hello people..i am a inshore sailor (timpenny 670) and want to break out into a mans world of ocean sailing. I have been told that if I sailed from adelaide to say portland victoria that the boat would make it (duncanson 29) but i probably would not. Is this correct? Is the ocean that bad for a novice? you do not hear about many sailors getting drowned shipwrecked injured wet...is it simply a case of picking the right weather? not much that i can find on the net on how to traverse big waves especially following seas. Where does one learn? I am 71 and if I do not do this now i might never get the chance again. Had a southerly 23 for a little while and just gave it away to a needy chap at paynesville so i am not a scrooge...so impessed with the stability of a keelboat that the duncanson is highly desired....fishing camping getting the chicks you know..where does one go for learning??

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hipopp said..
hello people..i am a inshore sailor (timpenny 670) and want to break out into a mans world of ocean sailing. I have been told that if I sailed from adelaide to say portland victoria that the boat would make it (duncanson 29) but i probably would not. Is this correct? Is the ocean that bad for a novice? you do not hear about many sailors getting drowned shipwrecked injured wet...is it simply a case of picking the right weather? not much that i can find on the net on how to traverse big waves especially following seas. Where does one learn? I am 71 and if I do not do this now i might never get the chance again. Had a southerly 23 for a little while and just gave it away to a needy chap at paynesville so i am not a scrooge...so impessed with the stability of a keelboat that the duncanson is highly desired....fishing camping getting the chicks you know..where does one go for learning??

They are lovely little boats but also many are getting tired. The seas from Kangaroo island to Portland can get massive as the continental shelf goes right in to about 10 NM of the mainland. The SW wind and swell will build to massive 5 to 10 meter waves with sea spray on top.
See how you go but a truck would be the better option at least you can get it re-antifouled prior to re-launch and then spend happy couple of years sailing her.

100% correct imho. The ocean is that bad for experts let alone novices. If you haven't heard of fatalities you mustn't be listening.........

Am shaking just reading your post..........you mustn't have looked too hard on the web for heavy weather sailing offshore tips...........eg

www.oceannavigator.com/Ocean-Voyager-2011/Dangerous-waves-and-your-boat/

www.northsails.com/sailing/en/2016/09/how-to-sail-safely-through-a-storm

I have sailed Adelaide to Sydney 1980 in a Farr11.6 but we had lovely weather..............still had our moments of 30+kts...........

Learning is by taking small steps and surviving each one..........

Please book a truck as per southace............

Where does one learn? I am 71 and if I do not do this now i might never get the chance again.

Hipopp, The reality is that one learns at sea and as they say, The sea is a harsh mistress.
You want to lean offshore sailing, navigation and seamanship, right?
For most sailors it is a lifetime apprenticeship. As in, there is always something to learn or a skill to advance.

you do not hear about many sailors getting drowned shipwrecked injured
New technology has made navigation much easier, but not safer.
Most of those lost sailors and boats had modern nav gear aboard.
The same old seamanship skills still apply today.

I would suggest you hire an experienced skipper, pay for the delivery from SA to Victoria and go along as crew.
Keep you mouth shut and your eyes, ears and wallet open.

Getting the lessons and learning the skills on the boat during a passage with an experienced skipper, as well as the delivery is good value.

Gary

Hipopp
if this is really a genuine post,and not scamming,then perhaps join the Ocean Racing Club of Victoria,or look up their courses,before making rash decisions.
Trucking safest bet for novice

Hipopp
if this is really a genuine post,and not scamming,then perhaps join the Ocean Racing Club of Victoria,or look up their courses,before making rash decisions.
Trucking safest bet for novice

I think this one of the reasons that SA boats sell at a big discount to the eastern states. It's a committing voyage especially in a small boat with only one or two safe harbours along the way.

A

I think this one of the reasons that SA boats sell at a big discount to the eastern states. It's a committing voyage especially in a small boat with only one or two safe harbours along the way.

A

Quote:- you do not hear about many sailors getting drowned shipwrecked injured wet...


I fear we may be hearing of one soon to add to the many that have been mentioned on this forum.

I'm with R13 on Hipopp's other thread (thankfully locked, cheers Toph), I smell troll.

