I recently changed from free ride foil (NP Glide wind) to Race Foil

I am not qualified to write a review but happy to share a few photos

For me the choice came down to availability and value on like for like products

Bundle purchased has - 1000 and 900 span wings, 2 stabilisers, 2 fuselage and 1 x 970 high modulus mast

I don't think there are many in the country yet so if you have any questions fire away

You can also view product info on F4 site www.f4foils.com/products/windsurf/windsurf-race/

Ive got a previous model F4 with a 120 fuse. Just looking at yours looks like they've added some front end poke to the new one. Whats the distance front of mast to front edge of the wing on the two fuselages?

looks like theyve changed all the joints too, added a few bolts too.

Looking good!
I think you are qualified to review , I am very happy to read experience of non-pro's of new racing equipment.
Must be a big step up in stability and control.

Here is a (French) review of the new F4:
windfoilfan.glissattitude.com/reviews/107

Mmmm foil porn. Will there be tears the first time it touches a sandbar?

I think maybe a smaller front wing would be good to try as well especially if you aren't focused on course racing.

how many much in oz ???

Select to expand quote

Subsonic said..
Ive got a previous model F4 with a 120 fuse. Just looking at yours looks like they've added some front end poke to the new one. Whats the distance front of mast to front edge of the wing on the two fuselages?

looks like theyve changed all the joints too, added a few bolts too.

Details Requested
Front Edge Wing to front of mast 115 plus = 435mm
Front Edge Wing to front of mast 115 Std = 335mm
5 bolts in the front wing, no worries with torsional loads
Cheers
Tony

Select to expand quote

swoosh said..
Mmmm foil porn. Will there be tears the first time it touches a sandbar?

I think maybe a smaller front wing would be good to try as well especially if you aren't focused on course racing.

Yes slalom wings may offer a different experience
I don't sail upwind / downwind I just sail any direction
But for their size I find with my limited experience on this kit (4 weeks) the 900 and 1000 go ok
So far I have only used the 115 Plus
-1000 wing 2sec 23.8kts, Duck gybe Alpha 19kts
-900wing 2sec 25kts, alpha std gybe 21
I am just a free rider not a pro, in the right hands there is more to extract,

What a glorious bit of kit, TK! I love the mast/fuse coupling. Best in the biz.

Select to expand quote

tonyk said..

Subsonic said..
Ive got a previous model F4 with a 120 fuse. Just looking at yours looks like they've added some front end poke to the new one. Whats the distance front of mast to front edge of the wing on the two fuselages?

looks like theyve changed all the joints too, added a few bolts too.

Details Requested
Front Edge Wing to front of mast 115 plus = 435mm
Front Edge Wing to front of mast 115 Std = 335mm
5 bolts in the front wing, no worries with torsional loads
Cheers
Tony

Cheers for that. Looks like improvements everywhere on what was a well built foil to begin with

if you're ever thinking of selling it (since you just bought it) gimme a call

Select to expand quote

Robertos said..
Here is a (French) review of the new F4:
windfoilfan.glissattitude.com/reviews/107

Yes I had read that review, everything they said rang true,
Bearing in mind I have no experience on race gear at all Zero Zip
I would add that both 1000 and 900 wings thrive on power, the stronger the conditions the more they rise to challenge and stability is amazing

Select to expand quote

Subsonic said..

tonyk said..

Subsonic said..
Ive got a previous model F4 with a 120 fuse. Just looking at yours looks like they've added some front end poke to the new one. Whats the distance front of mast to front edge of the wing on the two fuselages?

looks like theyve changed all the joints too, added a few bolts too.

Details Requested
Front Edge Wing to front of mast 115 plus = 435mm
Front Edge Wing to front of mast 115 Std = 335mm
5 bolts in the front wing, no worries with torsional loads
Cheers
Tony

Cheers for that. Looks like improvements everywhere on what was a well built foil to begin with

if you're ever thinking of selling it (since you just bought it) gimme a call

No worries, I think this one will be with me for many years...
If you want any further info feel free to PM me
Cheers
Tony

F4 on the Water

Tonyk what differences have you found between the race wings and freeride wings?, like upwind angles versus crosswind, wind min. needed to get up, maneuverability. How much pumping to get up in light versus stronger wind. The NP glide probably did not require any pumping. I have thought about getting a race wing for my AFS foil, but very happy with the AFS freeride wings so not sure it would be worth the expense since I would also need a different stab. for the race wing.

Select to expand quote

tonyk said..
-1000 wing 2sec 23.8kts, Duck gybe Alpha 19kts
-900wing 2sec 25kts, alpha std gybe 21

When did you get the F4? Seems like you had 22 knot sessions back in October. Where they on the F4 or another setup?

Select to expand quote

Sandman1221 said..
Tonyk what differences have you found between the race wings and freeride wings?, like upwind angles versus crosswind, wind min. needed to get up, maneuverability. How much pumping to get up in light versus stronger wind. The NP glide probably did not require any pumping. I have thought about getting a race wing for my AFS foil, but very happy with the AFS freeride wings so not sure it would be worth the expense since I would also need a different stab. for the race wing.

