As the title says....when does a brand have a right to say their boards are eco friendly?

I see all these new bio resins and resins made from sap and mung beans blah blah...but they are still poisonous and bad for the environment.

I have a mate that does it....but I disagree with the mindset that a product that will poison a human and the environment can be call3d eco friendly.

hand carve one out of a chunk of cultivated untreated Date Palm or Balsa ..... and then hope 30 peasants didn't expire hauling your board out of the Plantation geez hipster resin

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chrispy said..
As the title says....when does a brand have a right to say their boards are eco friendly?

What a great question. I love it how MacDonalds can pay a fee to the heart foundation to get the big tick - plus many many other examples.
Some of the bigger businesses like Patagonia are trying things and communicating with the public. The Aussie based ones just pay lip service because they have to. There are lots of businesses in the UK and Europe that are trying their best as well and in the US - especially on the West Coast. In terms of boards - well there is a lot of room to say that some products are more economically sustainable than others but in terms of a fully eco board - not yet. Not by a long way. And an even longer way before we will see it in the front of most stores in this country.

When you strip that statement back - Eco-friendly - it means that it is not harmful to the environment. Now that is a big ask. Anyone who is claiming that right now should be hung out to dry unless they are doing something revolutionary and not told us about it. Then they should be hung out to dry for not communicating it !!! If you were really hardcore about this you would struggle to even call a wooden board with natural resins eco friendly depending on how it was made. Just saying.

Great topic Chrispy. I would hope this would get more legs than a shark thread As at least we can control this one to some extent if we chose to.

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thePup said..
hand carve one out of a chunk of cultivated untreated Date Palm or Balsa ..... and then hope 30 peasants didn't expire hauling your board out of the Plantation geez hipster resin

,you could be right Pup!... http://www.treetosea.com.au/green-surfboards.html

Pro surfing organisers talked about the possibility of changing pro surfing criteria to have standards made from "eco friendly" materials. You raise an interesting point Chrispy dude, in that the alt builds are possibly not so eco friendly as portrayed. Possibly marketing strategy for the sheeple to to follow.

They say & well it is true. Pro's & semi pro's &.....even guys on this forum cough cough lol... go through a lot of boards.

I think it would be way more interesting to have the pro's select a quiver prior to the years title race & register those boards as their chosen boards.

THat would decrease the huge number of boards they go through & really make people look hard at boards. These days boards can be popped out a lot easier with the aid of machines which should decrease the chance of farking shaping & I think a lot of fave board selection comes down to board ridden on the day.

Thing about surfing is even just one break can have so many moods, people themselves can have so many moods & combinations of the them can effect board choice.

Thus I doubt limiting board selection for a comp year would be too detrimental, make it more interesting & give boards more of a chance imo

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MickPC said..

Thus I doubt limiting board selection for a comp year would be too detrimental, make it more interesting & give boards more of a chance imo

What an original thought ! ! They effectively do this in motor racing these days - restrictions on tyres, testing days, engine changes etc - don't watch this by the way - but often read / hear it talked about.....Americas Cup in sailing has similar restrictions etc lots of places.

I think though that the comments by Felipe's shapers comments are probably what will stop anything like this unless the public start to demand it - which I can not see for a while - for some strange reason - well maybe not - surfers are inherently selfish

Has Felipe ever dug a rail

Marcio Zouvi, of San Diego-based Sharpeye, is the guy behind Felipe Toledo’s ridiculous glass-slipper air boards. Marcio says he is sympathetic toward the concept of eco-friendly boards and can see a marketing advantage in some independent stamp of goodness.But he thinks any push to regulate CT pros’ board materials “would backfire, big time”.“We’re always on the lookout for different materials. But when it comes to the CT guys, my only focus is on performance.“We’ve given Filipe every option, every combination of materials, and he’s found that he likes a certain blank, a certain type of wood (stringer), PE glassing, that gives him the flex he wants to feel. That’s the fastest car for him and we wanna see the fastest car.”The alternative, he thinks, may be an embarrassment to the sport. “We’re gonna see people digging rails, we’ll be going ‘What’s happening here? It’s a horrorshow!’”

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I think it would be way more interesting to have the pro's select a quiver prior to the years title race & register those boards as their chosen boards.

Moto GP and f1 are already doing it... for different reasons though. But as was pointed out to me the amount of technology that drifts down comes from a lot of those sports. Opens up a can of worms come snapped board time...but again they don't give a rats in f1 as it is classed as driver failure...if that is the case would it then limit what moves the pros are willing to do in order to keep a quiver going....actually I'm liking it

I think are the big boys starting to trip now that firewire and slater are making them nervous....

