G'day all..still very much a lurker on here (which I do feel bad about!) however I do try to stay off the interweb as much as possible. I simply have too many boat related projects ongoing and time at the moment is very limited. Once I am at a point where I feel that I have time to back off a bit (do we EVER haha?)I do intend to post my trials and tribulations on here ( I have taken ALOT of pics along the way).. Seabreeze has been a great help in the past.
Anyway back to the problem at hand: after getting my water pump off the engine (3 bolts? 3 hours. I don't think the pump had been off the engine block since 1983 when it was installed!!) to rebuild it, there are some worrying yet subtle grooves in the shaft and I have read on various forums that the shaft should be replaced if so which I concur also. Does anyone have any good recommendations for where I can buy those hard to get/rarely requested Yanmar spare parts in the Sydney area? This is the first part I have run into trouble buying.
I know as it is Yanmar I will need another bank loan (lol), I am waiting on a quote from the USA and there is one I can get from the UK for around $250AUD...Have also sent a few emails out this morning..which leads me to the second question: when should the water pump be replaced as a whole (and it includes the shaft?)? As mine is 40+ years old, rarely serviced/rebuilt I am somewhat leaning towards buying a new pump for peace of mind and rebuilding that at appropriate intervals whilst keeping the current one as a spare..Aftermarket $500/Yanmar $660. I may have answered my own question there!
Thanks in advance

RE. there are some worrying yet subtle grooves in the shaft and I have read on various forums that the shaft should be replaced if so which I concur also

Could you post photos of the shaft?
Is the pump shaft leaking/weeping externally?
Do you have water in your engine oil that would indicate leakage into the crankcase via the seals?
If the damage on the shaft is in the bearing surface and not the seal surface the shaft could be reusable.
If the shaft is really gone I will look for one for you here in Japan.



RE; I know as it is Yanmar I will need another bank loan (lol), I am waiting on a quote from the USA and there is one I can get from the UK for around $250AUD...Have also sent a few emails out this morning..which leads me to the second question: when should the water pump be replaced as a whole (and it includes the shaft?)? As mine is 40+ years old, rarely serviced/rebuilt I am somewhat leaning towards buying a new pump for peace of mind and rebuilding that at appropriate intervals whilst keeping the current one as a spare..Aftermarket $500/Yanmar $660. I may have answered my own question there!
Thanks in advance

when should the water pump be replaced as a whole (and it includes the shaft?)?
The pump housing is bronze and as long as there is no severe damage, gouges or wear it could last 100 years (not joking).
So there is not recommended replacement period on the complete pump.

rebuilding that at appropriate intervals
Now that you have the pump out and apart it would be a good time to rebuild.
The two seals, two bearings and O-ring can be bought at any bearing supply shop without paying the YANMAR surcharge.
You can make the gasket (make a spare while you are at it) and only really need a new impeller.

gary

Select to expand quote

garymalmgren said..
RE. there are some worrying yet subtle grooves in the shaft and I have read on various forums that the shaft should be replaced if so which I concur also

Could you post photos of the shaft?
Is the pump shaft leaking/weeping externally?
Do you have water in your engine oil that would indicate leakage into the crankcase via the seals?
If the damage on the shaft is in the bearing surface and not the seal surface the shaft could be reusable.
If the shaft is really gone I will look for one for you here in Japan.



RE; I know as it is Yanmar I will need another bank loan (lol), I am waiting on a quote from the USA and there is one I can get from the UK for around $250AUD...Have also sent a few emails out this morning..which leads me to the second question: when should the water pump be replaced as a whole (and it includes the shaft?)? As mine is 40+ years old, rarely serviced/rebuilt I am somewhat leaning towards buying a new pump for peace of mind and rebuilding that at appropriate intervals whilst keeping the current one as a spare..Aftermarket $500/Yanmar $660. I may have answered my own question there!
Thanks in advance

when should the water pump be replaced as a whole (and it includes the shaft?)?
The pump housing is bronze and as long as there is no severe damage, gouges or wear it could last 100 years (not joking).
So there is not recommended replacement period on the complete pump.

rebuilding that at appropriate intervals
Now that you have the pump out and apart it would be a good time to rebuild.
The two seals, two bearings and O-ring can be bought at any bearing supply shop without paying the YANMAR surcharge.
You can make the gasket (make a spare while you are at it) and only really need a new impeller.

gary

Hi Gary,

HUGE thank you for the quick response, your post is exactly what I needed.

