looking at the advertising on Seabreeze I noticed the new Dehler 46 .....I hope they packed the wine glasses well and no one is sleeping on the windward bunk!

Long way to fall across that cockpit too!

10 kts of breeze and heeled 20-25 deg. Wonder what she would do in 20-25 kts? On her ear!

I don't see that kind of advertising as being in any way advantageous. People will look at it and wonder if it will turtle, a much better solution would be to have the boat sitting upright and going hell for leather and instill a sense of confidence in it.

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MorningBird said..
10 kts of breeze and heeled 20-25 deg. Wonder what she would do in 20-25 kts? On her ear!

My thoughts exactly MB. But I thought she maybe even healed more than 25deg. If I did that with the misses on boat it would be divorce. (Now there's an idea)

yeah but it's marketed as a performance cruiser.

With different rigs, carbon fibre etc. you'd be disappointed if it was a slug and didn't move until the wind picked up.

Plenty of other designs to choose from if you are adverse to heeling, or reefing early.

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Crusoe said..

MorningBird said..
10 kts of breeze and heeled 20-25 deg. Wonder what she would do in 20-25 kts? On her ear!

My thoughts exactly MB. But I thought she maybe even healed more than 25deg. If I did that with the misses on boat it would be divorce. (Now there's an idea)

Ill tell her you said that

That looks like a pretty nice race boat compromise. Wonder what it rates on IRC. Very similar concept to the Beneteau First 45 which are capable of taking out the S2H overall. I have the "super ceded" First 44.7 which rates pretty handy under IRC and has taken out some of the major Int ocean races on IRC. With cruising gear aboard (headsail furler and lazy jack bags) then have an extremely fast and comfortable cruising boat that can cross oceans. Don't worry naval architecture and modern construction materials have left the old boats that you guys seem to glorify as old ****ters. I don't have shortage of attractive females and capable offshore sailors willing to test out the security of the fitted lee cloths at sea.

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frant said..
That looks like a pretty nice race boat compromise. Wonder what it rates on IRC. Very similar concept to the Beneteau First 45 which are capable of taking out the S2H overall. I have the "super ceded" First 44.7 which rates pretty handy under IRC and has taken out some of the major Int ocean races on IRC. With cruising gear aboard (headsail furler and lazy jack bags) then have an extremely fast and comfortable cruising boat that can cross oceans. Don't worry naval architecture and modern construction materials have left the old boats that you guys seem to glorify as old ****ters. I don't have shortage of attractive females and capable offshore sailors willing to test out the security of the fitted lee cloths at sea.

r
hahahahaha nice one frant .... well laaa de da ...... i do hope you look after those that succeed in the fight to get on your vessel ..........

If it makes you happy go for it Frant Im only waiting till I die so I'm in no big hurry any more and I think Ill still be able to raise my main sail when I'm over 85 . How many danish back packers will help you then

I would pass! Like I mean I would not take up the offer! Much prefer to punch along in my old Joe Adams 42 than to be upon some light weight pounding french production boat with barking orders and regs.

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southace said..
I would pass! Like I mean I would not take up the offer! Much prefer to punch along in my old Joe Adams 42 than to be upon some light weight pounding french production boat with barking orders and regs.

If that is the case no one will suggest that you do other than plod along in your old ****ter. But why do you you feel the need to put the Dehler 46 down if not hidden envy? I can assure you that the seagoing characteristics of a high performance boat and yes they are all ultimately built by the Beneteau parent company is far superior to the designs of yesteryear.

I didn't put it down I just suggested the lone helmsman with chicky should perhaps get the boat strait and level and going fast rather than beam on in 10 knots with sheets hard on for a photo shoot! Go back to sea Frant!

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southace said..
I didn't put it down I just suggested the lone helmsman with chicky should perhaps get the boat strait and level and going fast rather than beam on in 10 knots with sheets hard on for a photo shoot! Go back to see Frant!

Say it then. It looks like a very nice boat. Or can't you get the words out.

Hanse is now owned by Beneteau?

For all your protests Frant, that boat would be woeful on a passage or anywhere offshore. It is too tender, lot of form stability but little else. With that heel she is losing lots of power.
Moving around would be bloody hard and with the wide open spaces above and below dangerous in any seaway.
While unlikely, if she goes over she will never come back, with that beam she would be very stable inverted. Just guessing but angle of vanishing stability would be no more than 115-125 deg.
The Dehler 46 is clearly a cocktail boat, and probably a very nice one, but totally unsuitable outside in anything over 10kts and sea state 3.
:-)

No, hanse is not owned by Beneteau. Hanse is the second biggest yacht building company in the world and build ther boats in Germany. I'm with you frant, some of these guys might get a big suprise if the actualy went for a sail on some of these modern boats instead of judging them by the pictures. Myself or one of my family have owned or sailed most of the boats talked about in this forum and I can tell you now my current Hanse 575 blows them all away in all respects including ease of sailing, and stability. The only down side I can see is the cost. But if people like me don't buy new boats, there will be no reasonable cost second hand boats down the track. If any one wants to come for a sail in Brisbane I am alway happy to take on a passenger on a Wednesday or Saturday afternoon and you will see how easy it can be to sail a well set up big boat.

Morning bird you don't know what you are talking about. Go for a sail on one.

