Hi One and all, I have had my Beneteau First 405 since last christmas (thought i deserved a decent present ) and as much as it is great to sail and spend time on , i have had battery problems since day one, Having said that the problem is more finding someone who actually knows what there doing, to date i have spent several thousands on trying to keep voltage in the batteries. I have replaced the alternator and starter Motor,(both brand new) i have had all the wireing from the batteries to the isolater switches replaced and installed three new isolater switches,Have replaced all the wireing and switching for the windlesss, i have bought two brand new Century Marine Pro 720cca batteries, I have replaced the Solar regulator and replaced both the bilge pump and float switch. And still each time i go on board ( most weekends) the two house batteris are dead, i have gone so far as to removed the fuse for the bilge pump as it is wired directly from the batteries.
My question is....... are you or do you know of a reliable and dependable person who actually knows what to look for and how to fix it, i have had the boat into a couple of what i would have regarded as top boat shops and i am still having the same issues and now do not want to give these busineses any more money for s*%# service. HELP PLEASE because i dont think it is the worlds biggest problem but it has so far frustrated me no end. i have absolutly no problem paying what ever it costs i just want it fixed...... Thanks.

Ben,
I'd be suss that you have a live earth somewhere,
it will be something simple,
cheers Emmo

Sorry to hear about your updating and money spending exercise with
no positive outcome.
I have done a dozens of problems like your, not as business but as hobby.
Friends like that, no fees involve unless all fix. They risking nothing and
me 40 years in electronic-electrical trade is just another mickey-mouse
puzzle.

It might be good advice for all "fix the problem first".

Do not start replacing anything unless is proven faulty.
Fault has to be fix and start changing stuff, will confuse the problem
and even might implement more problems.

There are also rare findings, the miscalculation, how many amps goes IN and
how much load is expected to cover.

Boat is funny place, draining the valet, patience and in your case even current.

Have we seen it before!!!!!!!!!

Well Im an electronics tech, im on the other side of the country so cant help you a lot. But the thing is, your best bet is a guy with some experience in fault finding, which involves in some cases a fair bit of time and not replacing stuff willy nilly. The way a tech aproaches this is by disconecting potential consumers to see when the current stops flowing. You start by taking out all the fuses and disconecting anything that hasnt got a fuse in the line. If you still have drain on the batteries there may be corrosion on a terminal or faulty wiring, thats essentaily it. Auto electricians do a fair bit of this type of work on cars.
In the mean time while your not on board, take the terminals off the batterys if possible.

Ramona said...

No offence meant here to auto electricians but there are few similarities between boats and cars. I am a bit confused why you have 3 isolation switches and two batteries. Are these rotary switches or knife switches? If you have an electric winch on the bow then mounting its own battery close by is the way to go. If you leave 12v power on just for a bilge pump and maybe radio presets then a small separate battery and circuit connected to your solar panel may be the way to go. The two house batteries should be off while your off the boat, isolated by the battery switch, you only need one, and the batteries are then just connected by your solar panel by a regulator. One of those $13 regulators off eBay for each battery.

I have only had the one experience with Sydney specialists when I bought my boat there. It had been fitted with a new engine and the specialists obviously had little understanding on electricity!

Take up the offer of a local for a second opinion[Morningcloud]

As I said Auto Electician may be your best bet for fault finding, I know this for a fact, most people have no understanding of electronics apart from public perception, and the standard electrician cant count beyond 3 wires

My .02 cents worth.
once this problem is solved it is very usefull to carry a digital multimeter and also a hydrometer to test if the battery is fully charged.
A digital multimeter set to the 10amp range, in series can be used to see what current is being drained from the batteries when any circuit is turned on, you would not test the high current circuit like windless or starter motor this way.
It is interesting to see how much current is used by cabin lights or the gas bottle solenoid .
The meter will also show how much current is going back into the batteries from your solar panel.
I wonder in this case if the solar panels have been incorrectly wired, so they are only charging the batteries when the battery switch is set to a certain position and not providing any charge during the week ??
The hydrometer will tell if your batteries are fully charged.
Using only a alternator to fully charge a bank of batteries will take a long time .
Getting a idea of current in and current out from your battery bank can save lots of money being paid to others ,
good luck

Hi and thanks to all that have replied to my cry for help, it is very comforting to know that we have such a fantastic community of like minded sailing / boating devotees always willing to shear knowledge and experience....