Why are the big money boys with their eco team riders not investing more in a earth friendly technology...is money the only thing stopping them? Or is it they can only shape potato chips and are/or not smart enough/interested enough to take the challenge? As in they just want our money and they slant the hype for what they want...or like the eco hipsters not being with their hands above the table in order for the marketing $

Some Eco buyers.

I doubt there will ever be eco friendly, but i guess some brands can claim to be more Eco than others..

Maybe they should place an environmental levy on new boards based on their Eco design criteria. Oh hang on Mac will be broke and filing for bankruptcy within a year

Eco Friendly are just Buzz words...

To call any board manufacturer Eco Friendly is within the law...as they might adopt some practices that are Eco Friendly i.e. using 5 star energy equipment..reducing waste to a minimum..using maximum daylight etc etc...but I'd think no manufacturer produces boards that don't impact on the environment at all..

The early Hawaiians made Eco friendly boards as in thin slabs of timber..but I don't think they would generate much interest these days

Pawlonia hollow timber boards rubbed with oil would go closest I reckon...

Pawlonia is sustainably grown


Good topic hippy

Any board, regardless of how much or how little its component parts or manufacturing processes are considered Eco friendly, is insignificant in its carbon footprint, when compared to its use over its lifecycle.

Let’s disregard the carbon embodied within the board as a result of its manufacture and start from when the board is purchased by us for use and let’s just try to capture a few of times when we indirectly embody carbon into the board:

> We turn on the computer to order the board, Carbon

>A car, truck, train or plane delivers it to us, Carbon

>We buy wax to wax it up, Carbon

>We buy a board bag some new fins and a new leash, Carbon

>We drive to the beach with it, Carbon

>We take it overseas with us in a plane and deposit jet fumes in the high atmosphere, the worst place possible, Carbon

> Other than having a bio degradable board that we can bury at the end of its life to help grow a tree, even recycling adds, Carbon

> Etcetera (infinitum)

Our pastime is inherently damaging to the environment as are so many others.

Anyone know of a good biodegradable board that will last 10 years
I’m in the market and I want to make people think I’m an eco-warrior, but only to attract chicks

Oh no, I just remembered, I’m going to need to drive to their place to get laid, Carbon

Bugger

That's Gold

Obct how can making anything better for the environment be insignificant?

Cars have laws to lower emissions...and yes this could go on and on....

anything being done for a cleaner planet will never be insignificant in my eyes

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surfbroker said...
That's Gold

Im trying to find where it is?

To answer the post title..

When the marketing team says so...

What a worthless and meaningless term Eco friendly has become.

Need will be driven by consumers and the pros. I don't see any change for a long while.

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chrispy said..
Obct how can making anything better for the environment be insignificant?

Cars have laws to lower emissions...and yes this could go on and on....

anything being done for a cleaner planet will never be insignificant in my eyes

I'll start at the end, consumption is the problem, we need to consume less than this planet is able to provide, and that's not likely to happen, regardless of the amount of sustainable practices we employ. In some ways, we make it worse because big business have discovered how lucrative sustainability is, and here's the good bit for business, governments all around the world legislate to ensure sustainable practices, which encourage destruction of the old and replacement with the new.

I could use buildings as an example, but I'll go with cars, I once had all these exact figures down on paper but now I must try to get close to them from memory:

The carbon contained within a new car is the sum total all the carbon required to manufacture it, this includes such minor items as the fuel that the miner used the morning he went to work in the Pilbura to dig up the iron ore that was shipped to china to make the steel that was shipped to Japan to make the car that was shipped back to Australia to be taken to the dealership for us to buy.

I've seen estimates that a car needs to be on the road for up to 25 years for there to be a net benefit to the environment, as opposed to recycling it after 10 years and putting all that carbon back into its successor. Hands up those of us that drive a car that's 25 years old? my hands remain in my keyboard.

www.burkesbackyard.com.au/fact-sheets/conservation-the-environment/save-the-car/
www.theguardian.com/environment/green-living-blog/2010/sep/23/carbon-footprint-new-car
www.circularecology.com/carbon-footprint-v-embodied-carbon.html

Now many people can build and Eco friendly car, or a surfboard, the question is, "does that take into account the embodied carbon lifecycle of the car or surfboard?".

we know in the case of cars, it does not, unless we a) keep the car for many years & b) use it infrequently and rely heavily on public transport.