This topic is now impairng on the epic instalment of the Vikings. ! goodnight!

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frant said..

southace said..
I didn't put it down I just suggested the lone helmsman with chicky should perhaps get the boat strait and level and going fast rather than beam on in 10 knots with sheets hard on for a photo shoot! Go back to see Frant!

Say it then. It looks like a very nice boat. Or can't you get the words out.

boats are like looking at ladies its what ever turns you on some countries the bigger the better > all the more to love boats are much the same enjoys what ever you like
Goma Pile said it lifes like a box of chocolates

Interesting design differences!



Yeah, lots of lost power?

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Jode5 said..
Morning bird you don't know what you are talking about. Go for a sail on one.

I would have said that "you are talking through your arse" .you are too polite Jode5. I do suggest that anybody should have a look at the design pedigree of these boats before shooting off at the mouth. The First 44.7 is a Bruce Farr design.the Delher 46 from Judel Vrolijk and co. Then have a look at the construction. Then go for a sail on one or better not because you won't be able to go back.

Anarchy has a nice little summation:

sailinganarchy.com/2014/12/12/taking-it-on-the-chine/

Your always right frant! Are you a ex failed school teacher by any chance? Please just remind us of your man overboard procedure in a storm? Was it something to do with alcohol and knife?

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southace said..
Your always right frant! Are you a ex failed school teacher by any chance? Please just remind us of your man overboard procedure in a storm? Was it something to do with alcohol and knife?

That my friend is probably true. I am always right and you are always wrong.
Now be a good chap and go back to your alcohol induced stupor.

I'd personally love a Dehler 46, they're so damn sexy!!! And I'm sure they sail bloody damn well too! Guess everyone has different interests in what their boats purpose is all about. They're obviously doing something right cause there's a shedload of them around the pittwater..
But for me for now I'm very happy with my 'old' Adams in my pen

I would imagine that these boats are built to what the current market demands. No use building something that won't sell. Everyone likes to get a bit of speed out of their boat and the question always comes up with regard to how high can the boat point to the wind. The design of boats over the years changes and a lot of it is from the hard fought lessons learn in the racing realms. So why wouldn't the new boat designs take on some of these characteristics. A boat shaped like the Dehler 46 a few years back would have been considered a racing boat but these days if you change the rig, you can call it a Cruiser/Racer. There's probably a bigger market for boat under this classification. A lot will end up being club racers, weekenders or in a bare boat fleet. Some will do costal passages and a few may do ocean passages. The result being that the majority of these boats will suit the purpose that were brought for.

As far as the size of the cockpit goes, they have to try and compete with the entertainment area on the double hulled converted tennis courts. The Dehler 46 may not be my choice (the misses would love it) for extended ocean passages when the weather turns to $hit, but would be quite comfortable (with a bit more sun/weather shade) when anchored up, which is what boats do 95% of their time.

All very fair comments Crusoe.

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HG02 said..

frant said..

southace said..
I didn't put it down I just suggested the lone helmsman with chicky should perhaps get the boat strait and level and going fast rather than beam on in 10 knots with sheets hard on for a photo shoot! Go back to see Frant!

Say it then. It looks like a very nice boat. Or can't you get the words out.

boats are like looking at ladies its what ever turns you on some countries the bigger the better > all the more to love boats are much the same enjoys what ever you like
Goma Pile said it lifes like a box of chocolates

Come now HG. Very few in this world would prefer saggy to perky. Same with boats. Maybe saggy is all that you have and that is by no means not good for you but every man surely would prefer to have at least one more perky experience in life.

Shame on you HG for suggesting to us an opinion that may differ from 'The Frant' (aka 'Front'). They may have a 'Gag Order" on him at the bar of the RGYC ( I made that up Frant ) but luckily for us, they have not been able to stop him from using social media to enlighten us mere dreamers of the true path to sailing Nirvana.

Keep it coming Frant, because your delivery style (way with words) keeps reminding me of one of the reasons why I brought a boat in the first place.

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frant said..
That looks like a pretty nice race boat compromise. Wonder what it rates on IRC. Very similar concept to the Beneteau First 45 which are capable of taking out the S2H overall. I have the "super ceded" First 44.7 which rates pretty handy under IRC and has taken out some of the major Int ocean races on IRC. With cruising gear aboard (headsail furler and lazy jack bags) then have an extremely fast and comfortable cruising boat that can cross oceans. Don't worry naval architecture and modern construction materials have left the old boats that you guys seem to glorify as old ****ters. I don't have shortage of attractive females and capable offshore sailors willing to test out the security of the fitted lee cloths at sea.

Sorry, but this is just too good not to buy into!

I doubt very much a First 45 would take out the S2H on overall.
Trouble is @ around 11 tonne displacement they tend to park up when the wind drops to 10 knots or below, which will always happen, even in that race.
I know Derek and Marty who campaign 'Black Sheep' very well and they know how to eek every last drop out of any yacht. About mid pack is where it's at on their 45 in the Hobarts'.They can occasionally get to the pointy end on the local regattas around Sydney.

I have crewed on a 44.7, (ex Shogun) and felt it was a good boat without being a standout. Agree with you that in cruising mode, a sensational fast cruiser that will get you quickly between ports and safely.