Thanks Serenite........can't recall but didn't think I used the word "troll" - rather "is this a wind up..." but for sure your conclusion would be totally valid and rational given the text evidence...........

See below the Southerly 23 which was given away for free - I believe it must be Hipopps boat he was talking about

www.boatsonline.com.au/boats-for-sale/used/sailing-boats/southerly-23/213636

So top effort right there Hipopp............please Hipopp confirm.............so we can assist you to achieve your plan...........

So now we need to get you around from Adelaide to Portland in one piece - so the both of you boat and you..........

The truck is still the solution.

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r13 said..
Thanks Serenite........can't recall but didn't think I used the word "troll" - rather "is this a wind up..." but for sure your conclusion would be totally valid and rational given the text evidence...........

See below the Southerly 23 which was given away for free - I believe it must be Hipopps boat he was talking about

www.boatsonline.com.au/boats-for-sale/used/sailing-boats/southerly-23/213636

So top effort right there Hipopp............please Hipopp confirm.............so we can assist you to achieve your plan...........

So now we need to get you around from Adelaide to Portland in one piece - so the both of you boat and you..........

The truck is still the solution.

yes the southerly went to eric on raymond island...an aged care worker who is a bit of a battler. He was referred to me by a GLYC member. I delivered the boat for him on sunday and would you believe it...no wind out of metung then the outboard stopped working,,,had to be towed metung to paynesville...not a good look. Anyway he is rapped as less than one percent of his mauritian people get to own a boat. Another sailer on the water. The boat only costed me $820 in the first place and i took off the self steer unit so....now for a duncanson 29 with a comfort factor of 40 not 20. I have been researching for a long time and that is my final choice. I could buy a cheap keelboat here tomorrow but it is the Dunc i want all things considered. This sailing off adelaide sounds a rather largish consideration and would assume anywhere west of king island would be the same? Calm here in Sale Vic but when i looked at BOM weather the waves were 5 to 6 mtrs and a huge swell. H2O on steroids!!!! I see it as simply a challenge with fear to be overcome. Boats were designed to cope with that. Not trying to be a smart alec but 5 or 6 thousand to deliver a boat 500 kl;ms is outrageous

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hipopp said..

r13 said..
Thanks Serenite........can't recall but didn't think I used the word "troll" - rather "is this a wind up..." but for sure your conclusion would be totally valid and rational given the text evidence...........

See below the Southerly 23 which was given away for free - I believe it must be Hipopps boat he was talking about

www.boatsonline.com.au/boats-for-sale/used/sailing-boats/southerly-23/213636

So top effort right there Hipopp............please Hipopp confirm.............so we can assist you to achieve your plan...........

So now we need to get you around from Adelaide to Portland in one piece - so the both of you boat and you..........

The truck is still the solution.

yes the southerly went to eric on raymond island...an aged care worker who is a bit of a battler. He was referred to me by a GLYC member. I delivered the boat for him on sunday and would you believe it...no wind out of metung then the outboard stopped working,,,had to be towed metung to paynesville...not a good look. Anyway he is rapped as less than one percent of his mauritian people get to own a boat. Another sailer on the water. The boat only costed me $820 in the first place and i took off the self steer unit so....now for a duncanson 29 with a comfort factor of 40 not 20. I have been researching for a long time and that is my final choice. I could buy a cheap keelboat here tomorrow but it is the Dunc i want all things considered. This sailing off adelaide sounds a rather largish consideration and would assume anywhere west of king island would be the same? Calm here in Sale Vic but when i looked at BOM weather the waves were 5 to 6 mtrs and a huge swell. H2O on steroids!!!! I see it as simply a challenge with fear to be overcome. Boats were designed to cope with that. Not trying to be a smart alec but 5 or 6 thousand to deliver a boat 500 kl;ms is outrageous

It's what it cost mate. Do it your self with a able crew. You may jag a good run. Kangaroo island to cape Jaffa / Robe will be your first challenge , I hope the diesel doesn't fail like your previous delivery. What Diesel engine is in your new Dunc 29?

