Hi all, first time poster and long time anonymous viewer of the site seeking some advice - thanks in advance!

Essentially planning to take a year off in the next few years and sail along the east coast of Australia initially, followed by some longer trips (e.g. LHI, Fiji). I have 2 main questions:
1) What recommendations would you have for buying/financing a first boat?
- would you opt for taking a loan and buying something a little nicer e.g Jenneau/Beneteau ~$200K
- or would the preference be for something perhaps a little older and buying it outright e.g. $50-100K
- thoughts on private sales vs brokers?

2) Any recommendation on particularly reliable models/makes that are capable of coastal cruising with Bluewater capabilities? I was looking in the 35-45ft range
Some background to help,
I'm a 27yo QLD doctor who likely won't be undergoing this trip for another 3 years, after I sit some very difficult exams - after which I'll take 12 months off. I'd be travelling with my partner who has no experience.

Sailing Experience:
- have completed a few courses in herons over the past 6 months, and helped crew in the odd race
- will be continuing to participate in clubs with further lessons to help abilities/fuel the obsession over the next few years
- 2 weeks on larger monohulls/catamarans in the Whitsundays and Mediterranean in more of a 'party' role
- have recreationally fished on small fishing boats my whole life

Finances
- have about $40K saved currently and continuing to save. Have a car without debt but no other assets, renting at the moment

Apologies for the protracted length but many thanks for your help, it's much appreciated.

Cheers,
D

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darc587 said..
- would you opt for taking a loan and buying something a little nicer e.g Jenneau/Beneteau ~$200K
- or would the preference be for something perhaps a little older and buying it outright e.g. $50-100K
- thoughts on private sales vs brokers?

Opinion 1 don't borrow for a boat.
Opinion 2 what would it take for your partner to enjoy it with you.
Answer number 2 and that's your starting point.

Take your partner down to the Royal Queensland Yacht Squadron at Manly and both get crewing positions on a racing yacht. Spend other people's money first while you decide what you both really want.

Then, Charter a yacht in the Whitsundays,with an experienced skipper .

An alternative suggestion,

Buy a tidy trailer sailer with rust free trailer within your current car's towing capacity. Weekend on it once a fortnight, with some longer trips when possible. Start with dams then work up to bays and coastal hops. Maintain the boat but don't drop money into it unnecessarily. Sell it for what you paid for it in two years.
Both do RYA day skipper to round out your knowledge and to learn how to manoeuvre someone else's keelboat in confined spaces with confidence.

With two years you will have had issues on the water, learnt to live in confined spaces with little, and both of you feel comfortable a practiced in instinctive sailing for a solid base for further keel boat adventures. I suggest you will gain far more than solely crewing on others keelboats.

Then you can approach 1 & 2 from an informed position with two years of extra savings.

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darc587 said..
likely won't be undergoing this trip for another 3 years, after I sit some very difficult exams - after which I'll take 12 months off. I'd be travelling with my partner who has no experience.

Finances
- have about $40K saved currently and continuing to save. Have a car without debt but no other assets, renting at the moment

Good advice above. The best thing you can spend your money on is your experience.

The trailer sailer option is a good one, if you have somewhere to park it. Get a small one in good condition, on a good trailer for $10K to $15K. By small, I mean something in the 18 to 22ft range. It's a little like buying a vintage car because it will teach you heaps about what it means to own one. In three years, sell it and move up to a bigger boat. Keep a log or diary, which will help you understand costs. There is a fair gap between getting a $40K boat that is fine for bays and near-shore waters, and something that will take you to Fiji and back. The best way to understand that is to get some experience.

There is a truism that says go small. go cheap and go now.

If you want a handle on costs, I worked out that my 28ft keel boat cost me about $1000 per month for the 3 years I owned it. Some people on this forum will say that was too much and others will say that was too little. You can read more on my blog here theboattinkerer.blogspot.com/2024/03/episode-41-tallying-up-costs.html

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PLanter4 said..
Then, Charter a yacht in the Whitsundays,with an experienced skipper .

And experience the difference between a Cat and Monohull. For coastal cruising and mucking about anywhere north a cat is the way to go .

This year our Whitsunday cruise is for 2 vessels back to back, the Catalina 350 we had last year, for a week then step straight onto a Dufour, a bit indulgent maybe, we have friends joining us on the second week so that was excuse enough for me to get a bigger boat. Beside it's an excellent way to get a first hand look at what you like and what you don't. You've been there in a party role so take the next step. There's other areas available to charter yachts in our part of the world but you have to look for them

You're a doctor. If your sitting exams it's probably for some specialty that is going to earn you big bucks for the rest of your life. I would charter in the Whitsundays.
I would buy something in the $100 to $150k mark that will take you Bluewater cruising with little effort. Although they depreciate and have a high maintanence cost they still have a value so it's still an asset. Boats in that value have generally depreciated already and don't dive in value. Keep your $40k for your travels.

time is precious. I would consider borrowing the money in your situation. And buy a boat through a reputable broker that will guide you through the process (find your own surveyor)

How are you going to borrow or make loan payments if you don't have a job?
Maybe I'm too cautious but I wouldn't buy a boat and take a year off unless I had the money for the boat, the maintenance and a year's worth of fun.
Anything else would be stressful for me as I would be worried about spending money (and you can be sure that unexpected expenses will arise).

