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Crusoe said..
Hello Shagger, I bring my 40 into the berth all the time by myself. (And also usually done by myself when I have inexperienced crew on board). The bow doesn't blow around like yours (not as quickly anyway) as mine has a cut-away keel and not a fin (I presume) like yours.

I have a line fixed to a bit aft of midship that I just step off the boat with and tie to the first cleat on the pontoon. You may be able to use the second dock cleat. The boat is still moving forward as I do this and I used this line to slow/stop the boat. this mean you have to wrap it around the cleat to get some friction. I make this line real short and have fenders either side (besides the other fenders) so as the boat rocks, it can't touch the paint work. I painted her about 5 years back and have no scratches (touch wood).

You may need a bridal between your mid and aft cleats to get the desired location. The desired location can be easily worked out. If you release all your mooring lines while standing on the pontoon and try and hold it against the pontoon, you will find a location where the bow and stern are balanced between you point of attachment/holding.

This is only a temporary tie off point as I then have a second line that has been run from the bow to mid ship, that I can easily reach once the first line is tied off. I then take this second line further along and secure the bow from visiting the neighbours boat.

Once this is done, I can relax a bit (engine off, open a refreshment) and then move the boat further into the pen by easing/pulling these ropes and setting up the mooring lines as required.

Works for me

Hi Crusoe,
I get you, you use the bridle to try and find the centre point, like this?
Edit: Or I should say the pivot point?

HI Selkie,
This is what you mean, right? Excuse the crappy drawings..........not very good at drawing nice curvy lines...

Single handed I set up to reverse the boat into the pen. I swing the boat into the pen off a stern line in reverse. The stern line can slide down a length of rope that runs down the length of the pen and keeps the stern in control at any position in the pen. When you pick up the stern line from the pen and cleat it to the stern, you also put a rope that you have set up going to the bow behind the the cleat on the slip and with this rope you control the bow by feeding out line and retrieving it as the boat turns. If you mess up picking up the one rope you just go around again.
I think going in backwards is the safest and easiest way to park when single handed or when its blowing hard. Everything is set from the cockpit before you even enter the pen.

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Shaggybaxter said..

FreeRadical said..
My pen is exactly the same as yours Shags, nearly always a wind on the for port quarter, and in WA, usually 20kts. We have a dedicated docking spring on the pier at the end of the dock.

My method is I come down the alley in idle, wind behind and swing to port into the pen, I let the aft overshoot a bit and come in at an angle almost like your second picture. I put a bit of reverse to slow, careful of prop walk to starboard and then swing the back in towards the dock. i can then grab the spring line off the pole and put it over the mid cleat. Back to the helm and reverse as needed to stop a jolt on the spring. I can then just reach out and grab the line to put on the rear cleat, engage forward and put all the other lines on. All our lines are fixed to the dock and eye spliced to correct length, just go around with a boat hook and pick them up. The docking spring is hung back on the pole and a fixed one that goes correctly through the fairlead is attached.

We we also have a pen catcher in case you stuff it up, but that requires a pier between the 2 pens at the back, do you have that?

when single handing out of the pen, to stop the bow dropping, I run a line from cockpit to forward mooring line and back. I can the play the line out keeping the nose straight, and haul it in when out of the mooring line eye.

by the look of your pictures and the shape of your hull, you'd probably need something half way between the mid and rear cleats. Can you rig a tweaker type loop to pass the spring through before going to the mid cleat?

Hi FR,
Thanks! Can I ask a couple of dumb questions;
Is it hard/far to get from the helm to the mid cleat on your boat?
Is the rear cleat line suspended, or just lying on the dock (I assume the lines are on the dock?)
No, I don't have a pen catcher (sigh).
You lost me a bit on the fairlead mate, where is this situated?

Hi Shags,

The green line hanging on the pole is our docking spring, grab when coming in and put it between pushpit and first stanchion straight to cleat. When docked, we put the black one on that goes correctly through the toe rail fairlead And back to the cleat. If we put it that way coming in, it would cause the nose to pull in. The mid cleat is just aft of widest beam, a direct line to rear dock cleat makes the boat hold nicely against the dock with forward revs.

the rear cleat line is on the dock or in the water, grab it with short pole. The extra black rear line in the picture is just so we can pull the back of the boat hard against the dock for easier boarding.