A little more info and hopefullly answer a few questions, the Batteries which are Centurey branded 720 cranking amp marine pro, one was new in Feb this year the other was new in May this year, The three switchs are BEP branded, and one is for the Engine start and is conected to the third battery, the second is for the house batteries and the third is a Emergency Paralall switch. When i leave the boat i always turn all three of them to the off poition, so i am thinking that that shoulld be enough to stop any power going anywere. However as it continues to loose power, i have replaced the old solar regulator with a 30amp Fangpusun branded PR3030 solar regulator which has a digital display and reads the amount of power in the battery plus lots of ather info.
i have printed off all your comment and will have another play this weekend taking note of all the suggestions and possible courses, Thanks again
Ben 405

Hi Ben,
Electricals can be so frustrating & confusing if it's not your field. There's no moving parts in electricals - one reason troubleshooting them can be so much more difficult than mechanical stuff.
My background is Electronics/Electrical. For mine, SugarQube & Charriot have given you the best advice.
Don't spend any more money on equipment, or your own time for that matter - you need a diagnosis from a competent electrical/electronic person. Your problem is not that mysterious (in fact, it should be routine) to a competent person. It should take no more than a couple of hours, at worst, for an accurate diagnosis, and the fix should be simple and relatively inexpensive (that's if the batteries aren't stuffed - which I very much doubt).

Maybe you could find a marine electrical tech through a local boatyard, Chandler, etc - but make sure they have electrical qualifications & marine electrical experience.
Pity you're not down my way (Port Philip Bay in VIC)
PM me if wish - best of luck

Allan

I tend to agree with Chariot. The problem will be associated with the way you have wired the rotary switches. First check that the BEP switches are working correctly, the plate that moves as you rotate the switch can become disconnected so the batteries are not disconnected even tho the pointer is in that position. Not sure why you would have 3, one for house batteries and either a knife switch or another rotary for the starter battery is enough.

Hi Ben,
I sympathise with your predicament. Whilst I agree with all the comments about isolating the problem first before changing anything, the real problem and frustration you have experienced (as indeed I did with an impeller problem which lasted over 12 months) was that absolutely none of the mechanics and shipwrights I consulted and who inspected the boat could tell me what was causing it. And for the life of me I don't know why? Very very frustrating. I have found getting help from more experienced owners to be more help so take advantage of the offers made on this thread. Try and get into a club that has members who do their own maintenance on their boats. As for my problem after consulting numerous engineers and on replacing and adding various bits I eventually ran into another owner who experienced exactly the same problem and we later found it was due to a dodgy batch of impellers produced at that time.

Ramona you must be the EBAY king.

I've just ordered one of pocket ones from your link, and had checked out the 12v led lights from a previous topic.

Perhaps you can start up a new thread and update it weekly with your ebay finds, for those of us who don't have as much time or luck finding gear.

Ramona said...

felixdcat said...

Do not use a 10 A serie A metre on batteries!

If you connect it wrong it will blow up and produce a nasty flash.... eventually start a fire! Also been DC current the reading will not be very reliable. You have a beautifull yacht so considere buing a decent multimeter that has a clamp. A clamp metre would set you to $300-00/500-00, a fraction of the cost of replacing the boat or the electrics. (Be sure it is AC/DC)

Bought 2 multimeters off eBay lately.
This clamp one cost me $11 posted to my door.
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/280874414238?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

Auto range cost me $8.50 to my door
www.ebay.com.au/itm/110653429519?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649.

Nice one! But I am afraid a DC clamp will be a bit expesiver !