Hi all

I was looking through HG's photo's and looking at the position of the mizzen mast in the cockpit and i was wondering when you are sailing single handed does the mast in front of the tiller position make it difficult to steer and work the winches at the same time

I know with my sloop i can put the tiller between by knees to steer and trim the sails but i would have thought that the mast position would prevent this

I have no Ketch experience and from what i have read they have lots of advantages over a sloop when cruising but are there any disadvantages

Regards Don

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Donk107 said...

Hi all

I was looking through HG's photo's and looking at the position of the mizzen mast in the cockpit and i was wondering when you are sailing single handed does the mast in front of the tiller position make it difficult to steer and work the winches at the same time

I know with my sloop i can put the tiller between by knees to steer and trim the sails but i would have thought that the mast position would prevent this

I have no Ketch experience and from what i have read they have lots of advantages over a sloop when cruising but are there any disadvantages

Regards Don

The main sheet is fitted in front of my hatch cover on a track the mizzen main sheet is located at the stern the mizzen mast from memory would be located around the center of the cockpit Id say

Sorry HG i didsn't explain very well

I actually ment the headsail sheets when going about not the main sheets because it appears that when you steer you would be sitting behind the mizzen

Regards Don

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Donk107 said...
Sorry HG i didsn't explain very well

I actually ment the headsail sheets when going about not the main sheets because it appears that when you steer you would be sitting behind the mizzen

Regards Don

roughly the winch is in front of the mizzen . But I will be appraising every thing and finding the best user friendly solutions Donk
even if I spend a complete day just going about and Jibing

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Donk107 said...
[br]Hi all

I have no Ketch experience and from what i have read they have lots of advantages over a sloop when cruising but are there any disadvantages

Regards Don

Some ketches will not tack with out the mizzen up.

I just do not see the point in having a ketch rig on any yacht less than 45 foot on deck. There are pros and cons but for me the cons outweigh the pros.

Ketch rigs seem to work best on full keeled yachts.

It comes down to personal preference. For me a fin keeled sloop does the job very efficiently.

I do know what you mean Cisco. I dont think I know of any other Aussies 29 foot yachts with mizzen and main like the walker . Some say it give better sail selection having the mizzen time will tell
I do have a praise I tell me self many times
its called K.I.S.S Keep it simple stupid Much the same as your B.O.A.T = bring .on .another. thousand.
And then think of rigging and sail replacement on a small ketch its no wonder a few have had there mizzen removed ,. There are some pluses when you do I think
I think from memory in heavy weather drop the main and sail with the mizzen and jib and reduce from there they do sail reasonably straight

From Wikipedia

The ketch is popular in northern Europe and among long distance cruisers as, compared to a sloop, the additional sail allows for a better balance, and a smaller more easily-handled mainsail. An advantage of the ketch is when sudden increases in wind strength require a rapid reefing: the mainsail can be dropped, reducing sail and leaving a balanced sail-plan with jib and mizzen set. The ketch rig also allows sailing on mizzen and jib only without introducing excessive lee helm, and in an emergency can be quite well steered without use of the rudder. When running before the wind or reaching across the wind, a ketch may set extra sails such as a spinnaker on the main mast, and a spinnaker or mizzen staysail on the mizzen mast. Another advantage of a Ketch is at anchor, the mizzen sail may be used to hold the boat steady in the wind, reducing roll in an otherwise uncomfortable anchorage.

regards Don

A bit off topic but I like a cutter rig.

I put an inner forestay on MB, sort of a slutter (sloop/cutter) rig. Offshore I rig the stay which normally is tied to the shrouds and put a storm jib on it. Reducing sail is just a matter of furling up the heady until all I have left is the st jib which is close to the mast so balances the reefed main, which also brings the pressure closer to the mast.

It doesn't leave a big enough gap to tack with it rigged so it isn't useful inshore.

This one I did not know about Donk
Another advantage of a Ketch is at anchor, the mizzen sail may be used to hold the boat steady in the wind, reducing roll in an otherwise uncomfortable anchorage.

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MorningBird said...
A bit off topic but I like a cutter rig.

I put an inner forestay on MB, sort of a slutter (sloop/cutter) rig. Offshore I rig the stay which normally is tied to the shrouds and put a storm jib on it. Reducing sail is just a matter of furling up the heady until all I have left is the st jib which is close to the mast so balances the reefed main, which also brings the pressure closer to the mast.

It doesn't leave a big enough gap to tack with it rigged so it isn't useful inshore.

Walker also made a ketch cutter it had a longer bowsprit about a meter long . As my partner might say I only has a little one
but I dont pee in the shower Donk


The above photo is a walker H28 Head starboard side at the cock pit steps
and then they added this in the forward cabin



and this

Hi HG

That is a interesting change of layout

Regards Don

Certainly a very good use of space for accommodation in a 28 foot hull.

