Gents,
Slight thread drift, but hopefully still relevant.
Do you reckon there is a market for a tablet with the following capability:
1) sunlight readable
2) touch screen (when wet or dry)
3) IP67 rated.
4) Much cheaper than a Toughbook.
5) wireless.


We're mucking around with these for a customer.
My dilemna is, what OS??

What would you guys prefer if I was forced to take a choice?

Windows or Android OS?

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shaggybaxter said..

Windows or Android OS?

Unix got man to the moon. It and Linux, like all other operating systems have had upgrades and different versions (Fedora et al) over the years.

The difference is as we all know is that it is "Open Source" like Open-CPN. If it does not work, it does not cost you. If it does work, it does not cost you. If you have figured out an improvement, it is welcomed as long as you provide it free.

Your hardware description sounds like "military grade" which no doubt would be available at a price. I did ask at an "ex government" computer shop at the Gabba if they had or could source and ex military field tablets. No luck.

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Toph said..
These aren't free charts as Ramona says they just don't exist here. But considering the price and what you get these are pretty damn close

www.chartandmapshop.com.au/maps

For $200 you are getting the same charts as I have plus the programme. Memory maps is a well respected nav programme in Europe. It is similar to Seaclear which is free but this is more a plug and play I believe.

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Ramona said..

Toph said..
These aren't free charts as Ramona says they just don't exist here. But considering the price and what you get these are pretty damn close

www.chartandmapshop.com.au/maps

For $200 you are getting the same charts as I have plus the programme. Memory maps is a well respected nav programme in Europe. It is similar to Seaclear which is free but this is more a plug and play I believe.

I think Windows is still the easiest. If nothing else you can use the same programme as your home PC and laptop and you should not get into trouble when you really need that nav programme to give a really good picture! That's why I would never suggest a touch screen, the last thing you need is smudged salt water on your screen. The laptop or LED screen needs to be bolted down. I use a logitec track ball that is screwed down on a pad so that water off my hands run down my wrist and clear of the mouse. The laptop has brackets screwing it down on a wooden base which tilts up with the nav table top. I have never been able to work out how to zoom and drag and drop etc with a touch screen where as it's dead easy with a mouse. A conventional mouse will fly around the cabin if you take your hands off it! There are times you need both hands to move about below.
This brings me to the other point about the suitability of this stuff in a hostile environment. Ordinary business class laptops are more than good enough, no need for toughbooks. The downside is the vulnerability of the screens when up when your moving about down below. It's hard not to hit them with your flailing arms or flying objects. When I get around to installing that 22 inch screen I will have to install a vertical post/handhold so I don't bump it as I pass.

My current thinking of a good set up is similar to what Dralyagmas has. The kogan 22 with Rasberry Pi3. This seems to be a popular choice with cruisers worldwide. The windows usb stick way would be OK if we could have a 12v TV with at least 4 USB inputs. The minimum is USB's for the Gps puck, windows 10 stick and logitec track ball.
This is my old set up in my fishing boat about 15 years ago. 19 in screen. Note how that even installed in the cabin the screen needed to be shielded from the sun at times. The Logitec trackball is available secondhand off eBay but they are not cheap.

I used a RPI on mine

www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Sailing/General/Red-Witch-Build/?page=9

Works Great, best value for Money system, even has AIS and Depth sounding plugin.

Would a tablet with usb ports suffice? You can add a usb gps puck. Total cost about 200

Yeah a tablet can work just fine.
I would say the best option is a tablet that can run windows that also has waterproof cases available.

it just depends what you want it to do. for Basic Nav Cheap Android tablets do fine. but if you want AIS and Soundings you will need something more capable.

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Sectorsteve said..
Would a tablet with usb ports suffice? You can add a usb gps puck. Total cost about 200

See if you can find a tablet with two or more USB ports. You need one that can be recharged as you use it and have a puck plugged in.

Asus do one. Has 2 usb ports. 120 dollars!

sounds good.
You can always use a usb hub.
what OS is the Asus

Dunno. Windows?

