There is emerging evidence to show that the Gut-Brain connection is a lot more important than was previously understood. It is unfortunate
that the dietary recommendations as espoused by the governing bodies is built on inconclusive evidence with some very shoddy science to
accompany it. Such has been the misinformation that has been spread to the masses we now know that Professor Ancel Keys was way off mark
and it has been unfortunate that the high carb low fat protocol to stem from this would seem to suggest that this has been an enormous and
contributing factor in burgeoning obesity levels.

It is indisputed that rates of obesity have never been higher than what they are now.

Cholesterol is a very POOR indicator of cardio vascular disease and the research suggests that any focus on establishing a connection between the
two, that is to petition that cholesterol is a causative factor in CVD is simply not backed up. To put it simply there are people who will do with high
cholesterol levels who show CVD but this has to be balanced by the sample of people with negligible cholesterol who also have CVD so establishing
causation is highly problematic.

Anyone with even a small understanding of insulin resistance knows that ANY sugar ingestion whether it be from carbs or fruit will always invoke an
insulin response which must further result in fat cell storage. Thats just the nature of the game. We also know that becoming fat adapted is inherently
beneficial to the extent that ketosis(NOT ketoacidosis) is the preferential state to be in resulting in smoother energy release.

The pharamceutical industries and grain growers association has a vested interest in maintaining the status quo. Infer from that what you will.

You can NEVER exercise your way out of a bad diet. Abs are made in the kitchen.

95% diet and 5% exercise is what you can realistically aim for to get into and maintain a very healthy shape.

Cheers Ozzie

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ghost4man said..

You can NEVER exercise your way out of a bad diet. Abs are made in the kitchen.

95% diet and 5% exercise is what you can realistically aim for to get into and maintain a very healthy shape.

Cheers Ozzie

Interesting... I would have thought that you need more exercise to get a better shape.

I personally have great abs - they are just covered by a cm of fun and happiness.

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Downwinder said...

G'day AndyR this is my play-lunch for work (I love my sardines). If you make your own lunch and not buy take-away you'll save $100 a week times that by 52 weeks thats some fun Holiday money

Good work PHIL you have it worked out for sure. Yes my lunch box looks much like that also most days though less fruit and more chicken/beef/salmon and veg.

The reason I choose take away ON TOP of that instead more of the good stuff is a choice I make for a few reasons.
My average working day is at least 3 or 4 of them 7 days in the working week are 12/13 hrs in a office an hour drive to cbd each way to get there. I then try do some sort of exerise most days try study for uni try fit in 6hrs sleep and then spend as much time as I can with my two kids toddler and a teenager oh and the wife oh and on seabreeZe haha. At present I happily choose to spend no more time in a woolworths and no more time in the kitchen as I do preparing more food so I can do all of the above. Non of that is ever used an an excuse about being time poor cause I'm not I just use my time differently. every single thing I do is by choice happily (besides getting some new race boards as wife has better ideas apparently for money) haha

Now I'm 30 next week I'm sure that metabolism will start to slow soon and I'll have to be more careful. I also rarely drink more than 3 to 4 beers or wines in a month. Which is key for me


Side note are abs really made in the kitchen? Eating the right foods doesn't mean you suddenly grow and build and amazing strong core with abs that look like you should be in a fitness mag. Couple Guys at my gym have the biggest arms shoulders etc an in our boxing sesh feel like I'll die when they connect in the head but there cores get no attention and it shows when they get hit there. My take
Abs aren't made in the kitchen at all.
Abs are made from hard bloody physical core exercises. My core I feel is strong at present I have half decent definition and I'm sure if I dropped another 3/4kg body fatt just below 80 I would have them completey showing. But that isn't a need or want for me at the moment.

AndyR try this bloke Eddie Barron is a weapon if you want a good core strength workout. It's worth the money I have a spare unopened DVD & book still in it's international package for $50. To buy this on line will cost you $129
eddiebaran.com/gymnastic-abs.html

This is another great workout Animal Kingdom Conditioning I do the bear in the back yard and I'm buggered just after 4 minutes.

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cantSUPenough said...

ghost4man said..

You can NEVER exercise your way out of a bad diet. Abs are made in the kitchen.

95% diet and 5% exercise is what you can realistically aim for to get into and maintain a very healthy shape.

Cheers Ozzie

Interesting... I would have thought that you need more exercise to get a better shape.