So for me, a really eco friendly surfboard does not relate so much to the materials or manufacturing but more to the amount of time you keep it and how you dispose of it.

Here's one more fun fact about modern cars that's quite interesting in terms of how legislated sustainability has helped the car industry make more money.

40 years ago, the national average for fuel consumption was around 11.7 L/100 klms (it may have been more, it may have been less I can't remember what the exact number was because only the next statistic is the important one).

We then had 40 years of astounding automotive developments in terms of engine management, design emissions control and manufacture that has allows us to arrive at a new national average. 11.7 L/100 klms.


That's right, same number, that's why me not remembering the exact number is not important.

Why?

Because for any given engine capacity, the overall weight of a vehicle has increased due to legislated change relating to required safety items and a more robust body construction.

it's a win win for the car companies, law makers say old cars must come off the road because they energy inefficient and unsafe, new ones are made, more and more carbon is embodied into them, the planet suffer

That's why I gave up on environmentalism some years ago and began to think more like a neo Malthusian

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malthusianism

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chrispy said..
Obct how can making anything better for the environment be insignificant?

Cars have laws to lower emissions...and yes this could go on and on....

anything being done for a cleaner planet will never be insignificant in my eyes

I completely agree with this comment. If we have a choice why not..

But the question is what point/price will people take the option I like the idea of the Timber Teck FW's and for my next FW it will help make my purchase decision ... But i don't think too many people will take the idea of Eco friendly too seriously. Especially as has been mentioned, many Environmental NGO's out their are giving Green Ticks for sustainability based on large $$$ donations to their organisations..

"Eco Friendly", its kinda like "Diet Coke"

How ' eco' are wetties?

Wouldn't imagine neoprene being that quick to break down?

It's been a while......

The eco thing is a classic,
i was invited to speak at a rally to protest offshore exploration off the coast of Margaret River a while back.
i declined on the basis of hypocrisy, when asked how that was the case I pointed out, everyone was using, rubber tyres on their diesel run landcruisers, planing on eating snaggers on a gas fuelled barbie promoting the gathering with banners and stickers to people with rubber wetsuits and fibreglass watercraft among other things. So to me it was definately hypocritical to protest against something that was the key basic ingredient for the petrochemical based products that were the catalyst for everything these surfers used in their pursuit of happiness.

its like we want the benefits.....but not in my back yard.

i think ink it's great that various manufacturers are moving towards are more environmentally friendly product what pisses me off the most thought..... is it generally costs more for people to purchase "environmentally friendly" or "eco safe" products As opposed to Ecco horror products.

There is some great stuff happening with wetsuits now, long overdue but it's happening at least.

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SP said..
How ' eco' are wetties?

Wouldn't imagine neoprene being that quick to break down?

Some are trying to get good with better use of natural rubber. Something at least, hopefully they'll get good at it????

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Surf69 said..
It's been a while......

The eco thing is a classic,
i was invited to speak at a rally to protest offshore exploration off the coast of Margaret River a while back.
i declined on the basis of hypocrisy, when asked how that was the case I pointed out, everyone was using, rubber tyres on their diesel run landcruisers, planing on eating snaggers on a gas fuelled barbie promoting the gathering with banners and stickers to people with rubber wetsuits and fibreglass watercraft among other things. So to me it was definately hypocritical to protest against something that was the key basic ingredient for the petrochemical based products that were the catalyst for everything these surfers used in their pursuit of happiness.

its like we want the benefits.....but not in my back yard.

i think ink it's great that various manufacturers are moving towards are more environmentally friendly product what pisses me off the most thought..... is it generally costs more for people to purchase "environmentally friendly" or "eco safe" products As opposed to Ecco horror products.

There is some great stuff happening with wetsuits now, long overdue but it's happening at least.

I think your selling yourself a little short their Damo. Oil and gas we all use and i understand it needs to be drilled or dug up, BUT some places are simply too dangerous to do so. Deepwater of the Marg's coast or even South Australia for that case, were simply never going to be smart options. The clean up in case of a spill due to the rocky coast line was too difficult. The lack of infrastructure to help clean up after a spill was virtually non existent.

Has anyone tried the new Algae Tail pads yet or know anyone who has

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jbshack said..

Surf69 said..
It's been a while......

