar, but my skills are a barrier. With the winds here though, frequently going out in 10kts or so, I care more about low end than upper end and my 550/650/725 front wings don't get that much use.

The sub 60kg crowd riding the smaller wings are still, effectively, using about the same wing loading (ie body weight/ wing area) so that makes sense. As for hitting a wall with your 900, at 10 kts of wind, you probably can't saturate the wing since 10kts only generates a limited amount of power and the 900 is capable of 30+ under the right hands. As well, sail efficiency is an issue for squeezing a lot of speed in lighter winds from a smaller foil. The apparent wind is pretty far forward requiring a pretty slippery sail (e.g. deep luff sleeve, etc) The IQ is a relatively fast sail but more rec type sails are certainly going to be more limited in squeezing out more speed from a smaller foil.

Yeah I think I've confused things a bit. But stepping down from my 900 to my 725 or lower I only gain a couple knots unless I'm really pushing hard downwind

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aeroegnr said..

...
Yeah I think I've confused things a bit. But stepping down from my 900 to my 725 or lower I only gain a couple knots unless I'm really pushing hard downwind

That doesn't sound like a lot but that can be pretty meaningful side by side. 2 kts is approx 1m/sec which is you walking away from someone and on even a 30 second leg of a course, you've just lit someone up. Just make sure to nail the jibe.

nice credo in the wind foiling discipline, and much needed as its uptake -- at least based on my local perception -- seems to be stalling. that's both sad and ironic, as the whole discussion here nicely illustrates how in the space of just a few years the discipline has developed and matured to the point that it is now able to cater to "whatever brings one happiness" in the most efficient way imaginable.

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mr love said..
Absolutely agree...for swell riding there is no need to go for a really small foil, infact I have found that it can hinder you. When I ride my small front wing I find it too fast and I am trying to slow everything down so I am not constantly outrunning the swell. My medium size wing is way more fun, even when its gets really windy. You dont overpower the bigger foil wings if you dont try to go too fast, wing lift is relative to speed so you can stay on a larger wing and just continually downsize the sail. I have used my 960 in 35 knots. With this wing I have a really nice speed that is comfortable on the swells, and lots of glide and it has a lower stall speed which is always a bonus in the transitions. So for swell riding type foiling dont automatically jump for a smaller wing when the wind comes up ( unless you want the extra speed) , you may be better off downsizing the sail for maximum fun factor.
NB....My Zulu 960 front wing is not slow, my mate did 24 knots on it on his ding a few weeks ago.

I mostly agree.
Except I go a faster on my smaller wings and speed downwind is superfun, the lack of drag is exhilarating.
Downwinding is easier with slower bigger wings, I can stall on the wave and relax in the gybes but there's something special about hammering downwind in the 20-24 knots speed range on the little 'uns.
I don't ever feel I can go too fast or are limited by outrunning the swells , I just do more sweeping s-turns on the swell faces or up-and-over the bumps stealing a boost each time.

Similar angles deep downwind with all my wings as they are reasonably high aspect and have good glide
Phantasm 926 1233cm2
Simmer 920, 720 and 550cm2

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azymuth said..

mr love said..
Absolutely agree...for swell riding there is no need to go for a really small foil, infact I have found that it can hinder you. When I ride my small front wing I find it too fast and I am trying to slow everything down so I am not constantly outrunning the swell. My medium size wing is way more fun, even when its gets really windy. You dont overpower the bigger foil wings if you dont try to go too fast, wing lift is relative to speed so you can stay on a larger wing and just continually downsize the sail. I have used my 960 in 35 knots. With this wing I have a really nice speed that is comfortable on the swells, and lots of glide and it has a lower stall speed which is always a bonus in the transitions. So for swell riding type foiling dont automatically jump for a smaller wing when the wind comes up ( unless you want the extra speed) , you may be better off downsizing the sail for maximum fun factor.
NB....My Zulu 960 front wing is not slow, my mate did 24 knots on it on his ding a few weeks ago.

I mostly agree.
Except I go a faster on my smaller wings and speed downwind is superfun, the lack of drag is exhilarating.
Downwinding is easier with slower bigger wings, I can stall on the wave and relax in the gybes but there's something special about hammering downwind in the 20-24 knots speed range on the little 'uns.
I don't ever feel I can go too fast or are limited by outrunning the swells , I just do more sweeping s-turns on the swell faces or up-and-over the bumps stealing a boost each time.

Similar angles deep downwind with all my wings as they are reasonably high aspect and have good glide
Phantasm 926 1233cm2
Simmer 920, 720 and 550cm2

I agree that speed is your friend on the wave face when linking repeated front side turns off the top with backside bottom turns.