I personally have great abs - they are just covered by a cm of fun and happiness.

if that were the case then we would see overwhelming evidence that purely focusing on the physical side gives the best possible outcomes when that is not the case. In fact you would argue that you could eat poor and simply offset with rigorous exercise but the science most assuredly does not show this.

Sorry to be a pain in the butt on this, but the thing is-you see a lot of these 80%/20% etc percentages thrown around. None of them have any grounding whatsoever in science. Many studies have shown diet intervention to be more effective in the short term for weight loss, but exercise is needed for long term weight loss. A few papers have even found the opposite, which makes sense in terms of calorie balance, but is generally too difficult for the majority of people to adhere to. It has also been shown that diet alone, especially if calories are restricted, can have long lasting detrimental impact on metabolic rate, which is part of the reason that exercise needs to be used in conjunction with weight loss.

I could ramble for days about this-but that is WEIGHT LOSS-it's easy to get it confused with HEALTH, but they are very different. Exercise is important for so many other reasons down to a biochemical level, most related to disease risk. I was asked to give a seminar on this last year with part of my message being that I feel it is better to think of weight loss, or "getting in shape" as a by-product of using exercise to avoid being dead-which is a bit of a harsh statement, but we need to think about exercise as an important part of our make up and not something we do until we lose x amount of kilos or can see our biceps or abs grow. Diet and exercise are both important, and sometimes for different reasons, but both effecting the whole person, which is difficult to study empirically.

I realise I'm putting more than my 2 cents worth in here-I reckon I'm up to a dollar or so, but I am passionate about this stuff and get annoyed with so much media led rubbish about diet and exercise. I hope my rants come across in the positive manner I want them too :)

Here's a couple of articles for some light reading-just to balance the scales a little
journals.lww.com/acsm-essr/Citation/2000/28040/Exercise_Alone_Is_an_Effective_Strategy_for.5.aspx
An easier way to look at the above review www.unm.edu/~lkravitz/Article%20folder/exandwtloss.html
This is the study I was looking for but can't find it-article instead www.newsmax.com/Health/Diet-And-Fitness/exercise-diet-weight-loss/2015/04/03/id/636327/

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Movement Lab said..
Sorry to be a pain in the butt on this, but the thing is-you see a lot of these 80%/20% etc percentages thrown around. None of them have any grounding whatsoever in science. Many studies have shown diet intervention to be more effective in the short term for weight loss, but exercise is needed for long term weight loss. A few papers have even found the opposite, which makes sense in terms of calorie balance, but is generally too difficult for the majority of people to adhere to. It has also been shown that diet alone, especially if calories are restricted, can have long lasting detrimental impact on metabolic rate, which is part of the reason that exercise needs to be used in conjunction with weight loss.

I could ramble for days about this-but that is WEIGHT LOSS-it's easy to get it confused with HEALTH, but they are very different. Exercise is important for so many other reasons down to a biochemical level, most related to disease risk. I was asked to give a seminar on this last year with part of my message being that I feel it is better to think of weight loss, or "getting in shape" as a by-product of using exercise to avoid being dead-which is a bit of a harsh statement, but we need to think about exercise as an important part of our make up and not something we do until we lose x amount of kilos or can see our biceps or abs grow. Diet and exercise are both important, and sometimes for different reasons, but both effecting the whole person, which is difficult to study empirically.

I realise I'm putting more than my 2 cents worth in here-I reckon I'm up to a dollar or so, but I am passionate about this stuff and get annoyed with so much media led rubbish about diet and exercise. I hope my rants come across in the positive manner I want them too :)

Here's a couple of articles for some light reading-just to balance the scales a little
journals.lww.com/acsm-essr/Citation/2000/28040/Exercise_Alone_Is_an_Effective_Strategy_for.5.aspx
An easier way to look at the above review www.unm.edu/~lkravitz/Article%20folder/exandwtloss.html
This is the study I was looking for but can't find it-article instead www.newsmax.com/Health/Diet-And-Fitness/exercise-diet-weight-loss/2015/04/03/id/636327/

