I had a look at these today, looks like you would need a bunch of these to cover a voyage from to Sydney to Whitsunday. And at $38 each it seems expensive. Am I missing something here?

You might get them a bit cheaper at another provider, I think I paid $35 last time at Boatbooks. You might also get them 2nd hand.

I have large scale paper charts for the east coast and small scale ones for the ports I am likely to use, Swansea, Newcastle, Port Stephens, Port, Coffs etc.

The next problem is getting them up to date. I don't bother as it would be a full time job but you can get caught out.

When we were delivering Cisco's Second Wind we made a late notice decision to go into Port at night. I had up dated chart plotter charts but the leading lights had been replaced by a sector light which you would only know if you had looked the NOTAMS up for Port. We were confused for awhile.

My personal view is that paper charts are essential for navigation, although my primary navigation chart is the chart plotter. Paper charts are easier to read and plan on, especially when fatigued. Obviously they are also pretty useful when the chart plotter dies.

Select to expand quote

MorningBird said..
You might get them a bit cheaper at another provider, I think I paid $35 last time at Boatbooks. You might also get them 2nd hand.

I have large scale paper charts for the east coast and small scale ones for the ports I am likely to use, Swansea, Newcastle, Port Stephens, Port, Coffs etc.

The next problem is getting them up to date. I don't bother as it would be a full time job but you can get caught out.

When we were delivering Cisco's Second Wind we made a late notice decision to go into Port at night. I had up dated chart plotter charts but the leading lights had been replaced by a sector light which you would only know if you had looked the NOTAMS up for Port. We were confused for awhile.

My personal view is that paper charts are essential for navigation, although my primary navigation chart is the chart plotter. Paper charts are easier to read and plan on, especially when fatigued. Obviously they are also pretty useful when the chart plotter dies.

cheers MB
excuse my ignorance but what are NOTAMS and where do you get hold of them

I could highly recommend Memory Maps.
It may be your solution.

Select to expand quote

keensailor said..

excuse my ignorance but what are NOTAMS and where do you get hold of them

Notices to Mariners (NOTAMS)

get them here .. www.hydro.gov.au/n2m/notices.htm

great, Thanks!

Select to expand quote

sirgallivant said...
I could highly recommend Memory Maps.
It may be your solution.

+1
And you can print up to A3 size, in colour or black and white, any portion of any chart along the way for reference. You can apply a notice to mariners correction by adding a note or if it is new nav markers via an overlay. MM is a georeferenced image (no more than 12 months old) of the official Aus hydro chart and you can't get better than that!

Select to expand quote

LooseChange said...

keensailor said..

excuse my ignorance but what are NOTAMS and where do you get hold of them

Notices to Mariners (NOTAMS)

get them here .. www.hydro.gov.au/n2m/notices.htm

Just Nit picking here but I'm fairly certain Notice to Mariners are just that while Notam is Notice to Airman.

Going back into my box now

Yes Toph, you are correct in what you say. It's just for the sake of brevity I used NOTAMS as that was what MB had used. Perhaps I should have written NtM which are Notices to Mariners but as you can see the acronym would still have sounded like NOTAM.

No worries Loose Change. I'm sure we all knew what was meant.. I was just bored and hadn't posted for a while. I was getting withdrawals

Bellingham Chart Printers have been sold and not delivering on paid for ordered purchases. Per Cruising & Sailing forum.

Select to expand quote

LooseChange said..
Yes Toph, you are correct in what you say. It's just for the sake of brevity I used NOTAMS as that was what MB had used. Perhaps I should have written NtM which are Notices to Mariners but as you can see the acronym would still have sounded like NOTAM.

Yeah, my fault. As an ex aviator I tend to use the term NOTAM for both Notices to Airman and Notices to Mariners. A few ex Navy people tend to do the same. NOTAM is correctly Notices to Airman.

I've done that trip a couple of times now and I use the large scale for NSW and really only used the small scale when I get up to the Whitsundays, but navigate on the plotter.

Your guide books sometimes have more info anyway and you should use them, with the charts in conjunction.
Guides are: Beacon to Beacon, NP's Curtis Coast, 100 magic miles etc and Lucas of course.
As far as the Beacon to Beacon, I navigated on that instead of the charts, more info.