I have found I can use the same board and foil (such as ptm 926) and geometry with 7.0 down to 2.8. After finning for a million years I am always amazed by this.

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azymuth said..

mr love said..
Absolutely agree...for swell riding there is no need to go for a really small foil, infact I have found that it can hinder you. When I ride my small front wing I find it too fast and I am trying to slow everything down so I am not constantly outrunning the swell. My medium size wing is way more fun, even when its gets really windy. You dont overpower the bigger foil wings if you dont try to go too fast, wing lift is relative to speed so you can stay on a larger wing and just continually downsize the sail. I have used my 960 in 35 knots. With this wing I have a really nice speed that is comfortable on the swells, and lots of glide and it has a lower stall speed which is always a bonus in the transitions. So for swell riding type foiling dont automatically jump for a smaller wing when the wind comes up ( unless you want the extra speed) , you may be better off downsizing the sail for maximum fun factor.
NB....My Zulu 960 front wing is not slow, my mate did 24 knots on it on his ding a few weeks ago.

I mostly agree.
Except I go a faster on my smaller wings and speed downwind is superfun, the lack of drag is exhilarating.
Downwinding is easier with slower bigger wings, I can stall on the wave and relax in the gybes but there's something special about hammering downwind in the 20-24 knots speed range on the little 'uns.
I don't ever feel I can go too fast or are limited by outrunning the swells , I just do more sweeping s-turns on the swell faces or up-and-over the bumps stealing a boost each time.

Similar angles deep downwind with all my wings as they are reasonably high aspect and have good glide
Phantasm 926 1233cm2
Simmer 920, 720 and 550cm2

550! that's PWA size

Is your wind typically filled in to the beach? Often I have togo through I light patch to get to real wind, wondering if that's why I steer clear of the small wings?

My take is that design matters too! It all 1200 or 900 foils lift or glide better than smaller foils.
recently I went out on my F4 660 foil and it took a bit of pumping to fly as did a friend on 900 iQ but once up I was faster, gybes just as well, and had a better low end because of the lower drag. despite the smaller area I could actually glide through lulls that he dropped off foil for. My 400 can almost keep up with an iq rig UPWIND. And do 32kts downhill!

Patrik's new Aeon foils claim to need 100cm less than other brands.

all I'm saying is design makes a difference and new foils are soooo much better than my original slingshot! and I loved that foil because it got me started, but I wouldn't dare ride it now!

I probably need to spend more time on the 790 but I find on the super steep PPB waves it accelerates down the wave face so fast I find myself trying to slow things up. With the 960 I feel I can sit in the pocket better. The problem with PPB is the really tight steep waves, its not like ocean waves where you can sail out the front bottom turn and back up the face, here as soon as you hit the trough you have a big steep wall in front of you. I find I am trying to stay on the face as you cant race out in front of the wave and the 960 is better at that. When the wind is Northerly and the water a bit flatter then I love the smaller foil.
Also with the steep waves its easy to stall out gybing if you are a bit slow, you run into the back of the wave in front of you, so the slower stall speed on the 960 is a bit more forgiving.
But yep I will spend more time on the 790 in the waves and see if I can adjust to the speed.

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mr love said..
I probably need to spend more time on the 790 but I find on the super steep PPB waves it accelerates down the wave face so fast I find myself trying to slow things up. With the 960 I feel I can sit in the pocket better. The problem with PPB is the really tight steep waves, its not like ocean waves where you can sail out the front bottom turn and back up the face, here as soon as you hit the trough you have a big steep wall in front of you. I find I am trying to stay on the face as you cant race out in front of the wave and the 960 is better at that. When the wind is Northerly and the water a bit flatter then I love the smaller foil.
Also with the steep waves its easy to stall out gybing if you are a bit slow, you run into the back of the wave in front of you, so the slower stall speed on the 960 is a bit more forgiving.
But yep I will spend more time on the 790 in the waves and see if I can adjust to the speed.

We have similar short steep wind waves in Moreton Bay. I use the back of the wave in front to initiate the backside turn back up the wave.

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mr love said..
I probably need to spend more time on the 790 but I find on the super steep PPB waves it accelerates down the wave face so fast I find myself trying to slow things up. With the 960 I feel I can sit in the pocket better. The problem with PPB is the really tight steep waves, its not like ocean waves where you can sail out the front bottom turn and back up the face, here as soon as you hit the trough you have a big steep wall in front of you. I find I am trying to stay on the face as you cant race out in front of the wave and the 960 is better at that. When the wind is Northerly and the water a bit flatter then I love the smaller foil.
Also with the steep waves its easy to stall out gybing if you are a bit slow, you run into the back of the wave in front of you, so the slower stall speed on the 960 is a bit more forgiving.
But yep I will spend more time on the 790 in the waves and see if I can adjust to the speed.