I don't like to pump, the 1000 wing goes early enough,
F4 is designed to go to wind so it does it much better,
I sail flat water and don't find the F4 too limiting in maneuverability for the type of sailing I do

Select to expand quote

boardsurfr said..

tonyk said..
-1000 wing 2sec 23.8kts, Duck gybe Alpha 19kts
-900wing 2sec 25kts, alpha std gybe 21

When did you get the F4? Seems like you had 22 knot sessions back in October. Where they on the F4 or another setup?

I have had the F4 race for 4 weeks now
Prior to that in the October 2020 I had a NP glide with
Slim Medium Wing if I wanted to go over 20

Okay, thanks tonyk

I just had to use your tracks as an example of what can be done on a race foil for a blog post at boardsurfr.blogspot.com/2021/02/fun-with-polar-plots-fin-freeride-foil.html . The angles you're getting are pretty amazing!

Select to expand quote

boardsurfr said..
I just had to use your tracks as an example of what can be done on a race foil for a blog post at boardsurfr.blogspot.com/2021/02/fun-with-polar-plots-fin-freeride-foil.html . The angles you're getting are pretty amazing!

Wow Thanks, I have not been trying to point so far,
so this is a good sign that F4 has got some racing legs in the right hands

Select to expand quote

seanhogan said..
how many much in oz ???

Hi Sean
As there is currently no agent for F4 in Australia I made the purchase direct from F4 Europe
Prices are displayed on the F4 website and it is easy to calculate the AUD from that
Hope this helps
Visit
www.f4foils.com/products/windsurf/windsurf-race/

Cheers
TK

I can get close to the same angles with my AFS F770 wing, little less with the F1080, was using homes on the waters edge as a reference point for upwind angles.

Select to expand quote

Sandman1221 said..
I can get close to the same angles with my AFS F770 wing, little less with the F1080, was using homes on the waters edge as a reference point for upwind angles.

Unless you use a GPS it's impossible to accurately measure VMG based on angle.

Select to expand quote

Grantmac said..

Sandman1221 said..
I can get close to the same angles with my AFS F770 wing, little less with the F1080, was using homes on the waters edge as a reference point for upwind angles.

Unless you use a GPS it's impossible to accurately measure VMG based on angle.

Tell that to Magellan!

Gotta remember, VMG is BOTH speed AND angle. Net vector speed to the mark at whatever angle and speed we can muster. Yes, you have to enter the coordinate of the mark and let the gps device, if set to VMG, calculate and display your VMG to that mark.

Select to expand quote

Sandman1221 said..

Grantmac said..

Sandman1221 said..
I can get close to the same angles with my AFS F770 wing, little less with the F1080, was using homes on the waters edge as a reference point for upwind angles.

Unless you use a GPS it's impossible to accurately measure VMG based on angle.

Tell that to Magellan!

Sure, whatever, your narrow board and freeride foil is producing just as much VMG as a race set-up. Starting to wonder if you realize how foolish your posts sound.

Thanks for all your inputs

I'll raise another interesting point about the F4 front wings
Both are quite high aspect
The 1000span wing has a cord 120 and is 945m2 area
The 900span wing has a cord of 120too and is 850m2 area
This seems a little less area for the span compared some to other brands I looked at.
But I guess on closer inspection we would need to look also at the cross section profile & thickness

Cheers
TK

Select to expand quote

Grantmac said..

Sandman1221 said..

Grantmac said..

Sandman1221 said..
I can get close to the same angles with my AFS F770 wing, little less with the F1080, was using homes on the waters edge as a reference point for upwind angles.

Unless you use a GPS it's impossible to accurately measure VMG based on angle.

Tell that to Magellan!

Sure, whatever, your narrow board and freeride foil is producing just as much VMG as a race set-up. Starting to wonder if you realize how foolish your posts sound.

But Sandman made no claims that I can see about his VMG.


And you get green thumbs?

Select to expand quote

Grantmac said..

Sandman1221 said..

Grantmac said..

Sandman1221 said..
I can get close to the same angles with my AFS F770 wing, little less with the F1080, was using homes on the waters edge as a reference point for upwind angles.

Unless you use a GPS it's impossible to accurately measure VMG based on angle.

Tell that to Magellan!

Sure, whatever, your narrow board and freeride foil is producing just as much VMG as a race set-up. Starting to wonder if you realize how foolish your posts sound.

I never said anything about VMG, thanks for pointing that out Ian K, I only said I can get a similar angle to the wind, but depending on a GPS sounded funny considering what sailors did in the old days.

Actually this is a very interesting discussion. Guys in Seattle discuss, too. Angles. The only good way I can really see my angles is to look at the gps track once back off the water, and I have uploaded the track to some app that displays it (like strava). At my foiling sites, I can see from shoreline how high I have gone, but I also can see how slowly I got there.

Hey Sand, if you add a race wing without changing anything else on your AFS setup, you might not notice what it can really do. You might need to get a longer fuselage and smaller stab, too.

One thing about F4. They make really really good stuff. They have a pretty good fleet of San Francisco foil racers as their de facto team riders.

Hi Everyone,

Thanks for the super nice comments! We've gone slightly smaller on the 1m wing compared to last year, however moved the wing forward relative to the board. This geometry has its trade offs and one reason why some of the guys now are course racing without rear footsteps. You need to be so much further forward with your rear foot and most aren't using rear straps downwind. In SF racing with strong wind however, some riders are using the inside rear strap and hooking in, which has its risks.

Br,
Chris