Ive started riding a foil assist (a home made version of the Duotone waist setup) and have been using my old Axis gear. Mostly a PNG1150 & Progressive 400 tail, but now I'm starting to ride waves (the bumps at Mooloolaba) and find the PNG turns like a brick . So after a next progression and ideally looking to ride in the surf (non breakng). Any recommendations. I am after something that can extend the session.. so god glide and pump but can also curve (more mellow carving.. nothing too full on). Any recommendations?

I spoke to a bloke who loves his Armstrong HA980 and finds is carves really well and pumps great. He thought the MA's didn't pump (and glide) nearly as well.
So looked up the nearest equivalent from Axis looks like the ART v2 999. Looks like a good option.

Also I'm on an old aluminium mast... so now wondering if i am to move to a carbon mast should i move over to Armstrong or Code while at it???

Might be a religious debate. But interested to hear others thoughts.
Thanks
Tim

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thuffam said..
Ive started riding a foil assist (a home made version of the Duotone waist setup) and have been using my old Axis gear. Mostly a PNG1150 & Progressive 400 tail, but now I'm starting to ride waves (the bumps at Mooloolaba) and find the PNG turns like a brick . So after a next progression and ideally looking to ride in the surf (non breakng). Any recommendations. I am after something that can extend the session.. so god glide and pump but can also curve (more mellow carving.. nothing too full on). Any recommendations?

I spoke to a bloke who loves his Armstrong HA980 and finds is carves really well and pumps great. He thought the MA's didn't pump (and glide) nearly as well.
So looked up the nearest equivalent from Axis looks like the ART v2 999. Looks like a good option.

Also I'm on an old aluminium mast... so now wondering if i am to move to a carbon mast should i move over to Armstrong or Code while at it???

Might be a religious debate. But interested to hear others thoughts.
Thanks
Tim

Just had my first session on the new Axis Surge 1010, even though it is smaller than the ARTv2 1099 it has great lift and a super early start. This is due to the high camber foil section that the ARTv2 doesn't have.
This gives a longer runtime and less power required to get going.

Im on foildrive 1099v2 with surf skinny 300 when its small
then put on the surge 950 when its bigger
i can flat water start the 1099v2 but need wave assist to get the surge 950 flying
the surge and surf skinny is an awsome combo so smooth turny and very forgiving
im 100kg using axis 5' 8"foildrive board

I used png910 to start stable easy
moved to art2 999 really good smooth and glidey

but going down in stab size makes a Hugh difference

no need for carbon mast to set with imho

tha being said gone to armie for the integrated mast, loving it

+1 on the ART 999 V2 & 400 progressive rear on the ali mast but the new Surge 950 would be the best pick (but more glide from the ART) . Definitely benefits in moving to an integrated carbon mast and now would be the time to switch as you are not in too deep with one brand. Axis definitely will have what you need but just had a fire in their USA warehouse and lost the first shipment of the new integrated mast , just tragic. Armstrong MA's are the go all round BUT the HA's do have more glide but don't surf like the MA's . The new Code X series is also another good choice the X985 would be the one BUT again these are really good surf wings if you are more after glide the 980s would be for you. I pretty well have FD on everything so any questions fire away.

Kudos to Piros for 10k wave count and all-round frother and riding everything

Here in NZ retailers have stock of both Axis and Armstrong integrated carbon masts.

Sad to hear about the fire at Axis USA

Have the ART V2 1099 and was looking at the 999. Saw and spoke to Adrian before Xmas and he suggested the Surge 950. With the higher camber than the V2 and positive rider feedback it's my next front wing.

Yes I'm Axis biased but Armstrong make awesome gear as well ??

Thanks all for your feedback. Much appreciated.
I think i really need to get a couple front foils.. one for gliding on the mellow bumps at mooloolaba and another for surf on the open beach and at CottonTree.
But chatting with guys riding Armstrong they seem to find the HA suprisongly good all-rounder with great glide.
And likewise guys riding Codes seem to find the S series similar but more carvey and a bit less glidey and interestingly dont feel the need for the X (to be fair only chatted to a couple guys).

At what point in ones progression do you size down?
Someone today suggested, once you're good, that a ballpark figure is going for (modern) foils with a cm2 of 10x your weight. At the moment my old BSC890 tends to want to throw me off when speed picks up going down a face (prob due to 1290cm2 and my lack of skill) - but i am finding it easier when going faster.
Its so hard to know which way to go as so many oppinions out there.. and so much good gear.

What mast length is recommended for foil assist?
Thanks again.

