This thing looks slick:

www.surfshop.fr/blog/duotone-foil-assist/#_Toc194676058

As someone who used the original FDA+ with a waist mounted battery, I can say FINALLY!

I'm not a huge fan of efoil assists in general these days (they are making a mess of our local lineups) but having tested most of the setups, I can confidently say removing that weight off the board was a huge improvement in performance bringing it slightly closer to a "real foiling" feeling.

Having an OEM with warranty, waist mounted option seems like a better choice than dumping money into boards with big channels dug out of the base (which still end up as heavy setups)

Nice looking rig well designed . I'll be getting a chance to test next week or so . Just looking at the specs the batteries and motor are only the size and capacity of the original Foil Drive Assist but not the plus and way off the new Max Gen 2 . The DT batteries are pretty small (159.6wh) the 2 of them combined only just add up to the FD sport (332 wh) which I only get 30min tops out of but they are airline friendly which is a big plus but you'll need heaps . The DT is also only 22.8v 7ah Vs FD 40v 15ah huge difference. I doubt it will flat water prone start without wave assist on surf foils but for winging it looks good . There is buoyancy in the cable to help offset the batteries weight strapped to your body but I'm still pretty unsure how I'd feel getting flogged in waves with that on.,Plus if you had a battery fault that turned into fire lithium burns under water . Anyways I'll post more once I've tested it . Over all very well thought out neat looking rig . It does have mast adapters but not sure what other brands are compatible .

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Piros said..
Nice looking rig well designed . I'll be getting a chance to test next week or so . Just looking at the specs the batteries and motor are only the size and capacity of the original Foil Drive Assist but not the plus and way off the new Max Gen 2 . The DT batteries are pretty small (159.6wh) the 2 of them combined only just add up to the FD sport (332 wh) which I only get 30min tops out of but they are airline friendly which is a big plus but you'll need heaps . The DT is also only 22.8v 7ah Vs FD 40v 15ah huge difference. I doubt it will flat water prone start without wave assist on surf foils but for winging it looks good . There is buoyancy in the cable to help offset the batteries weight strapped to your body but I'm still pretty unsure how I'd feel getting flogged in waves with that on.,Plus if you had a battery fault that turned into fire lithium burns under water . Anyways I'll post more once I've tested it . Over all very well thought out neat looking rig . It does have mast adapters but not sure what other brands are compatible .

It's aimed directly at the high performance surfer, someone who would ride the Slim Performance rather than the Max. Depending on how they connect the batteries it's either 22.8v or 45.6v, if the later it will have plenty of power.
But, as it is called an assist I suspect it is 22.8v, enough to push you onto a wave and then zero board weight.
As you said Rob, Foildrive would never attach a lipo battery to someone's body, just too dangerous especially used in salt water.

My guess is the 2 batteries are connected in series. They are claiming 33kg of thrust. Can't see that happening at 22v

Looks pretty sick to me too! Can't wait to see what you have to say about it Piros!
319WH and 33kg thrust so directly comparable to the Max Sport FD, but on a much lighter board, and with the foil closer to you. Easier on a long carry to the beach also. 45 minute recharge corresponds to coming in for a sandwich
If you're prepared to risk being chopped to pieces by an exposed propeller I don't see why you'd baulk at risking being burnt to death while actually in the ocean? FD has great runs on the board, but Duotone has a great reputation to protect.
Anyway, we live in exciting times!!!
Then again, I could just watch my superannuation flush down the gurgler

At least if the Duotone battery's set fire you can quickly dump the belt and still paddle in on the board. If Foildrive sets fire your board is toast and you're swimming

Is that like taking a wipeout with a diving belt on?

SKY RAMA has been rocking a belt setup for a few years:

Do any of these "Foil Assist" ever catch fire while in use?

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leepasty said..
At least if the Duotone battery's set fire you can quickly dump the belt and still paddle in on the board. If Foildrive sets fire your board is toast and you're swimming

Yep with my setup I was one quick release buckle away from ditching it from my waist.

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Chasing Bumps said..
Is that like taking a wipeout with a diving belt on?