!978 Duncanson 29Lying : North Haven Marina Sth AustraliaVery clean example of these well loved iconic boats, also a rarer model with space saving wheel steering!Extensive work carried out over the last years.New Yanmar 1GM10S diesel engine 2015 (60 hours) New dodger/bimini 2016, New boom bag /lazyjacks 2016New Electronics (GPS/Sounder/wind instruments) 2016. New rigging 2016GME VHF radio,sound system.Great buying and ready to sail away!

southace just got a quote...3700 plus 1500 expenses....same as yours i suppose.

Time to ignore

hey folks..i must be missing something here on this site...is there any manners left? time to ignore posted when i was simply answering a question by southace? what are the rules of asking questyions here on seebreeze? the other thread was stopped for what reason? a member on this thread is encouraging others to ignore my replies to southace. You got me beat so I can only guess...the members here want to be told what they want to hear only. Yuo hear about this on the bolt report...type of censorship!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am new to bluewater sailing so i also guess the professionals here do not want to lower themselves discussing with a newbie and his lowly needs. This happens in golf and yacht and coin and gardening clubs till only older members are left no one puts up with the bulldust of power etc. then everyone laments the passing of the institution ha!! Contrary to the opinion of others who seem to be prejudiced I would not go out into the big water till i had 101 questions answered either through my own research or on this website. So far after a 101 hours of watching utube and here and other sites i still have not found the simple info I AM AFTER, What angles do you sail the various waves...none not zilch answers anywhere. Then the question sailing with following sea safety considerations none not zilch answer anywhere. You folk may take it for granted but this info is vital for this little ducky who happens to be quite a handsome 71 y.o and needs to live like anyone else.

Hi Hipopp,

this site is just like all the other forums out their, with lots of opinions. Just need to ignore some bits and concentrate on the one's that help. I think a few of us have concerns with what you are proposing, but its your life.

On some of your questions I would try to find Peter Bruce's excellent book "Heavy Weather Sailing", which will answerr questions like angle you sail the various waves. The latest edition (7th) is great and fully update, but expensive. The older editions are still very good and a lot cheaper to get hold of 2nd hand.

Good luck, Ilenart

thankyou very much

Its a bit of a tricky one to answer.
the best angle to run with or bash over waves will vary for different boats and conditions.
Also the proximity of dangers and the course you need to steer are a big factor on the coast.
I would recommend doing some sailing around the gulfs Kangaroo Island and Port Lincoln first to get used to the boat and get a bit of a feel for open water first.
Adelaide to Portland is jumping in at the deep end off a high tower.

Its a bit of a tricky one to answer.
the best angle to run with or bash over waves will vary for different boats and conditions.
Also the proximity of dangers and the course you need to steer are a big factor on the coast.
I would recommend doing some sailing around the gulfs Kangaroo Island and Port Lincoln first to get used to the boat and get a bit of a feel for open water first.
Adelaide to Portland is jumping in at the deep end off a high tower.

It was mentioned, there Are not many hiding, resting places along the way.
when I Was planning take Sweet Chariot from Port Pirie to Melbourne, I personally checked suitability along the way. Robe, Portland, Port Fairy, Warrnambool, Apollo Bay, Lorne Bay if calm,
PPB, if rough push to Westernport just Flinders jetty.

Once you get to KI beating out of the gulf from Adelaide, you can take a breather at Penneshaw marina cove , have a great meal on the hill side pub and then check the weather and if you get a window head to Robe or cape Jaffa which are the only safe ports in 24 hours at 5 knots. After that once you reach Robe take another breath check weather and your next leg will be closer to land but be prepared to hook a craypot onto your prop shaft during the night on the next 24 hour leg to Portland. You do have carpenters rocks and port McDonald as emergency stop overs but better keeping away from land really.
Im going to take my own yacht in November to Tassie and last time I did this passage in my previous yacht **** hit the fan on all passages but still got some good runs with weather I predicted in the first stage of the passages. Best is when it's flat calm 40c and the 60hp pushing 6 knots with radar,AIS, and all the navionics.