I like the head where it is and it doesn't look to hard to build. Im going to look into it maybe there is some pre built caravan head/ shower combos with a siding door that can be modified to fit .
So Ive decided to change where the engine panel goes just in case I do decided to build a head shower unit on the starboard side
Ive been thinking about a recess panel that can be opened to use to keep the engine panel reasonably weather proof



I don't know a lot about these yet but I have a few instruments on the cock pit there do not work and need updating.
I am thinking of cutting a hole to suit some thing like the above where the old instrument are located now on deck.
I just dropped into road and marine tech in Dandenong and has a look they have one there that is 300 x 200 which it the exact size of my engine panel Ive just made so the hatch would be recess next to the companionway hatch



This is not my boat but on the starboard side of mine it has two instrument wind direction and an old speed log both don't work and the lenses cant be replaced they don't make them any more so Ive been thinking if I cut them out and insert the above hatch that road tech marine have. I can put my engine panel inside and keep it out of the weather when not in use .
a little bit of work but I can atleast start the engine and read the gages any time I need. That way they should last a while

http://www.dbyboatsales.com.au/walker-h28-2/
Thought Id add this link Donk and SouthAce so you can sea what I mean
Heres the Hatch I had a look at tonight
www.roadtechmarine.com.au/productView.asp?ID=MHG010&form=CAT2&SUBCATID=54#3
Photo below


would like one with a removable lid

G'day Donk,
Our 42 ft cutter rigged ketch has full keel and wheel helm she is trimmed perfectly with mizzen up. Main sheet block is just in front of mizzen mast step which can be reached without leaving helm as with other sheets. She holds a steady course with helm unattended!

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Parkster said...
G'day Donk,
Our 42 ft cutter rigged ketch has full keel and wheel helm she is trimmed perfectly with mizzen up. Main sheet block is just in front of mizzen mast step which can be reached without leaving helm as with other sheets. She holds a steady course with helm unattended!

Nice boat Parkster

Thanks HG nearly finished restoration sailed her for first time three weeks ago can't wipe the grin off my face :)

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Parkster said...
Thanks HG nearly finished restoration sailed her for first time three weeks ago can't wipe the grin off my face :)

The wood work has come up really nice Parkster

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Parkster said...
Thanks HG nearly finished restoration sailed her for first time three weeks ago can't wipe the grin off my face :)

She is certainly a lovely yacht Parkster. You have done a great job on her.

With all that varnish work topside you will never be short of employment.

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HG02 said...
I like the head where it is and it doesn't look to hard to build. Im going to look into it maybe there is some pre built caravan head/ shower combos with a siding door that can be modified to fit .
So Ive decided to change where the engine panel goes just in case I do decided to build a head shower unit on the starboard side
Ive been thinking about a recess panel that can be opened to use to keep the engine panel reasonably weather proof



I don't know a lot about these yet but I have a few instruments on the cock pit there do not work and need updating.
I am thinking of cutting a hole to suit some thing like the above where the old instrument are located now on deck.
I just dropped into road and marine tech in Dandenong and has a look they have one there that is 300 x 200 which it the exact size of my engine panel Ive just made so the hatch would be recess next to the companionway hatch



This is not my boat but on the starboard side of mine it has two instrument wind direction and an old speed log both don't work and the lenses cant be replaced they don't make them any more so Ive been thinking if I cut them out and insert the above hatch that road tech marine have. I can put my engine panel inside and keep it out of the weather when not in use .
a little bit of work but I can atleast start the engine and read the gages any time I need. That way they should last a while

After thinking about it for a while , I think it would be to larger area to cut out of a bulk head might weaken it 300 x 200 is reasonably big. Have to think of another idea

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HG02 said...
After thinking about it for a while , I think it would be to larger area to cut out of a bulk head might weaken it 300 x 200 is reasonably big. Have to think of another idea

Hacking holes in bulkheads, especially cockpit bulkheads, is quite often very tempting on fibre glass yachts but you always need to think about how it will affect the watertight and structural integrity of the yacht.

Small round holes for wiring leading to an attached box panel does not matter too much. If you change your mind a small hole is easy to fill in with glass again.

I am thinking about a Walker H28 cutter rigged ketch.

Anybody have experience with this type of rig? This one has a furler on the bowsprit stay. I thought the genoa should go on the inner stay to make for easier tacking, but it looks like the inner jib (staysail?) is self tacking, and a genoa has to go on the end of the bowsprit. Then to tack the larger sail has to pull through the slot between the stays. Comments?

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Yara said..
I am thinking about a Walker H28 cutter rigged ketch.

Anybody have experience with this type of rig? This one has a furler on the bowsprit stay. I thought the genoa should go on the inner stay to make for easier tacking, but it looks like the inner jib (staysail?) is self tacking, and a genoa has to go on the end of the bowsprit. Then to tack the larger sail has to pull through the slot between the stays. Comments?

The walker H28 has two different length bowsprits the cutter ketch is over a meter long where as the traditional walker Ketch's bow sprit is 1/2 a meter. For a start that what Id be looking for to differentiate the two.
From what I know ( not much yet) I think your right about the Genoa
www.h28.com.au/pages/walker-h28s



I have a photo some where of a cutter Ketch from memory it had two furlers
I have a pulley block which is used for some of my smaller jibs as well as the genoa which is up front on the bowsprit
There is a track in front of the forward hatch which this is used for . Most wlakers once they fir a furling system do not use the smaller jibs and the track just sits there
Plus your storm jib can go on that inner stay