This is simply not the case as you suggest in the above. I wont go into the exact science here but exercise cannot ever overcome a bad diet. You simply do not put weight on to the point of obesity as a result of ZERO exercise or little exercise. This shows a poor understanding and not only that is stuck in the energy in energy out paradigm which is without any basis. The reason why people put weight on in the first place and why obesity is such a modern disease which afflicts predominantly the western world is as a result of the dietary recommendations which promote the above paradigm as well as this farcical low fat dogma which does not work. If it did Movement Lab then we wouldnt be having this conversation. Why? Because people would simply exercise away a bad diet. That doesnt work. We know for a fact that the current dietary protocols stem from very shoddy and unsupported science by Professor Ancel Keys which were never proven! Thats the reality. What you are petitioning for is something very prevalent in the fitness industry which promotes increasing levels of exercise to initiate weight loss. What epidemiological studies can you refer to of any substance which proves this especially on a long lasting level. Why do you think caloric restriction does not work? Because your body goes into auto mode and slows the resting metabolic rate to account for what it sees as famine. It also explains why people come out of dietary restrictions by putting on more weight than what they previously had. This is actually a natural rebound effect. Exercise IS important but you have to address why the person is overweight first and foremost and simply attributing that to exercise is garbage. Once you do this you will be drawn into the realm of leptin and insulin resistance which plays the determinant factor in weight gain and loss.

I think you may have missed my point. I don't prescribe to the calorie balance equation, but it certainly has some merit, and should be considered in any good weight loss intervention. I'm not sure if you need to point out that people become obese due to not exercising-my understanding in this area is much more than you assume. As a peer reviewed author, I would actually prefer it if you did go into the science please. I'm happy if you message me any questions, as I am sure I could help you to understand this all a little better. I would be especially keen to see the research that has indicated dietary recommendations as THE reason for obesity.

I don't want to turn it into a diet vs exercise debate-I have already pointed to the importance of both-separating them is ignorant. You completely missed my point about health related exercise. Anyway, as I said I'm quite passionate about this area-but too busy to have online arguments about it. I'm happy for you to stick with your 95% 5% paradigm if it works for you. Cheers.

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ghost4man said..

cantSUPenough said...

ghost4man said..

You can NEVER exercise your way out of a bad diet. Abs are made in the kitchen.

95% diet and 5% exercise is what you can realistically aim for to get into and maintain a very healthy shape.

Cheers Ozzie

Interesting... I would have thought that you need more exercise to get a better shape.

I personally have great abs - they are just covered by a cm of fun and happiness.

if that were the case then we would see overwhelming evidence that purely focusing on the physical side gives the best possible outcomes when that is not the case. In fact you would argue that you could eat poor and simply offset with rigorous exercise but the science most assuredly does not show this.

I think that Movement Lab is better qualified to respond, as he has done, but my point was not that you have to "purely focus" on the physical side - you have to get the balance right to be fit, healthy and in "good shape".

Select to expand quote

Movement Lab said..
I think you may have missed my point. I don't prescribe to the calorie balance equation, but it certainly has some merit, and should be considered in any good weight loss intervention. I'm not sure if you need to point out that people become obese due to not exercising-my understanding in this area is much more than you assume. As a peer reviewed author, I would actually prefer it if you did go into the science please. I'm happy if you message me any questions, as I am sure I could help you to understand this all a little better. I would be especially keen to see the research that has indicated dietary recommendations as THE reason for obesity.

I don't want to turn it into a diet vs exercise debate-I have already pointed to the importance of both-separating them is ignorant. You completely missed my point about health related exercise. Anyway, as I said I'm quite passionate about this area-but too busy to have online arguments about it. I'm happy for you to stick with your 95% 5% paradigm if it works for you. Cheers.

The struggle is real movement lab RE: evidence base hey? - nice to see another health professional on here that's keen on SUP!!! I'm an EP too but went to the dark side and did a physio degree. Been watching this thread with interest

You gotta laugh at the current obsession with superfoods , seems they come up with one everyday that only grows in siberia or the andesi found one the other day , it only grows in remote southwest tasmania its called the Karot full of antioxidents minerals ect ect its also apparantely very good fore eyesight.same with fitness trends what was old becomes new again , do this program or that program , cardio is no good, lactate training is best , blah blah blah.who knows it probably all works.one thing i do know if you want to be good at something then do it over and over again.so if you want to be a good paddler then spend most of your fitness work paddling , good runner run , big muscles lift weights.

Hey CarterSUP Physio-good to see you on here too. Do you practice as an EP too? I think I've hijacked this thread enough now, but yep, the struggle is real! I usually get drawn into these sort of things because I see so many clients have been misled and have delayed progress, or at worst, actually come to harm due to misinformation in the media.
Teatree my cycnical science side agrees with you! You might like this read on antioxidants-www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/antioxidants/
I think the idea is that the more remote the "superfood" the weirder the name so the more expensive it can be! Karot sounds real pricey ;)

well after doing the brunswick to mullumbimby 10k i realize im not very fit and need to drink some more karot juice , take some spiralina , drop a few krill capsules , eat a bunch of chia seeds and i should be sweet for the next race.

