Hi McNaughtical, the main reason a boat floods when stranded is water starts entering the cockpit or over the gunwale and through an opening before she floats on the rising tide. I'm not sure how you find out your boat will refloat without actually doing it. I've tried to see if the common S&S34 will dry out and float ok but haven't found out yet.

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McNaughtical said.


Okay.... this sounds like a dumb question, but how can you make sure you can sit on both sides without flooding on rising tides?

McNaughtical. In spite of all that the OldSalts on the forum will tell you, you actually have a choice whether to run aground or carry on with poor practice in general.
Care and diligence will get you a long way in avoiding such situations as the complacent seem to find inevitable. The choice of running aground on a falling tide with the consequent danger of flooding and losing your boat is in your hands. You don't actually have to run aground.
It is also apparent that someone on the forum didn't test and apparently doesn't make a habit of closing his sea cocks when not actually using them for their intended purpose. They should be shut at all other times. The old fisherman might leave his sink sea cock open all the time but if you simply employ the practice of closing sea cocks unless they are actually being used, then shut off, you can be assured that they won't be open at an inappropriate time.
Also if a sea cock is not opened and closed regularly the ball can seize either open or closed and the spindle shear off leaving one none the wiser that the valve does not operate. Ask SouthAce about this.

I've been aground twice. Once I was caught buy an unexpected wind whilst motoring in tightish quarters and another I settled on the bottom on a lowering tide. Neither time I would say I was being complacent.

The saying "to be human" comes to mind.

As a live aboard my seacocks are on as I'm using them.

The main engine stays on as the the mains gets a run every week. It was good that I replaced the main 1 1/2 seacook for the main sulage tank but basicly it wouldn't of made much difference on or off in the risk of flooding.

The great thing is now I know , I can go aground and dry out for hull maintance !

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McNaughtical said..

southace said..

I once seen a woman sail into Mooloolaba and run aground in her new ferro fijien she hit the bank just before the duck pond around 2am. by sunrise she was asleep on the high side along side the cabin.
We tryed towing the 20 something tonne concrete with my mates 60 foot motor junk.....with no movement what so ever! I just watched! Then dads army arrived and tried again with there Shark cat and twin 140s with no avail Note by this time she was high and dry!
By 1300 the yacht was completely submerged. Following day she was pumped dry on the rising tide......
I managed to take a peak in side....full sized house hold fridge/freezer Etc......
A few cheap big battery's where exchanged to my mate that tried the tow....the rest was history!
Apparently she had no coverage for insurance and the marine yard took ownership of her new yacht!
although Im fully insured that story was in the back of my mind one I realised I was going to lay dry all night. Moral! Make sure you can sit on both sides without flooding on rising tides!
You can see my mark where I lost my Marsh anchor...she ran aground on the green island bank!
end topic

Okay.... this sounds like a dumb question, but how can you make sure you can sit on both sides without flooding on rising tides?

The awnser to your not so dumb question mc naughty call as long as you don't have risks of flooding most boats should lay on there sides on various angles with out flooding depending on design and the current conditions.

The ferro boat leaked through the leaking ports as she weight 20 tonne and had a deep keel, for me it was just like on 45degree 12 hour tack , the water got no more than a meter up the topsides.

Crikey, talk about a prophetic thread... I ran aground today coming out of Manly Harbour, before I even passed the first starboard marker, right in the leads !! I'm only a new sailor but I swear I was in the leads (but close to starboard to give all the dinghys some room).

The yacht in front of me bumped as well - and he looked like he knew what he was doing - so I'm thinking that maybe the mud floor has shifted a little?? Then again, I draw less than 1.2m, so who knows....

Some hard reverse revs didn't work pull me out until I put it on to a hard turn - don't know why that worked, but I'm glad it did as it saved me from maybe the most public grounding ever !!

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keelkicker said..
Crikey, talk about a prophetic thread... I ran aground today coming out of Manly Harbour, before I even passed the first starboard marker, right in the leads !! I'm only a new sailor but I swear I was in the leads (but close to starboard to give all the dinghys some room).

The yacht in front of me bumped as well - and he looked like he knew what he was doing - so I'm thinking that maybe the mud floor has shifted a little?? Then again, I draw less than 1.2m, so who knows....

Some hard reverse revs didn't work pull me out until I put it on to a hard turn - don't know why that worked, but I'm glad it did as it saved me from maybe the most public grounding ever !!

what do you mean by prophetic thread?
The reason you got of is you had rudder and thrust movement. Best thing to do in such situation is snake the boat back with the thrust and rudder. Unfortantly for me I was side on and the skeg had also run aground.

also are you wearing polarise sunglasses and a cap? If the waters not all mud you will see the bottom or channel 50% better than with out!

@ McNaughtical.

A yacht with a deep draught, narrow beam and low freeboard is more likely to flood on a rising tide after a dryout grounding than a yacht with a shallow draught, wide beam and a high freeboard.

The greater the angle of layover, the more likely is flooding.

However if all possible entry points for water (including hawser to anchor locker, companionway, cabin top vents etc) are sealed, the yacht should refloat.

That is as succinctly as I can put it.

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<div class="vk_ans">prophetic

<div class="lr_dct_ent_ph">pr?'f?t?k/

<div class="lr_dct_sf_h">adjective

<div class="xpdxpnd vk_gy" data-mh="-1">adjective: prophetic

<div>
<div class="lr_dct_sf_sen vk_txt">
<div>1.

<div>
<div class="_Jig">
<div data-dobid="dfn">accurately predicting what will happen in the future.