I guess that's the difference between my generation and younger ones. If you don't have the money for your own boat it does however now seem possible to bum your way around Oz or the world as crew - particularly if your partner is good looking ;).

Strikes me that with two people working good jobs a better plan might be to sacrifice now, save seriously for two years and then go.

It's not like you're in your 60s and may not have the energy or health in a couple of years although of course nothing in life is guaranteed.

You can spend the two years learning how to sail properly. Preferably on someone else's boat but possibly also on say a $20,000? boat.

OR buy a nice boat put it with a world wide charter company, it will earn a few dollars it's yours to use and you can also get discounts chartering one of the other vessels in the fleet around the planet

Honestly, buy a boat with capability of your adventures in mind, rather than financial ability. There's a lot of good boats around that might not be as fancy but will keep resale value well, will perform exceptionally, and safe. You could buy a $200k production boat and next minute be up for $20k in hull structure repairs, mast reconditioning or replacement, winch problems... etc etc.
Personally I bought mine with a tried and true perspective both in design and previous upkeep and it's paid off.

Just to get on the water,if in Sydney - There is a lovely Contessa 25 on Gumtree for <5k ( would grab it myself but already have one ) + also a Swanson 36 for 10k . Could be fun,and not enough $ to frighten ?
Mason

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darc587 said..
Hi all, first time poster and long time anonymous viewer of the site seeking some advice - thanks in advance!

Essentially planning to take a year off in the next few years and sail along the east coast of Australia initially, followed by some longer trips (e.g. LHI, Fiji). I have 2 main questions:
1) What recommendations would you have for buying/financing a first boat?
- would you opt for taking a loan and buying something a little nicer e.g Jenneau/Beneteau ~$200K
- or would the preference be for something perhaps a little older and buying it outright e.g. $50-100K
- thoughts on private sales vs brokers?

2) Any recommendation on particularly reliable models/makes that are capable of coastal cruising with Bluewater capabilities? I was looking in the 35-45ft range
Some background to help,
I'm a 27yo QLD doctor who likely won't be undergoing this trip for another 3 years, after I sit some very difficult exams - after which I'll take 12 months off. I'd be travelling with my partner who has no experience.

Sailing Experience:
- have completed a few courses in herons over the past 6 months, and helped crew in the odd race
- will be continuing to participate in clubs with further lessons to help abilities/fuel the obsession over the next few years
- 2 weeks on larger monohulls/catamarans in the Whitsundays and Mediterranean in more of a 'party' role
- have recreationally fished on small fishing boats my whole life

Finances
- have about $40K saved currently and continuing to save. Have a car without debt but no other assets, renting at the moment

Apologies for the protracted length but many thanks for your help, it's much appreciated.

Cheers,
D

Currently there is a Westsail 43 for sale for 90k

There you go my friend

yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/westsail-43/291567

Serb

One boat that alot of people enjoy is the Catalina 34 mk ll
Roomy for a 34, sugar scoop stern, wheel steering, masthead single spreader rig,,, alot of enjoyment to be had for approx 100k - 150k .

When I researched and bought my first keelboat, I met a lot of blokes who'd bought a boat expecting their partners or family to come sailing but who found in the end they didn't want to. Not to be deterred, I thought to myself - I'll buy the biggest boat I'd feel comfortable sailing solo, and fixed on a 30' Ted Brewer designed cruising boat. Now that I can handle that fairly easily, I might consider a 34' or thereabouts, but probably not much larger. For example, I was looking over an Adams Traditional 36 at the time and the owner said "sometimes it takes all of my strength to winch in the genoa sheet". You can have power winches etc, but that's just another thing to go wrong. So you might want to consider something smallish, and then spend the money to make sure all of the various systems are working - electricial, rigging, engine and so on. I bought a boat with an almost new Yanmar in it for practically the prices of a new engine install, so the boat was thrown in for free - that's important as many cruisers say they end up motoring one third of the time. My fairly limited cruising history bears that out, both in my trailer sailer and now in my keelboat. A lot of yachties enjoy working on and fixing their boats, so if you have that inclination you could do worse that to buy a solid old hull and go through the steps of upgrading the engine, electrics, rigging etc. Expensive, but then when you're at sea and something goes wrong you'll know what to do. One boat that I really liked was the Arends 33, which would fit most of the criteria above - right age to be cheap enough, shallowish draft for entering bays etc, enough room for a couple to live comfortably and just at the outer limit of what I'd regard as a comfortable boat for berthing and handling when the wind is up. This old ad gives the general idea ... www.dbyboatsales.com.au/listing/arends-33-6/ If you're going to have a high-earning career, you'll be able to get any boat you like but for many sailors I know that's not the point - getting something modest and making it your own is a journey in itself, before you even head out to sea. And one more thing ... as the renegade designer George Buehler pointed out in his books, obsessing over this point or that point might suit racers, but for cruisers "sailing's supposed to be fun!" So enjoy...