Sounds like the kind of waves I have. Wavelength too short to ride, but deep and steep walls which can get tricky to jibe on if the foil is close to the surface. I just keep a lot of speed and keep the wing as deep as possible without clipping waves with the board. Long mast really helps in that scenario.

Saw this video and thought it was pretty relevant to the topic. He brings up similar points on the different foil types. Also, you can clearly see some of the differences in his stance and jibes on the different gear.

Looks like the NP freeride is pretty quick, with about 3-4 knots less speed than the 850cm2 freerace foil he rode.

His speed on the Glide 11 is pretty close to what a lot of folks do on more expensive freeride gear. I was impressed. Very interesting that the difference between the Glide and FR was only half the difference between the FR and full on race. I have the 13 and it's okay. My purpose was more for a training rig for my son (along with some bigger wings and the windfoil fuse when I dabble in that). I should spend more time on it just for fun - it really does get up pretty easily with a small sail. It doesn't really compare with the AFS F800 even though they are nominally the same area. I think also that I rode the Glide Wind after having spent 3-4 years on faster kit and I was already hardwired to a different mode of windfoiling.

I agree that there's a lot of value in what he's trying to convey. Incidentally, last week rode the F800 on a day with gusts well into the mid 30s. While there were some ugly moments, it can be done. I'd wanted to fin but it was a long way out to the wind line. Floating out on a windfoil board seemed the drier alternative.

Now I wanna see that test is something resembling a wave.

Agree with this discussion.
Low speed in the swell is a factor.
M?dium front wing size and small wave sail is better combo for it.
But what about the board size?
I'm 90 kg.
Jp Hidrofoil Pro 135 2020
Lokefoil Lk1 2021 1300+300
Duotone E- Pace hd 5'4

I'm looking for the Jp Freefoil for riding swell.

what do you think?

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Jlpm said..
Agree with this discussion.
Low speed in the swell is a factor.
M?dium front wing size and small wave sail is better combo for it.
But what about the board size?
I'm 90 kg.
Jp Hidrofoil Pro 135 2020
Lokefoil Lk1 2021 1300+300
Duotone E- Pace hd 5'4

I'm looking for the Jp Freefoil for riding swell.

what do you think?

What wind speeds? I'm smaller so I hesitate to say what conditions you'd be using the 5.4 in.The freefoil is more likely to promote a more vertical and over the board stance which should encourage more turning but don't know if the same can be achieved with the straps inboard on the JP. The freefoil would definitely be more comfortable in chop/swell and higher winds, I'd think.

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mr love said..
Now I wanna see that test is something resembling a wave.

Marketing budget at NP pretty tight at the moment. Best we could do for you.

Right. Jp Hidrofoil with Severne FG 7 and 8 m2 for freeride in flat water since 8-15 knots is a good option, leaning with both footstraps.


Duotone E Pace 6'2 and 5'4 from 12-20 knots, but with an upright stance on the board for carving and surfing the swell, with no rear footstrap.

I think that Jp Free foil is better option for riding because its short lenght and narrow tail, for upright stance and controlling swell.

When wind increases, I use a 890 front wing and 190 stabilizer from Lokefoil.


But, is there another board with similar o better performance?

Hi,

Great comments here, thank you for all the tips.

My wife has been Windfoiling a JP Freefoil with a Sabfoil W799/399 combination, 110 cm fuse, 93cm Mast. Loves it, foils a lot on it.
Bit scared to jibe due to what happened to my ankle a year ago but that's another story :-).

She's light, only 59kg and we get 20-25 knots in winter with a decent swell, if sometimes ugly and messy due to a bay with some small islands. She goes high up and down wind to bleed off the power, low boom etc but we're on our smallest sail (a NP Combat 3.3) and she's still overpowered and getting a heck of a lot of lift (no shims ... yet).

I am positive she'd be more comfortable on a smaller 2.9m2 sail (smallest NP make in the Combat) but before we go down that route, is there anything else you'd recommend? Options so far:

a. How about (-ve) shims (I have downloaded a 3D Printer profile)?
b. A W699 foil to replace the W799 (with what stab?) or is that just going to be too fast?
c. A smaller sail as mentioned above (my pref but the most exxy... and hard to find)?

cheers,

k.