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thuffam said..
Thanks all for your feedback. Much appreciated.
I think i really need to get a couple front foils.. one for gliding on the mellow bumps at mooloolaba and another for surf on the open beach and at CottonTree.
But chatting with guys riding Armstrong they seem to find the HA suprisongly good all-rounder with great glide.
And likewise guys riding Codes seem to find the S series similar but more carvey and a bit less glidey and interestingly dont feel the need for the X (to be fair only chatted to a couple guys).

At what point in ones progression do you size down?
Someone today suggested, once you're good, that a ballpark figure is going for (modern) foils with a cm2 of 10x your weight. At the moment my old BSC890 tends to want to throw me off when speed picks up going down a face (prob due to 1290cm2 and my lack of skill) - but i am finding it easier when going faster.
Its so hard to know which way to go as so many oppinions out there.. and so much good gear.

What mast length is recommended for foil assist?
Thanks again.

If you are not Kai Lenny spending a fortune will not improve how well you foil but will make it a bit more comfortable and you feel better in the carpark when people are looking at your gear. I know from bitter experience have dropped a lot of cash on foils. The mast is not holding you back at the level you are at. Try to demo a range of foils if you can. That will help you narrow it down. Pretty sure you can get an adapter to fit Code to Axis mast which may be an option as well. For what waves you are describing the Code s series would be perfect or the new Axis Surge with a more progressive tail.

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thuffam said..

I spoke to a bloke who loves his Armstrong HA980 and finds is carves really well and pumps great. He thought the MA's didn't pump (and glide) nearly as well.

Might be a religious debate. But interested to hear others thoughts.
Thanks
Tim

The MA's absolutely do pump, and they will give great glide, but if you go the surf tail it needs to be shimmed 0.5-1 deg though as its offset for proning.

I am riding 890 and 790 for downwinding with the para and have just sold all 3 of my HA's, I can comfortably get 3.5-5k runs on foil most sessions on the MA and they are by far the most fun I have had wave carving.

hope that complicates your decision making further

Just to add to the confusion the new Armstrong UHA foils just dropped and amazingly they still surf . This is my first run in the waves. ?si=GWE5scq0TV6vwcqJ

Thanks again everyone - some really good advice - very much appreciated.

I've just picked up a ART v2 999 locally (wow talk about streamlined!) - this will at least get me where I want to right now. Then I can progress with a different tail, then move to an advanced fuse etc... then probably go with a smaller Surge down the track when I get more dialled in. This path also makes sense financially.

@Piros.. you must be living the dream trying out all that new gear!

Oh, what tail should I get for the 999? I have a 425 Progressive which will prob do for now.. but I suspect this is too big. I'm still new to this.. so nothing too radical.

Yeah lots of fun with the new gear, the 425 will be fine for now.

Just tried it at Mooloolaba on the flat with small bumps . Not sure why people say the ARTs are hard.. I found it almost identical to my old BSC890. In fact I didn't notice much difference between the two other than the 999 turns better and is much easier to balance (which is also opposite to what I've read - weird). Also it uses the same amount, if not more battery than the BSC (when cruising at speed) - also opposite to what it should do??
So I suspect this is more of a user problem.
Any suggestions to technique. For example while I could catch the bumps ( that were only a couple feet high) I couldnt keep up with them when on foil (no motor).
I added a little negative tail shim that improved it a little.
I suspect most battery used while motoring around - and not sure if I was doing this today but the other day someone said I had the nose pointing too high.
Using old Short Black fuses and 425 progressive tail and 75cm 19mm aluminium mast. Motor at 20cm
Thanks

Select to expand quote

thuffam said..
Just tried it at Mooloolaba on the flat with small bumps . Not sure why people say the ARTs are hard.. I found it almost identical to my old BSC890. In fact I didn't notice much difference between the two other than the 999 turns better and is much easier to balance (which is also opposite to what I've read - weird). Also it uses the same amount, if not more battery than the BSC (when cruising at speed) - also opposite to what it should do??
So I suspect this is more of a user problem.
Any suggestions to technique. For example while I could catch the bumps ( that were only a couple feet high) I couldnt keep up with them when on foil (no motor).
I added a little negative tail shim that improved it a little.
I suspect most battery used while motoring around - and not sure if I was doing this today but the other day someone said I had the nose pointing too high.
Using old Short Black fuses and 425 progressive tail and 75cm 19mm aluminium mast. Motor at 20cm
Thanks

Those Mooloolaba swells move quite fast as they aren't breaking so you need fast foils to keep up. Your rear stab is quite large, this really slows you down, try and borrow a smaller rear stab and give that a go.
The 999 requires more speed to create the same lift as your BSC890, so you will chew the battery more. As the span and AR get higher, the battery charge life is extended but turning is effected by the wide spans so you need to size down your stab even more.
My go to is the Fireball 1070 paired with the short fuselage and Skinny 30. Gives about 45 min of runtime upwind/downwind.