Last year the NOTAMS were out months ahead of the NtM's as far as the restrictions to the military north of Yepoon.

I heard they lifted them very quickly instead of going for the almost 3 months planned, after a lot of complaints.
I sailed through the area just before they came on. Next one will be in 2017, I think.

I think MemoryMap is a great option and quite reasonably priced for the east coast section.

Of course you need to have a USB GPS input to your PC but they are as cheap as chips online. We have been using the same one for six years now. Another thing with MemoryMap is that if you purchase the online version (cheaper) rather than the CD version you can download as much or as little of the charts as you need.

We use Navionics as our main Nav tool on our plotter and tablet. Navionics on the tablet is great as you can update your charts as often as you like. We use MemoryMap on our laptop although we could also have Navionics there as well.

We also carry paper charts for the entire east coast but rarely use them.

As an added thought. The Queensland Govt. now no longer insists on paper charts in it's waters as long as you have electronic charts for the area you are using.

Just my two bobs worth.

I highly rate the chart book, Crawfords "Port Stephans to Bundaberg" much easier to use than full sized paper charts

Select to expand quote

BlueMoon said..
I highly rate the chart book, Crawfords "Port Stephans to Bundaberg" much easier to use than full sized paper charts

Where did you buy this?
Could'nt find it online

Crawfords have always shown another book [4th] around the Prom to SA.

They are in SA and I did contact them [in 2014] but they said they had been overtaken
by the electronic age and as such what you can buy off the shelf [Whitworths/boat books etc] is it.

They made a big loss on the last edition.

So no more Crawfords, hang onto any copies you have as there won't be any more!

If one has the habit of marking his position on the paper chart every half hour or hour on a regular basis, one will not get any nasty surprises. Period.

I am navigating using my plotters but the paper charts are always at hand, on a long distance trip, marked at least hourly. I am talking about navigation, far away from land. In sight of land, one is n o t navigating!

If someone flicks the main switch of the GPS satellites or something like, lots of people trusting the system will be sadly surprised or worst.

The world's political situation is such, Arabic wars, Isil, Russian revival, Chinas rocket island and to boot, that idiot donald duck trump! , that we could lose our entitlement the GPS, sooner than later, imo.

l bloody well hope l am wrong!

Select to expand quote

sirgallivant said..
If one has the habit of marking his position on the paper chart every half hour or hour on a regular basis, one will not get any nasty surprises. Period.

I am navigating using my plotters but the paper charts are always at hand, on a long distance trip, marked at least hourly. I am talking about navigation, far away from land. In sight of land, one is n o t navigating!

If someone flicks the main switch of the GPS satellites or something like, lots of people trusting the system will be sadly surprised or worst.

The world's political situation is such, Arabic wars, Isil, Russian revival, Chinas rocket island and to boot, that idiot donald duck trump! , that we could lose our entitlement the GPS, sooner than later, imo.

l bloody well hope l am wrong!

All those nasty people depend on GPS as well. There might be some local jamming but it wont effect your sailing.

Select to expand quote

Ramona said..

sirgallivant said..
If one has the habit of marking his position on the paper chart every half hour or hour on a regular basis, one will not get any nasty surprises. Period.

I am navigating using my plotters but the paper charts are always at hand, on a long distance trip, marked at least hourly. I am talking about navigation, far away from land. In sight of land, one is n o t navigating!

If someone flicks the main switch of the GPS satellites or something like, lots of people trusting the system will be sadly surprised or worst.

The world's political situation is such, Arabic wars, Isil, Russian revival, Chinas rocket island and to boot, that idiot donald duck trump! , that we could lose our entitlement the GPS, sooner than later, imo.

l bloody well hope l am wrong!

All those nasty people depend on GPS as well. There might be some local jamming but it wont effect your sailing.

It isn't the GPS being turned off that is the risk. It is you losing electrics or losing your chartplotter due to a malfunction, a flood or lightning strike or whatever. A fix on the chart every hour or so on a coastal passage, you are only doing 5 kts so it isn't far, and once every watch when offshore. You can then DR to your destination.

Select to expand quote

Ramona said..

All those nasty people depend on GPS as well. There might be some local jamming but it wont effect your sailing.