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teatrea said..
well after doing the brunswick to mullumbimby 10k i realize im not very fit and need to drink some more karot juice , take some spiralina , drop a few krill capsules , eat a bunch of chia seeds and i should be sweet for the next race.

tear drops from Tibetan yaks


get with it

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teatrea said..
well after doing the brunswick to mullumbimby 10k i realize im not very fit and need to drink some more karot juice , take some spiralina , drop a few krill capsules , eat a bunch of chia seeds and i should be sweet for the next race.

teatrea don't you eat cigarettes for fuel also I believe, so I hope your on the Winfield Reds or your not fuelling your lungs appropriately

I'm Blood Type O people would always say I'm over training but Blood Type O people tend to go that little bit further without fatiguing.
I'm a meat lover I enjoy a good Steak or kangaroo Steaks or Fish, I'm not a lover of chicken or bacon though.
I eat on average around 70 kilo of Steak per year. But Michael Moseley British television journalist on biology and medicine says the average person should not eat anymore than around 35 kilos of meat per year.

Michael Moseley


I found this a very interesting book to read I read it about 6 years ago

I'm interested in having a read of this one (I'm just curious)


But like I said before who cares what anybody eats (you are what you eat) I've had close mate who have had heart attacks and died or have had Triple by-pass surgery in there 40's and 50's (so young) only because they have eat the wrong foods and being over weight. I eat like a Mallee Bull I just graze all day, Like if I got lost in the bush I'd most probably die of starvation within half hour.

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Downwinder said..

teatrea said..
well after doing the brunswick to mullumbimby 10k i realize im not very fit and need to drink some more karot juice , take some spiralina , drop a few krill capsules , eat a bunch of chia seeds and i should be sweet for the next race.

teatrea don't you eat cigarettes for fuel also I believe, so I hope your on the Winfield Reds or your not fuelling your lungs appropriately

No winnie reds mate port royal , mellowed with rum and wine. If your going to smoke may as well go top shelf. I contemplate giving up every day but truth is i enjoy it too much and i still have enough lung capacity to enjoy a surf and the odd race. If it kills me fair enough you cant live forever anyway.

Did anybody watch Michael Mosley on SBS at 8:30PM last night, Very interesting.

The Truth About Exercise.
www.sbs.com.au/ondemand/video/11889219955/Michael-Mosley-The-Truth-About-Exercise

Whether it’s running, swimming, cycling, or hula hooping, we have always been told that doing regular exercise is one of the keys to a healthy and happy life. Our one-size-fits-all approach to maintaining an active, healthy lifestyle is very rarely questioned, but with recent advances in genetic testing technology and brain stimulation techniques, scientists are uncovering the new and surprising truths about what exercise is really doing to our bodies, and why we all respond to it differently. In this program, Michael Mosley uses himself as a human guinea pig to discover the truth about exercise.

I caught it. Found it Very interesting.
The thing that caught me was the test on "neat" I have an office job and sit down for hours on end before getting up and walking around the office and in total often in the office for more than 12 hours a day. Contrast to 4 years ago when I was in the field and would easily of walked average 7km a day just while working.
Certainly put weight on soon after starting the office job from memory..

I'm a fan of HIIT training but also a sucker for a long endurance run or paddle cause that just makes you feel alive though I know from personal experience my own body has responsded better to HIIT type training over more traditional longer timed less intense type training..

Wouldn't it be great to be able to get DNA tested to find out if your own body would responsed or not like he did.

Thanks for your post. I just watched it. Wish I could do the DNA test...

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cantSUPenough said..
Thanks for your post. I just watched it. Wish I could do the DNA test...

G'day cantSUPenough Michael Mosley is a regular on SBS maybe keep an eye out and mark it on the TV Guide, I'd rate the bloke extremely high he's so on to it.