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airsail said..

thuffam said..
Just tried it at Mooloolaba on the flat with small bumps . Not sure why people say the ARTs are hard.. I found it almost identical to my old BSC890. In fact I didn't notice much difference between the two other than the 999 turns better and is much easier to balance (which is also opposite to what I've read - weird). Also it uses the same amount, if not more battery than the BSC (when cruising at speed) - also opposite to what it should do??
So I suspect this is more of a user problem.
Any suggestions to technique. For example while I could catch the bumps ( that were only a couple feet high) I couldnt keep up with them when on foil (no motor).
I added a little negative tail shim that improved it a little.
I suspect most battery used while motoring around - and not sure if I was doing this today but the other day someone said I had the nose pointing too high.
Using old Short Black fuses and 425 progressive tail and 75cm 19mm aluminium mast. Motor at 20cm
Thanks

Those Mooloolaba swells move quite fast as they aren't breaking so you need fast foils to keep up. Your rear stab is quite large, this really slows you down, try and borrow a smaller rear stab and give that a go.
The 999 requires more speed to create the same lift as your BSC890, so you will chew the battery more. As the span and AR get higher, the battery charge life is extended but turning is effected by the wide spans so you need to size down your stab even more.
My go to is the Fireball 1070 paired with the short fuselage and Skinny 30. Gives about 45 min of runtime upwind/downwind.

What approx weight are you airsail interested as you say your go to is the 1070 FB for FD,which i love for higher wind winging/parawing but never tried for FD yet but I'm 100 kgs was thinking my 1250FB for FD hmm maybe 1070FB got me thinking?

Select to expand quote

pitbulldoug said..

airsail said..

thuffam said..
Just tried it at Mooloolaba on the flat with small bumps . Not sure why people say the ARTs are hard.. I found it almost identical to my old BSC890. In fact I didn't notice much difference between the two other than the 999 turns better and is much easier to balance (which is also opposite to what I've read - weird). Also it uses the same amount, if not more battery than the BSC (when cruising at speed) - also opposite to what it should do??
So I suspect this is more of a user problem.
Any suggestions to technique. For example while I could catch the bumps ( that were only a couple feet high) I couldnt keep up with them when on foil (no motor).
I added a little negative tail shim that improved it a little.
I suspect most battery used while motoring around - and not sure if I was doing this today but the other day someone said I had the nose pointing too high.
Using old Short Black fuses and 425 progressive tail and 75cm 19mm aluminium mast. Motor at 20cm
Thanks

Those Mooloolaba swells move quite fast as they aren't breaking so you need fast foils to keep up. Your rear stab is quite large, this really slows you down, try and borrow a smaller rear stab and give that a go.
The 999 requires more speed to create the same lift as your BSC890, so you will chew the battery more. As the span and AR get higher, the battery charge life is extended but turning is effected by the wide spans so you need to size down your stab even more.
My go to is the Fireball 1070 paired with the short fuselage and Skinny 30. Gives about 45 min of runtime upwind/downwind.

What approx weight are you airsail interested as you say your go to is the 1070 FB for FD,which i love for higher wind winging/parawing but never tried for FD yet but I'm 100 kgs was thinking my 1250FB for FD hmm maybe 1070FB got me thinking?

I'm 81kgs on a 5'2 x 26ltr trench board. Depending on board size I doubt the 1070 will get you planing unless you have the Fusion. I have Fireballs 1070-1500 for demo but I guess your not in Oz.

Wow.. i managed to get that 999 flying properly today.. on a low tide with some better runners coming into Mooloolaba.. so much fun.

Using a longer mast (82cm) certainly helps as it gives more room to move.

Yes i definitely need to get a smaller stab.
Should i go for a Progressive 375 or a Skinny (if so what size?)

And at what point does one move to the advance plus fuse (Axis).. the one with mast closer to the front wing.

Thanks again

For me the bigger the front wing the smaller the tail. My smallest foil works best with a bigger tail. 375 or smaller with you foil, the longer the fuse, the smaller the tail you need. My biggest foil works best with a tiny tail. Don't be afraid to go smaller than you think possible.

I once lost my tail with the original 1150 and rode it thinking something wasn't right, wasn't till I got to the carpark did I realise the screws weren't done up probably, and it went for a solo swim. But it still rode but in super pitch sensitive mode. Wouldn't have been saying the same on a small foil.

Try the smallest you can demo with the 999 and spend 3 sessions before you decide if it works or not. But it will be faster.