The eco thing is a classic,
i was invited to speak at a rally to protest offshore exploration off the coast of Margaret River a while back.
i declined on the basis of hypocrisy, when asked how that was the case I pointed out, everyone was using, rubber tyres on their diesel run landcruisers, planing on eating snaggers on a gas fuelled barbie promoting the gathering with banners and stickers to people with rubber wetsuits and fibreglass watercraft among other things. So to me it was definately hypocritical to protest against something that was the key basic ingredient for the petrochemical based products that were the catalyst for everything these surfers used in their pursuit of happiness.

its like we want the benefits.....but not in my back yard.

i think ink it's great that various manufacturers are moving towards are more environmentally friendly product what pisses me off the most thought..... is it generally costs more for people to purchase "environmentally friendly" or "eco safe" products As opposed to Ecco horror products.

There is some great stuff happening with wetsuits now, long overdue but it's happening at least.

I think your selling yourself a little short their Damo. Oil and gas we all use and i understand it needs to be drilled or dug up, BUT some places are simply too dangerous to do so. Deepwater of the Marg's coast or even South Australia for that case, were simply never going to be smart options. The clean up in case of a spill due to the rocky coast line was too difficult. The lack of infrastructure to help clean up after a spill was virtually non existent.

Has anyone tried the new Algae Tail pads yet or know anyone who has

Agreed ....yet the foot print of offshore oil and gas exploration is fairly insignificant in comparison to many but as you say the real danger is when something stuffs up then the consequences to the environment are significant.

Offshore drilling for some reason has been allowed to go ahead is some of Western Australias most pristine and fragile environments and has proven to be possible to have minimal and most cases zero impacts on the environment.........BUT one stuff up could be catastrophic consequences for some pestilence ecosystems. The environmental values at stake are far greater in areas of the North West of WA where drilling campaigns have been completed as opposed to those threatened for example in the area that was considered off the Margaret River coast. Not saying it's right mind you, just putting it into perspective.....but again...just one stuff up and everyone loses just like in the Gulf of Mexico.

The reality is we are unlikely to see further exploration in the near future in the South of West Oz or continental shelf in South Oz given the significant cost and logistical challenges. The current price for oil and gas will see a lot less exploration for a while to come, so that should be comforting for many.

www.theinertia.com/surf/wetsuits-are-nasty-and-patagonias-attempting-to-clean-them-up/

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Surf69 said..

jbshack said..

Surf69 said..
It's been a while......

The eco thing is a classic,
i was invited to speak at a rally to protest offshore exploration off the coast of Margaret River a while back.
i declined on the basis of hypocrisy, when asked how that was the case I pointed out, everyone was using, rubber tyres on their diesel run landcruisers, planing on eating snaggers on a gas fuelled barbie promoting the gathering with banners and stickers to people with rubber wetsuits and fibreglass watercraft among other things. So to me it was definately hypocritical to protest against something that was the key basic ingredient for the petrochemical based products that were the catalyst for everything these surfers used in their pursuit of happiness.

its like we want the benefits.....but not in my back yard.

i think ink it's great that various manufacturers are moving towards are more environmentally friendly product what pisses me off the most thought..... is it generally costs more for people to purchase "environmentally friendly" or "eco safe" products As opposed to Ecco horror products.

There is some great stuff happening with wetsuits now, long overdue but it's happening at least.

I think your selling yourself a little short their Damo. Oil and gas we all use and i understand it needs to be drilled or dug up, BUT some places are simply too dangerous to do so. Deepwater of the Marg's coast or even South Australia for that case, were simply never going to be smart options. The clean up in case of a spill due to the rocky coast line was too difficult. The lack of infrastructure to help clean up after a spill was virtually non existent.

Has anyone tried the new Algae Tail pads yet or know anyone who has

Agreed ....yet the foot print of offshore oil and gas exploration is fairly insignificant in comparison to many but as you say the real danger is when something stuffs up then the consequences to the environment are significant.

Offshore drilling for some reason has been allowed to go ahead is some of Western Australias most pristine and fragile environments and has proven to be possible to have minimal and most cases zero impacts on the environment.........BUT one stuff up could be catastrophic consequences for some pestilence ecosystems. The environmental values at stake are far greater in areas of the North West of WA where drilling campaigns have been completed as opposed to those threatened for example in the area that was considered off the Margaret River coast. Not saying it's right mind you, just putting it into perspective.....but again...just one stuff up and everyone loses just like in the Gulf of Mexico.

The reality is we are unlikely to see further exploration in the near future in the South of West Oz or continental shelf in South Oz given the significant cost and logistical challenges. The current price for oil and gas will see a lot less exploration for a while to come, so that should be comforting for many.

......Hey post some pics of your trip man