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Jolene said..
Single handed I set up to reverse the boat into the pen. I swing the boat into the pen off a stern line in reverse. The stern line can slide down a length of rope that runs down the length of the pen and keeps the stern in control at any position in the pen. When you pick up the stern line from the pen and cleat it to the stern, you also put a rope that you have set up going to the bow behind the the cleat on the slip and with this rope you control the bow by feeding out line and retrieving it as the boat turns. If you mess up picking up the one rope you just go around again.
I think going in backwards is the safest and easiest way to park when single handed or when its blowing hard. Everything is set from the cockpit before you even enter the pen.

Hi Joelene,
Sorry, brain cells are working but not connecting all the dots yet.
I understand the stern line connecting to a runner.
Have I drawn the bow line in the right place?

Wouldn't you run the risk of the boat blowing off, as the stern line parallels the bow line? (not opposing angles)

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Shaggybaxter said..

Crusoe said..
Hello Shagger, I bring my 40 into the berth all the time by myself. (And also usually done by myself when I have inexperienced crew on board). The bow doesn't blow around like yours (not as quickly anyway) as mine has a cut-away keel and not a fin (I presume) like yours.

I have a line fixed to a bit aft of midship that I just step off the boat with and tie to the first cleat on the pontoon. You may be able to use the second dock cleat. The boat is still moving forward as I do this and I used this line to slow/stop the boat. this mean you have to wrap it around the cleat to get some friction. I make this line real short and have fenders either side (besides the other fenders) so as the boat rocks, it can't touch the paint work. I painted her about 5 years back and have no scratches (touch wood).

You may need a bridal between your mid and aft cleats to get the desired location. The desired location can be easily worked out. If you release all your mooring lines while standing on the pontoon and try and hold it against the pontoon, you will find a location where the bow and stern are balanced between you point of attachment/holding.

This is only a temporary tie off point as I then have a second line that has been run from the bow to mid ship, that I can easily reach once the first line is tied off. I then take this second line further along and secure the bow from visiting the neighbours boat.

Once this is done, I can relax a bit (engine off, open a refreshment) and then move the boat further into the pen by easing/pulling these ropes and setting up the mooring lines as required.

Works for me

Hi Crusoe,
I get you, you use the bridle to try and find the centre point, like this?
Edit: Or I should say the pivot point?

Sort of how you have draw it. The bridal would be nice and tight as drawn in the picture, but the rope from the bridal to the cleat would also be as short as possible when first attached. You maybe be able to use the second clear depending how much room you still have to spare between the bow and the end of the pen. Ya don't what to come too close to the end.

My boat is a centre cockpit and there is a winch mounted in the right spot to use as an attachment point, so I don't need a bridal set up.

Good luck sorting out a way that works for you. Some day I look like a professional (of course when no ones looking) and other days when the winds up and the current if helping the boat into the pen (sometime I have the motor in reverse to slow the boats forward motion) there's a bit of fancy foot work needed.

Thanks Free! Makes perfect sense!

Thank you Crusoe! I agree, when I had my worst effort yet, (the boat ended up angled across both my neighbours and my pen's) I stole a look around, phew! nobody watching. Until I tied up and wandered up to the bar for a needed drink. The whole bar knew. I spent the next two hours getting lots of ribbing and advice

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Shaggybaxter said..
Wouldn't you run the risk of the boat blowing off, as the stern line parallels the bow line? (not opposing angles)

Your drawing is correct Shaggy, Not too sure what you mean there,? But once I have the boat in the pen I put in place the springers and other bow and stern lines.
I also should have mentioned that that I start the maneuver T boning the dock as I cant reverse up to it safely. Putting it in backwards also means I can drive it straight out without reversing out backwards out of control.
Set up like this with the springers trying to spin the boat and the bow and stern ropes stopping the rotation. Doing it like this holds the boat of the dock

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Shaggybaxter said..
Hi Papabear,
I am currently working on exactly that. The first attempt was ( believe it or not..sheepish) cable ties strapped laterally to round out the loop.
Then it was a few inches of clear tube over the rope to form a loop.
You reach out as you come past and drop it on from the helm position, so not much wriggle room if you get it wrong, hard astern!
I am currently looking at getting one of these , I saw them at the local chandlery (Muir's) they look pretty cool.



It's called a Cleat Captor Docking Aid

Hi Shaggy,
Jumping in a bit here - like you, I have a loop. It's simply the rope in clear plastic tube and is about 400mm dia. I drop it on the cleat with a boat hook.
No need for a Cleat Captor thingy.
regards,
allan

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Shaggybaxter said...
HI Selkie,
This is what you mean, right? Excuse the crappy drawings..........not very good at drawing nice curvy lines...

Morning Shaggy
sorry...had to shepherd the girls to bed.
yep, that's what I me. Get it hooked over your aft cleat, then as you walk forward with it and get it onto the midships cleat, your bow is under control.