Have a look into it with your GP, I believe the DNA test is around $150

I doubt you would need a DNA test to see which training your suited too. Just work out your predisposition for fast or slow twitch muscle fibres. If you are good at sprinting jumping lifting heavy things. Then hIT training will give you good results , if you can walk run bike swim all day long you are naturally more suited to longer slower intensities. But yu do see studies where they say slow twitch can be converted to fast switch , but i dont believe it. Like most things i think moderation in training is the key and to keep it interesting mixing things up. As they say sprinters are born not made , same with distance athletes. Training for sup is interesting because races can be very long down to very short sprints. So this makes it hard to train specifically for one particular type of race. while most races are quite long even bop races , so i would think suppers would be better suited to more long distance training than HIT.Any way my two cents

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teatrea said..
I doubt you would need a DNA test to see which training your suited too. Just work out your predisposition for fast or slow twitch muscle fibres. If you are good at sprinting jumping lifting heavy things. Then hIT training will give you good results , if you can walk run bike swim all day long you are naturally more suited to longer slower intensities. But yu do see studies where they say slow twitch can be converted to fast switch , but i dont believe it. Like most things i think moderation in training is the key and to keep it interesting mixing things up. As they say sprinters are born not made , same with distance athletes. Training for sup is interesting because races can be very long down to very short sprints. So this makes it hard to train specifically for one particular type of race. while most races are quite long even bop races , so i would think suppers would be better suited to more long distance training than HIT.Any way my two cents

I agree with what you’re saying teatrea same with flexibility. There are 2 types hypermobile means a high level of flexibility, hypomobile means a decreased levels of flexibility. These levels of flexibility are genetically determined at birth & do not change throughout life. The determining factor is the “stretchiness” of the collagen fibres in the body. The more stretchy these fibres the more hypermobile you will be, the more stiff these fibres the more hypomobile you will be. Hypermobiles like to stretch, Hypomobiles usually hate it! You can improve your flexibility by stretching, but you can’t turn a hypomobile into a hypermobile & visa-versa.

I hate stretching I’m hypermobile so I never stretch I can touch my toes thats about as much stretching as I’ll EVER DO. I’m old school run onto the football field cold and warm up as you go.

My fifth vertebrae in my lower back is f#@#@ed from surfing all my life. I was 34yo when my back went on me I could not walk without crying it was brutal I tried everything from Yoga to a chiropractor. The best remedy that helped me for my back was a pair of gravity boots. The best bit of money I have ever spent on my health “Yes Please Mr Wizard, Pain Pain Go Away” when I feel my back is going on me I throw the gravity boots on hang upside down after about 4 minutes I feel my back go back into place and feel like a grommet once more.
“lets go play”

Downwinder,
looking at your play lunch is like watching one of supthecreeks winter surf sessions - "we are not worthy..."
What do you recommend for 10 days of Maui morning surfs and afternoon Maliko runs?

+ 1 for gravity boots i have them too.im the opposite of you im pretty flexable and love to stretch.unfoetunately i never had much endurance but have good speed endurance.i would be very intetested to see the training programs of conner , travis and danny ching.i would rekon they spend little time in the gym and when they arrnt paddling sup they are paddling oc,s.and racking up lots of klms.

Great Thread

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teatrea said..
+ 1 for gravity boots i have them too.im the opposite of you im pretty flexable and love to stretch.unfoetunately i never had much endurance but have good speed endurance.i would be very intetested to see the training programs of conner , travis and danny ching.i would rekon they spend little time in the gym and when they arrnt paddling sup they are paddling oc,s.and racking up lots of klms.

OC1's bores the s##t out of me. Why sit-down when you can stand-up it's just the surfer in me talking. Unlike you teatrea I have much endurance it must the the O positive blood in me, I to have good speed endurance for interval training only and can run very fast for 10k for a 53yo but then I'm done. I may not look like Arnold Schwarzenegger or have the speed of the Elite, but I give myself credit for my strength and I spend NO TIME in a GYM but I do, do a lot of core strength exercises. Core Strength training is brutal but so effective, I love it.

Connor, Travis and danny Ching's training program would not be much different than from what you and I do. I know what training you have to do! and you train with the Currumbin Peter Dorries Quantum Coaching crew. I know Travis is a OC1 freak but does not surf a surfboard. Connor does not have to work which would help with recovery plus Connor has SUPed before he was even a teenager and has been coached by the best on Maui.

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Helmy said..
Downwinder,
looking at your play lunch is like watching one of supthecreeks winter surf sessions - "we are not worthy..."
What do you recommend for 10 days of Maui morning surfs and afternoon Maliko runs?

G'day Helmy have plenty of Vegetables, Bananas, and fruit with a BIG Sirloin Steak at the end of the day for dinner while wash it down with a $18 carton of Corona's "the best beer on the planet at that price"