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I got the power!

Created by southace southace  > 9 months ago, 29 Sep 2016
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HG02
HG02

VIC

5814 posts

4 Oct 2016 7:14pm
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Concepcion said..
Ohhh dear, I know I shouldn't be baited by this, but given that I work in energy policy, a few facts for you all. Please note from the Commonwealth regulator (I.e the experts here):

"Bare bones are when a large load drops off the grid there is more generation than supply. That can cause huge problems (think catastrophic explosion of power generator) so it trips a series of safety measures. Several large transmission pylons were flattened in the north west, dumping a significant load off the network. A couple of generators in SA then tripped because of the abrupt load loss, and the interconnector was also tripped to ensure other base load generators stayed up (Once one of those babies goes down it takes 3 or 4 days to bring each one back on line, not 3 or 4 hours).So, the grid island the section of network with the problem until they can safely work around the downed section of network (imagine a Complex maze of thousands of kilometres of wire and you have to find the right path) and I think they probably brought the peak generators (gas fired) on line and start to resynchronise the tripped base load.It is then a process of gradually restoring load, this started a mere 3 hours after the event. It was a fantastic job really and the network operator, transmission provider and peak load plants ought to be congratulated.Power generation gets complex when you start having to factor in the way load and supply are entwined and frequency synchronisation. It's not just a matter of turning on a generator and Ta-da the lights return.So in all, it had zero to do with generation in SA, and everything to do with a freak storm that no one can control and no amount of locally produced base load would have avoided."

Please a few facts before conviction bias - SA both imports and exports energy, the Port Augusta power station was old and inefficient and privately owned - it closed this year because it could not compete against cheaper available sources. SA with both wind, diesel, gas (x4) and solar generation and 2 interconnectors to the national grid has little generation issues ... but we may have transmission ones.

PS...I have no interest in renewables, but as a Sailor I LOVE WIND


I wonder how much power ( energy lost ) from a power generator to a city let say 200 klm of high power , power lines?
Concepcion
Concepcion

SA

93 posts

4 Oct 2016 7:12pm
It's not the first or most important question when it concerns overall energy cost. The actual loss of the value of energy, is marginal. Indeed the actual cost (average wholesale if you like) is minor when it comes to your retail bill. Some of you might recall how little you saved when the so called carbon tax was removed, or how little you actually get from photovoltaics when you sell back into the grid.

Suggest you might google Wind farm locations in SA - dispersed widely, but mostly regional. Further, given the way that these markets work, they don't charge much more if you 'retail' purchase in Port Lincoln or Adelaide. This regional dispersion of wind farms is also why SA can supply 41% of our demand by wind power (at zero marginal cost!)

The one significant 'market failure' in SA is price gouging by some gas generators, where they can with a 'flick of the switch' generate. They wait till the market price skyrockets (peak demand) and then they sell energy. however in SA the generators (including All wind farms) are private.

...enough from me here, as most of us watching the US Presidential race can see, the truth and politics are sometimes uncomfortable bedfellows.
Ramona
Ramona

NSW

7737 posts

5 Oct 2016 8:35am
There has been very little mention of the SA people who had power the whole time. Those with Power wall units seemed to be a bit smug.

www.tesla.com/en_AU/powerwall


There are lessons here for live aboards. Not that we experience those sorts of winds often but for me it shows solar and battery of the best bet.
PhoenixStar
PhoenixStar

QLD

477 posts

5 Oct 2016 10:42am
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Bristolfashion said..
Always interested in other opinions, but not sure I agree with your criticism. My suggestion of a non biased review is the opposite of a political point. This review should look at the facts and make recommendations irrespective of which political party or interest groups are supported.

My comment on distributed energy supply was based on a very interesting talk i went to by the Chief Engineer of a UK town where they introduced local generation by a mix of conventional and renewable technologies plus a grid connection. During a widespread power outage in the region they were able to keep local power going. Again, not a political point but a suggestion as to a way to improve energy security. This approach does spread out the employment in the sector a bit and allows earlier grid shut down in extreme weather events.


You still need to resync the local and grid supply when the grid comes back on - not simple. In my salad days we at UQ we coupled a pair of generators out of sync, Spectacular result.
Bristolfashion
Bristolfashion

VIC

490 posts

5 Oct 2016 4:55pm
Good to see the review announced today. The results should be interesting. Some of the other comments have reminded me that providing a reliable, affordable and climate friendly power system is REALLY complicated. Thanks guys.

P.s I'm trying to get my stern light to work consistently and that's bad enough.
HG02
HG02

VIC

5814 posts

5 Oct 2016 5:17pm
Select to expand quote
Bristolfashion said..
Good to see the review announced today. The results should be interesting. Some of the other comments have reminded me that providing a reliable, affordable and climate friendly power system is REALLY complicated. Thanks guys.

P.s I'm trying to get my stern light to work consistently and that's bad enough.



buy a led one "no globe sealed" problem solved other than your wiring
with a globe you have one more connection to go wrong be it LED or convetional
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