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hipopp said..
hey folks..i must be missing something here on this site...is there any manners left? time to ignore posted when i was simply answering a question by southace? what are the rules of asking questyions here on seebreeze? the other thread was stopped for what reason? a member on this thread is encouraging others to ignore my replies to southace. You got me beat so I can only guess...the members here want to be told what they want to hear only. Yuo hear about this on the bolt report...type of censorship!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am new to bluewater sailing so i also guess the professionals here do not want to lower themselves discussing with a newbie and his lowly needs. This happens in golf and yacht and coin and gardening clubs till only older members are left no one puts up with the bulldust of power etc. then everyone laments the passing of the institution ha!! Contrary to the opinion of others who seem to be prejudiced I would not go out into the big water till i had 101 questions answered either through my own research or on this website. So far after a 101 hours of watching utube and here and other sites i still have not found the simple info I AM AFTER, What angles do you sail the various waves...none not zilch answers anywhere. Then the question sailing with following sea safety considerations none not zilch answer anywhere. You folk may take it for granted but this info is vital for this little ducky who happens to be quite a handsome 71 y.o and needs to live like anyone else.

Bagging out the cost of delivery because quote" I don't want to pay him for sleeping" made you sound tight & ignorant or I seen it on YouTube how hard can it be ?
you sir I thought have had your quires answered civilly, on other forum you may have not been treated so kindly.
Now as to how to tackle large seas as stated it depends type of vessel ie. My old school boat with a big apple bow and a fair run aft surfs very well, but is a pig working into any sort of sea, a skinny boat may well take the sea on the stem better, then of coarse for instance, as is the case with my vessel not much good would come of running with the sea if running aground is the result. the sea doesn't allways run the same direction as the prevailing wind, so now we have opened up another senario. Windage is another consideration, fuel supply & engine horse power should also have some bearing. Standing on a pitching deck rigging a storm sail,or for that matter just standing on a pitching deck foot wear, life lines, harnesses. or being able to heave to again all designs are different, all has to be taken into account. So in short there's no this is how to do it, but the answer in the maritime operations cert is to take the wave at 30 degree from the bow. Hipopp you sound like you got big balls so get out there and do it
by the ways tell me the 1gm10s engine isn't 10 hp ?

Yes as per Ilenart a great book by editor Peter Bruce and the many other contributors...............

See here a shortened first number of pages version of the Peter Bruce book ............sobering reading...........

www.amazon.com.au/Heavy-Weather-Sailing-Peter-Bruce/dp/1472923197/ref=asc_df_1472923197/?tag=googleshopdsk-22&linkCode=df0&hvadid=341791733921&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=5563090080060995985&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9071803&hvtargid=pla-466688739501&psc=1#reader_B01FA84YL2

As per Woko the cods head and mackeral tail design reaches and runs well, but is a bit compromised upwind.

So totally off topic but...........

Arguably Bob Miller's best design was Gingko of such a cods head and mackeral tail design...........this boat got the upwind and downwind balance perfect......Ciel III also got it perfect.

See here a short story of Bob/Ben - ok we have all heard it before but for those who have'nt it is good reading...............this text is the best short summary I have seen.........of course not all his designs hit the mark - he did a Travelodge 18 in the early 70s which was way too deep vee..............

www.fishingboating-world.com/n/Australia-II--Winged-Keels-revisited/-62313?source=google.au

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garymalmgren said..

by the ways tell me the 1gm10s engine isn't 10 hp ?

OK. I will tell you that. A Yanmar 1GM10 is not 10 horsepower.

It is 9 horse power

Yanmar 1GM10 9 HP Marine Diesel Engine Inboard
$2,942.00

Buy Now

Pretty sneaky call it GM10 isn't it.

gary

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by the ways tell me the 1gm10s engine isn't 10 hp ?

OK. I will tell you that. A Yanmar 1GM10 is not 10 horsepower.

It is 9 horse power

Yanmar 1GM10 9 HP Marine Diesel Engine Inboard
$2,942.00

Buy Now

Pretty sneaky call it GM10 isn't it.

gary

The Duncanson 29 is a very capable sea boat, a friend of mine sailed his, with one crew, from Kangaroo Island around the bottom of Tasmania non stop to NZ!
He explored Fiordland before returning via Bass Strait back in the 90's. Another couple from South Australia sailed one around the world over several years. Both stories are told in a chapter of a book "More Yachting Yarns from South Australia" available to download on line.
The D29 mentioned for sale here looks to be a good example. The wheel steering without an autopilot and the small 10hp motor could be a concern on the long solo voyage. Most D29's have been re-powered with 15hp engines.
Also as mentioned in earlier posts, it would be good advice to do several shakedown cruises. There are many beautiful destinations in both Gulf St Vincent and Spencer Gulf in South Australia. Practice sailing in a variety of sea conditions, especially the technique of heaving to, which the Duncanson 29 does well.
Good luck with your adventure!