See attached pics: green circles indicate surface blemishes such as grease/oil or rubber yet to be removed. Red indicates the issue of the grooves. They do not seem to be within the bearing locations . Yes, one bearing left on the shaft to remove and to say it's stubborn is an understatement.

Housing: I'm actually concerned there is damage internally due to where the grooves are on the shaft however today now that I'm off the boat I'll be removing both the oil seal & the water seal then giving the pump a good clean. Will post pics once done.. Both seals are unrecognisable, squashed, melted & flattened within the pump!

Pumps leaks: YES. Quite a bit of clear water has been leaking from the weep hole only when the motor is running.

Rebuilding: I am OK for that side of things, I have 2 full kits on hand.

Edit: I was tempted to just use this shaft, rebuild the pump (impeller service done already by myself) and see if it still leaks however: if there is still a leak issue etc I don't want to have to remove & disassemble again, AND I'd prefer to do it once & do it right.

I've had good service from these guys: minardsdiesel.com/
If yours was a belt-drive pump like the 2/3GM's, I'd encourage you to tidy up the shaft yourself. But given the possibility of seal failure leaking seawater into the block, I suggest you pay the nose-bleeding price for a new shaft (or get a mate with a lathe to turn one up for you). You could try a Speedi-sleeve, but I reckon the stakes are too high to fool around.

These pumps are very simple and barring catastrophic damage, you should never need to completely replace it. The wearing parts (bearings and seals) are generic and cheap, and if it's not neglected too long, any marks on the shaft will be minor and can easily be polished out with fine emery. I've done mine twice in about 15 years/1500 running hours.

Cheers, Graeme

Hi Graeme,

Cheers for the info! Ive so far had 1 company and 1 other person recommend Minards too, so might just check in with them. Re the pump on the 1GM10 it? not belt driven (luckily?). My intention was originally to tidy up the shaft myself but right now, this afternoon, it is looking like I will need to just start over with a new pump. I have spotted some damage on the inside of the pump housing and that is without yet being able to get the larger oil seal out! It had become part of the housing unfortunately. No doubt even being careful I will damage the unit. With a shaft at roughly half the cost of a new pump, I might as well buy the whole thing .

Hi marionette.
That shaft condition is not what I would call "subtle grooves or surface blemishes".
I am assuming that you were be just a little sarcastic.
Long story short, That shaft is past it.

Now for the pump housing, RE; I have spotted some damage on the inside of the pump housing and that is without yet being able to get the larger oil seal out! It had become part of the housing unfortunately.

RE Some damage on the inside of the pump housing
Do you have photos of the pump housing?
If you look at the parts diagram, part 3 is the pump cam, This is a ramp that is fitted inside the pump to give compression.
Sometimes these get worm or scored. They can be replaced.

able to get the larger oil seal out!
The whole assembly can be dropped into a pan of boiling water. The bronze will expand faster than the steel in the seal and should be an easy removal.

Just out of curiosity I will get a quote on a shaft and a complete pump.
I still think replacing the shaft and using the pump body could be doable. You pump photo will set that straight.

gary

Select to expand quote

garymalmgren said..
Hi marionette.
That shaft condition is not what I would call "subtle grooves or surface blemishes".
I am assuming that you were be just a little sarcastic.
Long story short, That shaft is past it.

Now for the pump housing, RE; I have spotted some damage on the inside of the pump housing and that is without yet being able to get the larger oil seal out! It had become part of the housing unfortunately.

RE Some damage on the inside of the pump housing
Do you have photos of the pump housing?
If you look at the parts diagram, part 3 is the pump cam, This is a ramp that is fitted inside the pump to give compression.
Sometimes these get worm or scored. They can be replaced.

able to get the larger oil seal out!
The whole assembly can be dropped into a pan of boiling water. The bronze will expand faster than the steel in the seal and should be an easy removal.