My 2 cents worth, I agree with Saltiest1, buy a boat based on what your intended use is, you mentioned coastal cruising and some Bluewater crossings.

40 to 45 is the sweet spot for most cruisers. Small enough to access most anchorages and marinas, sail loads are not to large for a couple but the boat is still large enough to carry the fuel water and equipment and provisions needed to go off grid for extended periods in relative comfort for both of you.

I know 40 to 45 sounds large but my 44 is so much easier to handle then a friends 26ft trailer sailor with just two of us. She is a conservative design set up for a couple to cruise and everything she does is predictable and quite forgiving and with large (4") toe rails and grab handles everywhere etc etc moving around is easy. Just going up to the bow on my friends trailer sailor you basically need to crawl for fear of falling off in any type of seaway. A bit of size and weight can make a boat a lot more friendly when the wind picks up a bit.

Big brands are easier to sell but I think you pay more for them and can get a much better bang for you buck if you leave brand name aside and focus on design and construction as the number one and two priorities on your criteria list.

So decide on the length and displacement you want, the construction type you want, the keel and rudder type you want, the rig type you want, then move onto the accommodation you want, the tankage, the equipment, then look at the condition and age etc etc. You will find the list of suitable boats narrows very quickly.

If you don't know what length, displacement,construction, keel rig and other design factors you want then start reading and asking questions so you have a good understanding and will then be able to buy the boat that suits you best.

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BluewaterBound said..
When I researched and bought my first keelboat, I met a lot of blokes who'd bought a boat expecting their partners or family to come sailing but who found in the end they didn't want to. Not to be deterred, I thought to myself - I'll buy the biggest boat I'd feel comfortable sailing solo, and fixed on a 30' Ted Brewer designed cruising boat. Now that I can handle that fairly easily, I might consider a 34' or thereabouts, but probably not much larger. For example, I was looking over an Adams Traditional 36 at the time and the owner said "sometimes it takes all of my strength to winch in the genoa sheet". You can have power winches etc, but that's just another thing to go wrong. So you might want to consider something smallish, and then spend the money to make sure all of the various systems are working - electricial, rigging, engine and so on. I bought a boat with an almost new Yanmar in it for practically the prices of a new engine install, so the boat was thrown in for free - that's important as many cruisers say they end up motoring one third of the time. My fairly limited cruising history bears that out, both in my trailer sailer and now in my keelboat. A lot of yachties enjoy working on and fixing their boats, so if you have that inclination you could do worse that to buy a solid old hull and go through the steps of upgrading the engine, electrics, rigging etc. Expensive, but then when you're at sea and something goes wrong you'll know what to do. One boat that I really liked was the Arends 33, which would fit most of the criteria above - right age to be cheap enough, shallowish draft for entering bays etc, enough room for a couple to live comfortably and just at the outer limit of what I'd regard as a comfortable boat for berthing and handling when the wind is up. This old ad gives the general idea ... www.dbyboatsales.com.au/listing/arends-33-6/ If you're going to have a high-earning career, you'll be able to get any boat you like but for many sailors I know that's not the point - getting something modest and making it your own is a journey in itself, before you even head out to sea. And one more thing ... as the renegade designer George Buehler pointed out in his books, obsessing over this point or that point might suit racers, but for cruisers "sailing's supposed to be fun!" So enjoy...

EXELLENT Advice mate, I got a lot out of it , cheers

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Serb1980 said..

darc587 said..
Hi all, first time poster and long time anonymous viewer of the site seeking some advice - thanks in advance!

Essentially planning to take a year off in the next few years and sail along the east coast of Australia initially, followed by some longer trips (e.g. LHI, Fiji). I have 2 main questions:
1) What recommendations would you have for buying/financing a first boat?
- would you opt for taking a loan and buying something a little nicer e.g Jenneau/Beneteau ~$200K
- or would the preference be for something perhaps a little older and buying it outright e.g. $50-100K
- thoughts on private sales vs brokers?

2) Any recommendation on particularly reliable models/makes that are capable of coastal cruising with Bluewater capabilities? I was looking in the 35-45ft range
Some background to help,
I'm a 27yo QLD doctor who likely won't be undergoing this trip for another 3 years, after I sit some very difficult exams - after which I'll take 12 months off. I'd be travelling with my partner who has no experience.

Sailing Experience:
- have completed a few courses in herons over the past 6 months, and helped crew in the odd race
- will be continuing to participate in clubs with further lessons to help abilities/fuel the obsession over the next few years
- 2 weeks on larger monohulls/catamarans in the Whitsundays and Mediterranean in more of a 'party' role
- have recreationally fished on small fishing boats my whole life

Finances
- have about $40K saved currently and continuing to save. Have a car without debt but no other assets, renting at the moment

Apologies for the protracted length but many thanks for your help, it's much appreciated.

Cheers,
D

Currently there is a Westsail 43 for sale for 90k

There you go my friend

yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/westsail-43/291567

Serb

Westsail more commonly known as a wet snail