I barely noticed it when on me (where as I definitely noticed the weight when it was mounted on the board)

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foilthegreats said..
SKY RAMA has been rocking a belt setup for a few years:

There was probably half a dozen of us that I know of that were after the lightest, least compromised assist setup at the time, the community kind of disbanded when gen2 rolled in

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Fishdude said..
Do any of these "Foil Assist" ever catch fire while in use?

We had a couple of FDA+ batteries "catch fire" but it was more a puff of smoke not a full blown inferno. The original batteries were pretty bodgy though with no real waterproofing, I'd say the tech/construction of them would have come a fair way since.

Considering the average skill level of a foil assist user I'd say they have bigger concerns dodging the foil, props, other people in the water, than the very slim chance there's an issue with a battery you can quickly ditch.

That remote is slick.

Looks like an exciting setup. I think it is important to understand that there is a big difference between Lithium Ion (which is what FD uses) and Lithium-Ion Phosphate (which it looks like is what DT will be using). Lithium-Ion Phosphate is far more stable and safer than Lithium Ion, but heavier for the same capacity. I think weight is more of an issue for FD and safety is more of an issue for DT which is why they have chosen those chemistries. Lithium-Ion Phosphate batteries also last for many more cycles then Lithium-Ion batteries.

So what happens when you are in the water trying to climb on your board or you fall off away from the board, do you sink like a stone with the weight around your waist ? Like a weighted dive belt.

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camerongraham said..
So what happens when you are in the water trying to climb on your board or you fall off away from the board, do you sink like a stone with the weight around your waist ? Like a weighted dive belt.

This!

I don't like the idea of it. I get the intention of making the board lighter. But, yeah, legropes break. Then you have a weighted dive belt AND no flotation device too.

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camerongraham said..
So what happens when you are in the water trying to climb on your board or you fall off away from the board, do you sink like a stone with the weight around your waist ? Like a weighted dive belt.

As it's a sealed airtight unit I expect it has enough buoyancy to float the weight of the battery's especially with the padding on the belt

With my FD waist setup the air inside the box made it neutral buoyant so sinking wasn't an issue. But it did take a few goes to get used to the extra weight on my body when going from prone to standing. I eventually gave up on the idea as the cable/leash arrangement was problematic, hopefully Duotone have fixed this issue.

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airsail said..
With my FD waist setup the air inside the box made it neutral buoyant so sinking wasn't an issue. But it did take a few goes to get used to the extra weight on my body when going from prone to standing. I eventually gave up on the idea as the cable/leash arrangement was problematic, hopefully Duotone have fixed this issue.

What exactly was problematic about the cable leash setup?

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martyman said..

airsail said..
With my FD waist setup the air inside the box made it neutral buoyant so sinking wasn't an issue. But it did take a few goes to get used to the extra weight on my body when going from prone to standing. I eventually gave up on the idea as the cable/leash arrangement was problematic, hopefully Duotone have fixed this issue.

What exactly was problematic about the cable leash setup?

Getting the perfect length of the leash to stop the cable from being pulled. Maximum cable length is 2mts, bairily enough to run from your pod to your waist when standing. Yes I could have extended the cable further but gave up and bought the Gen 2. This mean I could now ride smaller faster wings which turned out to be a bigger benefit than a waist mounted battery.

I see the Duotone drive is on a road trip up the east coast (of Oz). I'm trying to get an idea of runtime as our upwind/downwind sessions can be brutal on battery runtime. FD Gen 2 max power has a capacity of 498.69Wh, the Duotone drive 319.2Wh, seems the runtime will be way down, less than any max battery.

Is it possible the runtime is actually better than just looking at Wh?

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airsail said..
I see the Duotone drive is on a road trip up the east coast (of Oz). I'm trying to get an idea of runtime as our upwind/downwind sessions can be brutal on battery runtime. FD Gen 2 max power has a capacity of 498.69Wh, the Duotone drive 319.2Wh, seems the runtime will be way down, less than any max battery.

Is it possible the runtime is actually better than just looking at Wh?

With less thrust and more efficient motor you'd get longer runtime for same Wh. Not sure how the Duotone compares on those two.

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airsail said..
I see the Duotone drive is on a road trip up the east coast (of Oz). I'm trying to get an idea of runtime as our upwind/downwind sessions can be brutal on battery runtime. FD Gen 2 max power has a capacity of 498.69Wh, the Duotone drive 319.2Wh, seems the runtime will be way down, less than any max battery.

