This is a weird one.

My understanding is that Navionics is now owned by Garmin, an American company, and can't help but wonder if this is a move fostered by the US centric political movement.

Or the fact that keeping up with the "islands" that just pop up overnight is too hard

Select to expand quote

JonE said..
Or the fact that keeping up with the "islands" that just pop up overnight is too hard

Pfft, its a move by a US centric political movement for sure.

? 1st Move ?

Select to expand quote

cammd said..

Pfft, it's a move by a US centric political movement for sure.

While this link to the Garmin site doesn't explain why the charts were removed from sale, it doesn't read to me to be a political directive.

support.garmin.com/en-GB/navionics/faq/BQlVBkJHSP0Fzg2feBbRvA/

Navionics (and now Garmin) seem to be always rejigging the boundaries of their charts, for reasons that are unclear (but likely financially motivated). For example, a few years ago you could get one Navionics chart for all of Australia. Now there are separate charts for "Australia, West & Central" and "Australia, East & Central to NZ". It is rather annoying if you live in SA. I need one chart to go west and another to go east!

Select to expand quote

scruzin said..
Navionics (and now Garmin) seem to be always rejigging the boundaries of their charts, for reasons that are unclear.

The charts in question on this particular post included the South China Sea. This is also on the Navionics/Garmin website and may have something to do with it.

"By order of the Hong Kong Government SAR, at the end of 2014, we removed any data originating from them; or data which is not licensed to any parties. This also includes SonarChart? data generated from user sonar logs that have been shared with Navionics?. As of 2018, user-generated SonarChart data has also been removed for the waters of the rest of China, where sonar logging is restricted at sea. These restrictions are always subject to change, so keep following us on our social media pages, such as Facebook or X, for the latest information."

Toph's post said," keep following us on our social media pages, such as Facebook or X, for the latest information."

So I did.
This is what the face book page looks like.
So it is all the Thai cruising area too.

Select to expand quote

Toph said..

scruzin said..
Navionics (and now Garmin) seem to be always rejigging the boundaries of their charts, for reasons that are unclear.

The charts in question on this particular post included the South China Sea. This is also on the Navionics/Garmin website and may have something to do with it.

"By order of the Hong Kong Government SAR, at the end of 2014, we removed any data originating from them; or data which is not licensed to any parties. This also includes SonarChart? data generated from user sonar logs that have been shared with Navionics?. As of 2018, user-generated SonarChart data has also been removed for the waters of the rest of China, where sonar logging is restricted at sea. These restrictions are always subject to change, so keep following us on our social media pages, such as Facebook or X, for the latest information."

So Navionics are unable to utilise Hydrographic data from China anymore?

Therefore unable to provide charts legally suitable for navigation purposes?

D3. I am not sure that this is connected with the Chinese government or their territorial claims.
When I first saw the reports I was worried that my Japan /North East Asia charts were gone too.
These cove almost all of China's coast.
Fortunately (for now) they are still on my Tablet and phone.
gary

Which Hydrographic agency is responsible those charts?

Select to expand quote

cammd said..

JonE said..
Or the fact that keeping up with the "islands" that just pop up overnight is too hard

Pfft, its a move by a US centric political movement for sure.

What's different to our situation here in Australia with charts wit, the government privatising and licensing out the charts, maps and geoscience data to private companies. Then they expect taxpayers who funded all this work and data to pay for it again to the benefit of overseas shareholders.

They do the same with safety standards while they expect people to follow the laws drafted by the government and then give copyright to overseas companies and will prosecute you in court of law if you claim ignorance because you could not afford to pay access or read the standard. To me this just is just poor scumbag governance by greedy governments. Even the USA in its free enterprise system saw fit to keep charts and other government produced data and standards in the public domain, likewise New Zealand.

You would have thought that my now there would be global standards for mapping and charts in the satellite era that would give all global citizens free access, especially for things like maritime charts. In The era of satellite surveying the costs to produce this data is very low compared to Navy ship running around making measurements and doing old style surveying?

I'm curious as to how satellites can survey deeper water?

The hydrographic vessel was doing soundings here last year

Select to expand quote

p3p4p5 said..

cammd said..

JonE said..
Or the fact that keeping up with the "islands" that just pop up overnight is too hard

Pfft, its a move by a US centric political movement for sure.

What's different to our situation here in Australia with charts wit, the government privatising and licensing out the charts, maps and geoscience data to private companies. Then they expect taxpayers who funded all this work and data to pay for it again to the benefit of overseas shareholders.

They do the same with safety standards while they expect people to follow the laws drafted by the government and then give copyright to overseas companies and will prosecute you in court of law if you claim ignorance because you could not afford to pay access or read the standard. To me this just is just poor scumbag governance by greedy governments. Even the USA in its free enterprise system saw fit to keep charts and other government produced data and standards in the public domain, likewise New Zealand.

You would have thought that my now there would be global standards for mapping and charts in the satellite era that would give all global citizens free access, especially for things like maritime charts. In The era of satellite surveying the costs to produce this data is very low compared to Navy ship running around making measurements and doing old style surveying?

So the rest of us should pay higher taxes because you reckon you want more free access to Australian Standards?

Cool - that means I can demand that you pay higher taxes to give me something I want for free too.

Select to expand quote

garymalmgren said..
D3. I am not sure that this is connected with the Chinese government or their territorial claims.
When I first saw the reports I was worried that my Japan /North East Asia charts were gone too.
These cove almost all of China's coast.
Fortunately (for now) they are still on my Tablet and phone.
gary

Gary don't update it in the app. I've still got Navi charts on an iPad for 2016 with some area with my own soundings, sonar chart I think it is. Anyway I just by pass the update caper, not now, later, no thanks or whatever it takes

Select to expand quote

woko said..

Gary don't update it in the app. I've still got Navi charts on an iPad for 2016 with some area with my own soundings, sonar chart I think it is. Anyway I just by pass the update caper, not now, later, no thanks or whatever it takes

It's all in the link posted above, you should be ok until you update the subscription and then it disappears.

That said, Gary's area of use isn't the are in question which is a bit conflicting considering Garmin specifically mentions the HK Government and also the South China Sea...

Edit with Apologies, the first link I posted above does not explain it all just merely a list of discontinued charts. I quoted from the website the information pertaining to the HK government directive on my second post. I'll find the actual link again.

Satellites and lazer airborne depth sounders (LADS) only work in areas of low turbidity. LADS passage behind the GBR is an example where it has worked. River deltas, Torres Strait and areas after a flood generally don't work.

Satellites have less definition.

A high confidence survey requires a transducer in the water column. Ship, boat, drone (on and below), towed underwater transducer. Autonomous long endurance small vessels will bring survey costs down, not satellites.