Just out of curiosity I will get a quote on a shaft and a complete pump.
I still think replacing the shaft and using the pump body could be doable. You pump photo will set that straight.

gary

Gary,

Can't thank you enough...

I was indeed being sarcastic about that shaft.. Laughter is getting me through this costly exercise!
Since my wife is not home, I can certainly use one of the Scanpan pots to boil up some water and see if that helps with the seal, will update you shortly.

I've attached the best pics I get of the inside of the pump, from both ends. Let me know your thoughts. I am more than happy to err on the side of caution here, even if it means spending substantially more $.

Definitely was time to service the pump!

Gary, these are probably the best I can do with photos of seal seats now that I've removed the last seal (cheers for the boiling water idea) Let me know what you think

Select to expand quote

Marionette said..

garymalmgren said..
Hi marionette.
That shaft condition is not what I would call "subtle grooves or surface blemishes".
I am assuming that you were be just a little sarcastic.
Long story short, That shaft is past it.

Now for the pump housing, RE; I have spotted some damage on the inside of the pump housing and that is without yet being able to get the larger oil seal out! It had become part of the housing unfortunately.

RE Some damage on the inside of the pump housing
Do you have photos of the pump housing?
If you look at the parts diagram, part 3 is the pump cam, This is a ramp that is fitted inside the pump to give compression.
Sometimes these get worm or scored. They can be replaced.

able to get the larger oil seal out!
The whole assembly can be dropped into a pan of boiling water. The bronze will expand faster than the steel in the seal and should be an easy removal.

Just out of curiosity I will get a quote on a shaft and a complete pump.
I still think replacing the shaft and using the pump body could be doable. You pump photo will set that straight.

gary

Gary,

Can't thank you enough...

I was indeed being sarcastic about that shaft.. Laughter is getting me through this costly exercise!
Since my wife is not home, I can certainly use one of the Scanpan pots to boil up some water and see if that helps with the seal, will update you shortly.

I've attached the best pics I get of the inside of the pump, from both ends. Let me know your thoughts. I am more than happy to err on the side of caution here, even if it means spending substantially more $.

remove the seal.
Drop pump housing in vinegar to remove calcium and grime.
Clean up with wire brush.
Clean inside with 300 and 600 emery and I reckon you will be pleasantly surprised.
Post photos then.

gary

Gary,

Last two pics are with the seal removed, yes vinegar is the next step as I need to see what is left over in there.

I'll put pics up tomorrow morning (9pm here at the moment)

Mark.

Hi Mark
Cannot post photos on PM so doing it here.
I have a spare anode flange for my YSE and I suspect that it is the same size as a 1GM10.
Here are the dimensions. if they are the same I will pop it in with the pump.
Not sure if a new one is readily available.

Select to expand quote

garymalmgren said..
Hi Mark
Cannot post photos on PM so doing it here.
I have a spare anode flange for my YSE and I suspect that it is the same size as a 1GM10.
Here are the dimensions. if they are the same I will pop it in with the pump.
Not sure if a new one is readily available.

AWESOME.. As soon as I'm back home from the boat I'll measure mine and get back to you

Select to expand quote

garymalmgren said..
Hi Mark
Cannot post photos on PM so doing it here.
I have a spare anode flange for my YSE and I suspect that it is the same size as a 1GM10.
Here are the dimensions. if they are the same I will pop it in with the pump.
Not sure if a new one is readily available.

AWESOME.. As soon as I'm back home from the boat I'll measure mine and get back to you

Select to expand quote

garymalmgren said..

#14 it is
Mark.

Gary,

Unfortunately no dice..

Where yours is 65.5 mine is 55.5.
Where yours is 50 mine is 41.
The only thing that matches is the anode mounting hole (M8).

Perfect! And you managed to get the flange, that's great thanks Gary

I know no one is on this post or interested, but I felt that Gary was due an absolutely huge thank you from me.
Respect.
There are still some honest, helpful people out there I guess.
Many thanks again Gary.

This what a 1GM 10 water pump rebuild looks like.
From a Japanese site.
gary