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Stuman92 said..
sounds good.
You can always use a usb hub.
what OS is the Asus

I tried a usb hub with mine and could not get it to work. It was a windows unit, 8.1. The tablets that run windows don't run the full windows version.

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Sectorsteve said..
Dunno. Windows?

For a starter set up a laptop like this. http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Dell-Latitude-D520-Laptop-Intel-Core-Duo-1-66Ghz-80GB-1GB-Ram-Wifi-WinXP-15-LCD-/291990688622?hash=item43fc00536e:g:slcAAOSwhdRYWbSm
Toss the battery and use a dc to dc converter off the ships battery.

Top of the line puck. www.ebay.com.au/itm/NEW-BU-353S4-SiRF-Star-IV-USB-GPS-Receiver-FOR-LAPTOP-CAR-PC-/280958094412?hash=item416a684c4c:g:7OEAAOSwEppUSKG3
You can get them cheaper if you want to wait for post times. Or buy a secondhand BU353s3 unit for 20 bucks or so. Use an old mouse laying around the house or spend $5 on a new one. Swing by with a usb stick for charts.

Don't waste your time in anything less than 15 inches.

That's amazing ramona. Good specs for 79 bucks.
my only concern is the space it takes up.
With a tablet I could rig up some sort of folding bracket to use to view from anywhere and with this laptop I'd want to do the same. I have made a chart/kitchen bench that folds up though so the computer could just go on that underway although it's more amidship in cabin so not ideal.
i really do like using navionics but I'm guessing a lot of you don't use it. What programme do you guys use with your laptops?
i only had my Samsung Galaxy with navionics on it recently for the jervis bay trip and there were good and bad points.
The good points were the GPS worked very well in the phone when I had no reception. There were times when there was 0 visibility and she kept me on track. I used navionics as an anchor watch also when anchored in that thunderstorm that brought a lot of wind And it worked really well.
negatives were I couldn't touch the screen with wet hands- the phone would skits out. Screen too small And had to keep charging the battery. I do have 3 back up batteries though so I got by doing about 500kms with that phone.
i think I might try a tablet first as their cheap enough. I love how little battery they use And on a swinging bracket it would fold out and be in the right spot to view and out of weather. It may even work with a blue tooth mouse .

HI SS,
i run Adrena as my nav software on the PC, but we often have a tablet rolling around with Navionics on it.
I had a sail training school owner on board for a race, and I was showing him the Adrena before the start.
He cut me off and pulled an IPad out of his backpack with Navionics on it.
He didn't use anything else the entire trip.


I like the interface on Navionics, clean and clear. Adrena, whilst simple and user friendly, is a whole world of difference when it comes to screen clutter.

Edit: He used a IPAD that could take a SIM card, but doesn't have a SIM in it.
The reason is the 3g/4g interface has a very good GPS chipset, much more accurate then the WiFi only versions.

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Sectorsteve said..

i really do like using navionics but I'm guessing a lot of you don't use it. What programme do you guys use with your laptops?
i only had my Samsung Galaxy with navionics on it recently for the jervis bay trip and there were good and bad points.
The good points were the GPS worked very well in the phone when I had no reception.

Navionics use admiralty charts. After you ran into the sandbar the other day and were motoring up the river passed the coal wharf did you happen to watch your progress on your little screen? On the normal admiralty chart for this area 808, the ship on peoples plotters using this chart will pass over the coal wharf and travel up the river about 100 metres in the mangroves. The chart 808 is based on 1946 surveys and info from 1859. They can be wildly inaccurate in rivers and estuaries. The picture above is the 808 chart. The maritime services chart for the same area is amazingly accurate and is reason alone to choose a nav programme you yourself calibrate.
Have a play. Download Seaclear 2 on your home PC. use the mapcal feature and calibrate this chart.

FWIW, Navionics claim to be making continuous updates. According to their website, they make around 2,000 updates daily (globally) by integrating Notices to Mariners, new publications, reports from users and their own survey. All for a fee though.
Does anyone Navionics Updates?