All those nasty people will still have their GPS as it would only be the civilian frequency that would be shut down. The satellites will still quite happily orbit, transmitting their military only signals to their GPS units that can receive those frequencies.

Select to expand quote

MorningBird said..

Ramona said..

sirgallivant said..
If one has the habit of marking his position on the paper chart every half hour or hour on a regular basis, one will not get any nasty surprises. Period.

I am navigating using my plotters but the paper charts are always at hand, on a long distance trip, marked at least hourly. I am talking about navigation, far away from land. In sight of land, one is n o t navigating!

If someone flicks the main switch of the GPS satellites or something like, lots of people trusting the system will be sadly surprised or worst.

The world's political situation is such, Arabic wars, Isil, Russian revival, Chinas rocket island and to boot, that idiot donald duck trump! , that we could lose our entitlement the GPS, sooner than later, imo.

l bloody well hope l am wrong!

All those nasty people depend on GPS as well. There might be some local jamming but it wont effect your sailing.

It isn't the GPS being turned off that is the risk. It is you losing electrics or losing your chartplotter due to a malfunction, a flood or lightning strike or whatever. A fix on the chart every hour or so on a coastal passage, you are only doing 5 kts so it isn't far, and once every watch when offshore. You can then DR to your destination.

Seriously guys (and Gals),
If you lost your electronics, and your phone battery went flat and your tablet battery went flat and your laptop battery went flat and all of your spare batteries went flat, your solar panells all fell overboard and a croc chomped on your windvane in a fit of anger. As long as you were in sight of land on the east coast of Australia and in many other parts of the Aussie coast and had paper charts you could fix your position accurately within an hour at the very longest. As long as you had basic coastal nav. gear (ie, pencil, ruler, and hand bearing compass, and we should ALL have these on board) without having to have made any previous marks on your chart.
The problem is, we now live in a time when a great many people using our coastal waterways have no idea on how to manage even the basics of coastal navigation without a GPS and a plotter.
I don't believe for one minute that we will ever loose GPS reception for a multitude of reasons but we shouldn't be learning how to use basic navigation for that reason, we should be learning it because it's fun, it's what sailors do and it makes a lot of common sense.

In a previous life I had to prepare the NOTAMS for MorningBird before he committed aviation. What a nightmare. (the NOTAMS, not MorningBird!!)

A Lat and Long every hour entered in the log book on coastal voyages with course, average speed, distance to go, current, etc. I can work things through from there if any issues arrise down the track. On blue water voyages the entrys are every 6 hours unless any wind or course changes are made.
Moving map displays are great but I still havent thrown out the 2B pencils or charts. The hand bearing compass is still readily accessible too.

Agree, use GPS and plotters but always be aware of where you are same as when you're driving a car. When coastal cruising there's always landmarks and if you don't where you are try using the radio and ask someone who does.
Think back to Slocum, he rounded the world with a broken clock and the moon to guide him.

Slocum also went out for a sail one day and was never seen again.

I have a chart, just a one, just the area I am sailing in.
never use it, I know my area.
Last year I wandered a few miles pass the horizon .
My comfortable surroundings has change, turn the charts
a few times around, did some bearings - calculations ,
result was probably 3 meters from my chart.
can't by borthered, turn on the plotter and safely entered Yellow Patches.
is it just my experience ?

Select to expand quote

Auscruisers said..
Slocum also went out for a sail one day and was never seen again.

Yep, he didn't have AIS and a ship got him!

Pretty sure Slocum wasn't planning to book a berth in the home for retired Sea Captains

Select to expand quote

nswsailor said..

Auscruisers said..
Slocum also went out for a sail one day and was never seen again.

Yep, he didn't have AIS and a ship got him!

Not so sure it was a ship. The odds of him meeting a ship on the ocean in those days is pretty remote. More like he just sank.

Sirgallivant, Not going to happen the last time the Yanks turned of the GPS their own forces kept getting lost, (although turning it of is not what they do, they actually add a random bias to the GPS co-ordinates which in theory they can remove from their military equipment to allow their troops to still use the GPS system.), and was your not naming Hillary( I'm so stupid I married Bill) Clinton a comment on your political views or just a time saving device, (personally I wouldn't trust any political weener, who was looking to get into power their all corrupt, incompetent arseholes, no matter what their supposed political outlook is supposed to be, for public consumption.