<div class="vk_gy">"his warnings proved prophetic"

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keelkicker said..
<div class="vk_ans">prophetic

I believe profound is the word you are looking for unless you meant pathetic.

Prophetic it definitely is not as I learnt these principles at the marine college during the lectures on stability. Other people knew about this long before I did.

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keelkicker said..
<div class="vk_ans">prophetic

what is this language ! I do want to learn Spanish but this one is new to me! Is it a secret code apple can't work out?

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DrRog said..
Aground at Great Sandy Straights. Love this guy's attitude. I believe he just floated off at high tide.

Bill is a bit laid back, wasn't his first grounding if I remember rightly.

That northern has gone and he has a much larger ketch now.

Thing to remember about groundings like that is to lay the boat uphill if you are on a bank otherwise you will never get afloat.

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cisco said..

I believe profound is the word you are looking for unless you meant pathetic.

Prophetic it definitely is not as I learnt these principles at the marine college during the lectures on stability. Other people knew about this long before I did.

Pathetic, from the ancient Greek word Pathos, meaning sad humour. Nothing humerous about losing your boat.

The thread seemed prophetic to him because he ran aground a few days after the thread started - thus, the thread seemed to predict his future. What's so hard to understand about that?

Cisco, he wasn't actually referring to you as a prophet - as hard as that may be to fathom!

Is that not English why do we speak such Latin/Spanish/Greek words?

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MorningBird said..
Hi McNaughtical, the main reason a boat floods when stranded is water starts entering the cockpit or over the gunwale and through an opening before she floats on the rising tide. I'm not sure how you find out your boat will refloat without actually doing it. I've tried to see if the common S&S34 will dry out and float ok but haven't found out yet.

Coamings on an SS34 would stop the water entering the cockpit. Most production yachts would be the same. Same for water entering the sinks. Its only the boats that are fitted out at home or re fitted that may not consider the placement of the sink. Designers certainly do.
This 54 foot ferro yacht broke her mooring [all chain] and sailed across the river and nosed up on a sand bar. The following day there was a high tide that should have floated her off but the water just ran over the cockpit coamings. She was eventually floated off by installing sandbags around the cockpit and pumping out the water. Insurance paid out. Month later she was back on her mooring next to my yacht [background]. Shipwright inspected her and a couple of days later she sank! She was refloated by hauling her upright, sandbags around the cockpit and pumping out.
If she had dried on a flat beach she might have kept the water out as the tide came in but nose up the beach is a different story.
[URL=.html] [/URL]

I have always treated it as a golden rule to shut sea cocks when not in use and especially when no one is on board. I have read that in some situations like a strong bow wave from a passing boat, that sea water can siphon back into the hull through an open sea cock.

A pathetic profound prophet be not I.

My seacocks are ball valves except for the head outlet 11/2" gate valve. I would suggest it's original making it 30 odd yrs old.
It works perfectly OK, although it feels a little 'slack' but is hidden in a cupboard and awkward to get to. Should I get it
changed to a ball valve or do these 'gate' types last forever. I don't think I'm 'flexible' enough these days to do it so it
would a shipwrights job at next slip.

this is a sailing school yacht with 25 kids on board at lady musgrave

Yes I have seen the South passage out of control before! Anchored one boat length forward of me in 25knots after picking up a mooring on her rudder one boat forward of me!

Thats why they call it a Sailing School, they are still learning.

Clean hull though.

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Scumbagsailor said..
Clean hull though.

With 25 kids on board, labour is cheap.

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cisco said..

A pathetic profound prophet be not I.

But you must be, Cisco - I found this just now at Double Bay.



A reminder to get y/our moorings checked!







I spoke to a Maritime Safety Officer but the one for the area is back on tomorrow morning. He was going to try to contact the owner. I hope that window doesn't let too much water in when the tide rises tonight. She needs a bit of love, this girl.

This pic is from the time when we ran aground below Mcleay Island. By low tide( few hours after this pic ) the boat was completely dry and still sitting perfectly upright. The problem was the 6ft of keel buried in the sandbank for 12 hours till the next high tide. There were a few nervous moments on the next high as we were worried she wouldn't come out, but thankfully the fin keel slid out of its new hole and off we sailed!

Shaggy, when it saw that you had posted on this thread I had a sinking moment of dread that you were going to extoll as one of the virtues of your new build that it could be beached with keel up sitting on the twin rudders while you careened the bottom.

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DrRog said..

cisco said..

A pathetic profound prophet be not I.

But you must be, Cisco - I found this just now at Double Bay.



A reminder to get y/our moorings checked!







I spoke to a Maritime Safety Officer but the one for the area is back on tomorrow morning. He was going to try to contact the owner. I hope that window doesn't let too much water in when the tide rises tonight. She needs a bit of love, this girl.

A Hood 23 at Double Bay???

A mooring minder to be sure. No wonder it corroded away with that big chunk of stainless steel in the mix.

The thin links are from sand abrasion I think, too uniform to be caused by mixed metals. The shiny shackle is probably mild steel partly polished.

This is mixed metal with a stainless mousing, note the pitting. The thin links are from sand in a strong tidal river. The mooring chain gets dragged across the sand with tide and wind changes. In some places this can occur in 12 months!
[URL=.html] [/URL]

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frant said..
Shaggy, when it saw that you had posted on this thread I had a sinking moment of dread that you were going to extoll as one of the virtues of your new build that it could be beached with keel up sitting on the twin rudders while you careened the bottom.

Hehehe...I'll be happy if I can dock the new boat without wiping out all of the neighbours let alone bumping it into an island or two in our little sandpit