Is it possible the runtime is actually better than just looking at Wh?

Where did u see that?

Unfortunately I stuck a drill through my hand and missed out on a demo but I got to see the kit . On face value it's really well built and the waist harness has buoyancy built in which off set the battery weight . Speaking to guys that rode it they said took a bit to get used to weight around waist and the remote but after a while it felt good . Boards look really nice and well made and is also Foil Drive compatible , battery times varied between riders but hard to get a fair comparison as riders were swapping over so I'll leave that until I try., Price wise same as FD max Gen 2 and same with extra battery's . It only has a two blade prop but it is geared and deploys really smoothly.

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airsail said..
I see the Duotone drive is on a road trip up the east coast (of Oz). I'm trying to get an idea of runtime as our upwind/downwind sessions can be brutal on battery runtime. FD Gen 2 max power has a capacity of 498.69Wh, the Duotone drive 319.2Wh, seems the runtime will be way down, less than any max battery.

Is it possible the runtime is actually better than just looking at Wh?

I rode it a few weeks ago on the smallest board and Duotone glide foil which felt great. As to upwind/downwind I think FD will give you better run time. I think you can expect to get an easy hour surf foiling as you will be able to pump more efficiently as the board/foil/motor was extremely light the battery on my waist was no issue. It did take time to get use d to the remote but after a few sessions you will have it dialled. Would I replace my FD no not after one session.

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Piros said..
Price wise same as FD max Gen 2 and same with extra battery's . I

I heard price the same but that is including integrated Ali mast, carbon mast extra 800 e

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leepasty said..

Piros said..
Price wise same as FD max Gen 2 and same with extra battery's . I

I heard price the same but that is including integrated Ali mast, carbon mast extra 800 e

Yes, the price is similar to the Gen 2 but yo do get the alloy intergrated mast with the kit. Only the alloy mast has adapters available for other brand foils, if you go carbon yo must use Duotone gliders.

Hi Guys,
We're super stoked about this new product and the feedback from testing has been amazing.
If you've got any questions let me know

In terms of battery life its varied depending on how you use the product, your weight and foil sizes.
At 75Kg i get around an 1 hour of upwind-downwinds on a 900 foil.
In the surf, motoring out -> riding in constantly, I get 45min on a 750 foil. if i got up to a 900 i can get over an hour, if i go down to a 620 i'll get ~35min.
(The charge time is only 45min so if you've got an extra set charging you can go all day)

In terms of thrust/power it's had no problem getting everyone whos tested up on flat water. I can easily flat water start heading out on the 620, w/ 38L midlength. Having no drag on the bottom of the board is the real key here when compared to other brands. Comparing rare specs, voltage, watts etc doesn't show the full picture.

Again, any questions let me know (for pricing and availability talk to your local dealer, this product is not released yet)

I had a ride yesterday afternoon using the 1100 front wing and 5'8"Fish board. I weigh 93kg and it was effortless to get up. Tom is right in terms of battery life, the lack of drag must be considered. The drag issue of the FD compared to the DTFD was more than I thought it'd be.
I was impressed with the power and simple operation. Didn't notice the back pack with batts after 5 mins. I did instantly notice the lack of weight of the board/foil rig when lifting it up to carry to the water.

I like the fact that you can put any glider on the Alu mast setup. Also like the back pack thingy. It floats when you're in the water and you really don't feel its weight as you lie prone semi submersed before take off. It didn't present much a problem popping up. Take off was easier than FD with no battery case drag which amplifies the upward thrusting of the board when power is on. Just made it easier. (this could also have been heavily influenced by the bigger board (58lt) than I normally am used to (40lt).

The setup is cheaper than FD but run time is a bit less, so adding a second battery brings the price up to match FDG2. Run time roughly the same as charge time so a second battery may be required depending on how you are using it. For DW, it won't be a thang, but for surfing a break ...

There are still pro's and Cons' for both FD and DTE, but I think Duotone have a really polished well thought out piece of gear which will undoubtedly challenge FD.

DM

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DuotoneAUS said..
(for pricing and availability talk to your local dealer, this product is not released yet)

Sooo @ActionSportsWA my local dealer what are we looking at for this setup Darren..??