Maybe I'm simplifying things too much and in Fokboat mindset (26ft, 2.1ton)?

I fully sympathize with the problem Shaggy.

In NZ I had a 40ft boat and parking in Auckland marina was scary. Current under the berth running one way and 20kt breeze on top.

Even getting out of the berth was hairy. One day I nearly took out 10 neighbors bows in a row.

I know you want to do it single handed. After my scary event to get practice in NZ I got some mates to come down to my berth and fend me off while I practiced a few ways of doing it.

The way that worked was LMYs suggestion.

I put big fenders on my bow before coming in to reduce my stress levels, hooked on the stern line as I went past (With a BIG loop to make sure I wouldnt miss the bollard which would then pull the boat up with a bit of a jolt and that would slow the bow from blowing off, then leave it going at high throttle which slowly swung the bow in while I jumped off and tied off the bow. Bollard on dock, cleat on deck and stern line have to be strong.

Hi Shaggy

You have probably had more advice than you need but i will tell what I do in case it might work for you.

First I tie the stern springer and the aft mooring line together.

Then I nose into the dock slowly and nearly stop the boat one third to halfway down the finger, if the wind/tide is pushing me into the dock I just step off and holding the springer and the aft mooring line together, then I tie of the springer which starts to bring the bow into the dock and pushes the stern out then I tie off the stern line to stop the stern swinging to far out, then the boat will sit there while I relax.

If the wind/ tide is pushing me away from the berth I slow the boat to a stop then give it a bit of forward thrust before I step off, then once those two lines are cleated off I jump back on and put it in forward and the boat will just sit there half or two thirds of the way into the pen.

All this is easy on a boat with low freeboard, might be a bit trickier with more freeboard

But more importantly, do you think that Pogo 12.5 is good value at $350K Looks like a bargain to me!

I have setup 3-4 pens with very similar issues to yours, all with sliding lines.

The way I would go about it it to set up a line (probably out of 8mm dyneema) that goes the length of your pen, probably under the
Sliding on that (probably using ally thimbles like you would have on your barber haulers) I would have a piece of double braid with a loop to go over the bow cleat, just long enough to let the bow go to the centreline of your pen.

So when you bring the boat in you stop the boat on a 45 deg angle to the wind, run fwd and grab the double braid and put it over the bow cleat. The boa now cannot go off centreline of the pen. You can even do this with a slight but of fwd and turning momentum into the pen.

No with the rudders had to STB and motor in FWD the bow will not move but the boat will move fwd and the stern stay close to the dock.

The as you move fwd grab the springer that stops you moving fwd, then the stern line.

One thing is to make sure the sliding rope does not stop the boat going fwd at all as this will swing the stern out.

Hope that helps

Shaggy, I don't want to sound negative but I think that singlehanded docking of your boat into that pen is going to be nigh on impossible and will on some occasion lead to major grief (ie serious prang causing damage to you or others).
Suggest you will almost always need at least one other hand that knows procedure, either dockside on on boat to attend to lines,while you attend to manouvering. You will have to come in hot in your boat to maintain any steerage, probably about 5 knots or 2.5 metres per second. That gives you about 4-5 seconds from when your bow enters the dock to when you have to pull up or smack bow into pontoon. If you have to come in with keel up will further add to your woes as the boat might be pointing into your pen but momentum will be still along the fairway.ie you will be sliding sideways rather than carving an arc.
What you will have to learn to do is come in hot, sliding sideways to some extent as a function of how far down the keel is, and pull up with a big blast of reverse then drop the bow and stern lines on before the wind blows your bow down. Your major problem with any springer type solution is that you dont have the use of prop wash steering to move the bow/stern in the required direction. The key of course to any docking procedure is to have a bail out exit strategy and know when to bail. Unfortunately your situation leaves very little to no bail out when things start going pear shaped.
Afraid you are either going to be a Rock Star or an insurance claimee

Heaps of advice here. To keep it simple, when we berth the 54ft Sailors with Disabilities boat at the CYCA we have heaps of crew but it could be done single handed, except in strong winds.
We reverse in stbd side to. Get the stern line on immediately, this is the tricky bit single handed as you have to leave the helm to throw the line over the cleat on the jetty. Once the stern line is on, put it in forward at idle revs with the wheel to stbd and it holds the bow in while we get a bow line on. Although we do this with a crew it could be done by one unless a strong wind was going to take the bow away from the jetty.

I'm thinking of inventing a blow up V that floats in your berth you can just drive strait into it and put your lines on while in gear. Want to be my first customer Shaggy?

I might try a blow up doll as a prototype and something to aim for!