If you want to know what to do..go to setsail.com and download the free books by the Dashews. An amazing resource that they have made available for all of us.

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2Shakey said..
The Duncanson 29 is a very capable sea boat, a friend of mine sailed his, with one crew, from Kangaroo Island around the bottom of Tasmania non stop to NZ!
He explored Fiordland before returning via Bass Strait back in the 90's. Another couple from South Australia sailed one around the world over several years. Both stories are told in a chapter of a book "More Yachting Yarns from South Australia" available to download on line.
The D29 mentioned for sale here looks to be a good example. The wheel steering without an autopilot and the small 10hp motor could be a concern on the long solo voyage. Most D29's have been re-powered with 15hp engines.
Also as mentioned in earlier posts, it would be good advice to do several shakedown cruises. There are many beautiful destinations in both Gulf St Vincent and Spencer Gulf in South Australia. Practice sailing in a variety of sea conditions, especially the technique of heaving to, which the Duncanson 29 does well.
Good luck with your adventure!

I agree, the wheel steering in a small boat like the Duncanson 29 would be a handicap. The 10 hp motor not so much. At sea yachts are usually sailed so the difference between 10 and 15 hp in a seaway would not mean much.

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Ramona said..

2Shakey said..
The Duncanson 29 is a very capable sea boat, a friend of mine sailed his, with one crew, from Kangaroo Island around the bottom of Tasmania non stop to NZ!
He explored Fiordland before returning via Bass Strait back in the 90's. Another couple from South Australia sailed one around the world over several years. Both stories are told in a chapter of a book "More Yachting Yarns from South Australia" available to download on line.
The D29 mentioned for sale here looks to be a good example. The wheel steering without an autopilot and the small 10hp motor could be a concern on the long solo voyage. Most D29's have been re-powered with 15hp engines.
Also as mentioned in earlier posts, it would be good advice to do several shakedown cruises. There are many beautiful destinations in both Gulf St Vincent and Spencer Gulf in South Australia. Practice sailing in a variety of sea conditions, especially the technique of heaving to, which the Duncanson 29 does well.
Good luck with your adventure!

I agree, the wheel steering in a small boat like the Duncanson 29 would be a handicap. The 10 hp motor not so much. At sea yachts are usually sailed so the difference between 10 and 15 hp in a seaway would not mean much.

10hp is fine to get you on and off a sheltered mooring. Useless if you need to fight your way over a bar, or off a lee shore. Way off-shore not relevant, but most of us want to eventually enjoy the pleasures of our destination, and you are back to coastal work and bars and lee-shores. (For the education of a newbie, a bar is not a pub, but a shallow dangerous area at the mouth of many ports.)

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Ramona said..

2Shakey said..
The Duncanson 29 is a very capable sea boat, a friend of mine sailed his, with one crew, from Kangaroo Island around the bottom of Tasmania non stop to NZ!
He explored Fiordland before returning via Bass Strait back in the 90's. Another couple from South Australia sailed one around the world over several years. Both stories are told in a chapter of a book "More Yachting Yarns from South Australia" available to download on line.
The D29 mentioned for sale here looks to be a good example. The wheel steering without an autopilot and the small 10hp motor could be a concern on the long solo voyage. Most D29's have been re-powered with 15hp engines.
Also as mentioned in earlier posts, it would be good advice to do several shakedown cruises. There are many beautiful destinations in both Gulf St Vincent and Spencer Gulf in South Australia. Practice sailing in a variety of sea conditions, especially the technique of heaving to, which the Duncanson 29 does well.
Good luck with your adventure!

I agree, the wheel steering in a small boat like the Duncanson 29 would be a handicap. The 10 hp motor not so much. At sea yachts are usually sailed so the difference between 10 and 15 hp in a seaway would not mean much.

Anything without some sort of auto steering solo and 24+hour passage would be a negative. A tiller would be only marginally better. However I think in hipopp case it would be of no difference as I doubt he would be able to do sheet to tiller steering.