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southace said..
I'm thinking of inventing a blow up V that floats in your berth you can just drive strait into it and put your lines on while in gear. Want to be my first customer Shaggy?

I might try a blow up doll as a prototype and something to aim for!

It s not such as silly idea, the blow up dolls I mean

I'm thinking now of a 1mtr x 3mtr tube that can be inflated across the berth with secure saddles on each end. Post anywhere. Called the solo stopper ok I'm of to the patient office!

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andy59 said..

southace said..
I'm thinking of inventing a blow up V that floats in your berth you can just drive strait into it and put your lines on while in gear. Want to be my first customer Shaggy?

I might try a blow up doll as a prototype and something to aim for!

It s not such as silly idea, the blow up dolls I mean

What would you use as the "pick up line"??

Forget the hooker I just push her in?

One of our owners was a bit hesitant about bringing the boat in and out of the pen when we first got it. He got one of his old salt friends down at dawn one calm day before the gawkers arrived and practiced, practiced, practiced.

Now he docks like a boss!

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FreeRadical said..
One of our owners was a bit hesitant about bringing the boat in and out of the pen when we first got it. He got one of his old salt friends down at dawn one calm day before the gawkers arrived and practiced, practiced, practiced.

Now he docks like a boss!

Don't we all do it like that?

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MorningBird said..

FreeRadical said..
One of our owners was a bit hesitant about bringing the boat in and out of the pen when we first got it. He got one of his old salt friends down at dawn one calm day before the gawkers arrived and practiced, practiced, practiced.

Now he docks like a boss!

Don't we all do it like that?

Yup , what other way is there ?

I can vouch for FreeRads technique after experiencing it earlier today. A case of simple is sometime best.

Nice boat mate and thanks for the ride home

If docking is tight one of the handiest things to have is a midships cleat from which to deploy a short breast line. Once that is attached one can rush forward or aft as required to complete docking control.

Of course one of the keys to successful docking of a yacht is to take it nice and slow.

You guys and gals mentioned quite a few possible solutions, so why not a few more?

1.
It would be akin to the 'V' bow catcher on the centre line of the bottom of your pen. Just what Cisco mentioned but on both sides.
It would be two breast lines (fairly thick ones, preferrably laid, hawser like ones, baized to minimise scratching the hull) fast to the centre line of the bottom of your pen and led to the appropriate point which you have to experiment with, on your port and stb.. The stb. side should be negotiated with the neighbour as the line would be cleated to his yacht. Also an arrangement should be made with same, for when he sails away .
Or...

2.
I am thinking about a 22.5inch truck tube on each side of your bow. Or two.
Strategically placed to fend you off every time you are coming in. They last for years on the sun and if one makes a cover for them, they are for forever.

Just a thought about your "mates" who were playing you at the bar, after your near accident. Did they ever thought to shut up and give you a hand? (Gee that part pissed me off... no wonder, l am called a misantrope.)

Also, you are paying a pretty penny for that pen, l presume. So why not giving the dockmaster a call when you are coming in alone? It is his responsibility after all?! (The 'mates' can chew the cud on that!)

As l sail mostly single handed, l feel your anguish parking your new yacht in an unhandy pen. I am lucky as l have a mooring. If l missed it first time, l just come around again.

I am puzzled. What on earth are some of you talking about when mentioning "bridal"????? The nautical dictionary does not know of it.
Is someone trying to hitch the blow up doll?

Some great ideas here I intend to try. Particularly the V thing at the bow. Last time I came in I didn't put in reverse soon enough and just bumped the dock with my bow. Love the idea of the line on the dock Selkie. I haven't had to dock alone yet. I have had someone there to give me a hand. There's usually someone around and I have a few phone numbers of neighbours that I line up to help when I come in.
Shaggy, I agree with Sirgallivant... make use of help to dock if you can.

Some of this sounds a bit like getting in a car with a stranger and after they have scared you a bit you ask if they can drive?? they say,, "don't worry mate, the car has airbags"

I think the problem with Shaggy's boat is not so much Shaggy as the boat itself. It's a flighty little number that dances and prances on top of the water much like a nervous thoroughbred race horse.
As Free Radical said, practice, practice and then practice some more, go and press gang those who would laugh at you from the sanctity of the bar and have at the ready to fend off.

Other thing to bear in mind is the order of magnitude of the forces involved and the ability of a human to impart or absorb those forces. ie the Bollard pull of your engine 1000-2000kg. The wind loading in 20 knots blowing the bow down approx 100kg. A 40 footer is (even a lightweight flyer) not something to me manhandled with ease.