Hi,
I'm looking at buying a new kite. I've busted a few bits and pieces on the bar and lines I've been using (Blade trigger and Core GT) so my main criteria is toughness of Gear.
What brand(s) do you think are the toughest?

North builds the toughest kites.
You cant rip the new D2 canopy cloth material from impact on the water.
The 2011 Norths are the only kites that havent ripped in our school use and we havent one single customer that ripped a 2011 North Kite yet and 2012 they are going to be even stronger.

Cool. Thanks for the tip.
What about bar and line set up? Are they strong too? I've had a chicken loop bust on me and a few other kite-mares mainly due to bar and line failure. I'm keen to avoid repeat performances.

North's reportedly have valve issues, not sure if this has been sorted out since this post.

www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Kitesurfing/General/How-many-North-kite-valves-have-you-fixed/

I would have to say Slingshot. A guy kiting at a lake put an old Rev2 in a tree and my brother in law and son ripped it down for him cause he couldnt get it out. They tore branches off the tree hanging off a rope around the bridal and all it had when it came down was a hole small enough to patch in the canopy to keep using it for the week end.

By hanging back a bit and letting others buy the first shipment of new release kites you get a chance to see if design/materials/manufacturing issues surface. A bit of research through the seabreeze forums on the models on your shortlist will reveal any major deficiencies, as iRideWainman has pointed out.

Apart from kites with obvious design/materials/manufacturing issues, the toughest kites - once they've had a few months' use - are the ones that are well cared for. All kite materials deteriorate when blasted excessively by UV, sand and salt.

Another thing that some manufacturers boast is their use of Teijin's technoforce ripstop material. Ozone go to a lot of effort and badge their kites with this; whereas other manufacturers just make mention to it in their technical notes.

Apparently these manufacturers use it:

Teijin Technoforce T9600: Naish, Liquid Force, Fone, North, Ozone, Slingshot

Ref: www.teijinfiber.com/english/products/specifics/techno-force.html

Note: LF only use it on their Hi-Fi comp/Nirvana kites.

DJDOJO wrote:

Select to expand quote

"as iRideWainman has pointed out.

Apart from kites with obvious design/materials/manufacturing issues, the toughest kites - once they've had a few months' use - are the ones that are well cared for. All kite materials deteriorate when blasted excessively by UV, sand and salt."

Thanks, That's good advice.

i heard the valves only give/gave problems in extremely hot conditions?

Select to expand quote

Puetz said...

iRideWainman said...

North's reportedly have valve issues, not sure if this has been sorted out since this post.

www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Kitesurfing/General/How-many-North-kite-valves-have-you-fixed/

... well, so far 2011 we've no probs with valves, so its a thing of the past!

Kudos to North. I've heard them commonly referred to as the "Ferrari of Kites", is there any truth to this? Guessing by their valve issues, perhaps not -- but otherwise?

Btw, the easiest thing you could do to prolong the life of your kite is not to self launch (when possible).

Select to expand quote

djdojo said...


Apart from kites with obvious design/materials/manufacturing issues, the toughest kites - once they've had a few months' use - are the ones that are well cared for. All kite materials deteriorate when blasted excessively by UV, sand and salt.

LE kites are made out of pretty much the same stuff. Some have reinforcements in different positions due to the shape, but no modern kites explode on the water more than others nowadays. Shapes matter, C kites land downwind hard on most of the leading edge, whereas kites with a curved LE will land on part of the curve stressing the reinforcements on the trailing edge.

I self launch and self land as much as I get an assisted launch. When I self launch I always check the sand for shells etc, If I know someone, Ill ask for a launch, if I dont, forget it, Ive had more near kitemares from randoms.

A kite has 300-400 UV hours, use it and pack it up straight away, dont leave it on the beach flapping, Fold the kite in half and then roll it (the sand will keep out of the intrados), check for nicks and cuts when pumping up, and these are designed for water, if you crash it 5 times on land then it busts when it hits the water, its not a warranty job.

I like the look of the F-one Bandit IV. Any thoughts?
I'm heavy on my kites and often kite in 20-25knot winds.
I'm 100kg and can be considered beginner level still. I'm just starting to go up-wind consistently and I land the odd jump but more often than not I crash into the water and rely on the kite to get me back on my feet as quickly as possible which means the kite is often relied upon to rip me outa the water putting an enormous amount of strain on the chicken loop and lines. Is this normal or should I be working on developing a gentler style?

It's always a bit clunky when you're learning but the more poise and finesse you can cultivate in your riding, the more fun it will be, the better it will look, the less likely you are to get injured, and the easier it will be on your gear too.

Select to expand quote

iRideWainman said...

Puetz said...

iRideWainman said...

North's reportedly have valve issues, not sure if this has been sorted out since this post.

www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Kitesurfing/General/How-many-North-kite-valves-have-you-fixed/

... well, so far 2011 we've no probs with valves, so its a thing of the past!

Kudos to North. I've heard them commonly referred to as the "Ferrari of Kites", is there any truth to this? Guessing by their valve issues, perhaps not -- but otherwise?

Btw, the easiest thing you could do to prolong the life of your kite is not to self launch (when possible).

... I agree, self launching will definetely shorten the kites future but leaving them on the beach flapping in the breeze is worse or leaving them sitting in the sun for hours 'aint good either!!

We had big problems with valves so its a sore point for us, but touch wood no one has had any trouble,,,,,yet. Its almost been a year now with the 2011 kites with no worries but back with the 2010 kites it only took one month into ownership and the first one to failed. All good.

Personally, in my opinion, the North Kites are the Ferrari of kites, provided you like Ferrari, with a price to match mind you but damn they are good and do exactly what we want them to do.

cheers,

Robbie

Gday hangman...
The F-One B4 is a very well built kite and has lasted out our summer and winter very well compared to the B3 ...stitching on the LE was a problem with the B3.
My girly x4 SA Freestyle champ and i have given our 9m and 11m a complete thrashing and they are still going strong.The bar is so simple and complete with nothing to go wrong. The B4 is well ahead of any Delta C on the market.

Select to expand quote

Puetz said...

iRideWainman said...

Puetz said...

iRideWainman said...

North's reportedly have valve issues, not sure if this has been sorted out since this post.

www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Kitesurfing/General/How-many-North-kite-valves-have-you-fixed/

... well, so far 2011 we've no probs with valves, so its a thing of the past!

Kudos to North. I've heard them commonly referred to as the "Ferrari of Kites", is there any truth to this? Guessing by their valve issues, perhaps not -- but otherwise?

Btw, the easiest thing you could do to prolong the life of your kite is not to self launch (when possible).

... I agree, self launching will definetely shorten the kites future but leaving them on the beach flapping in the breeze is worse or leaving them sitting in the sun for hours 'aint good either!!

We had big problems with valves so its a sore point for us, but touch wood no one has had any trouble,,,,,yet. Its almost been a year now with the 2011 kites with no worries but back with the 2010 kites it only took one month into ownership and the first one to failed. All good.

Personally, in my opinion, the North Kites are the Ferrari of kites, provided you like Ferrari, with a price to match mind you but damn they are good and do exactly what we want them to do.

cheers,

Robbie

I had 2010 and 2011 Rebels and there's a big step forward in the materials of the 2011. The 2011 looks like it's going to last forever, whereas the 2010 seems a lot thinner and not as strong.

Self launching may scratch a bit the material(I don't think that even noticeable unless few years), but not as much as when a couple of fellas offered to launch my kite and threw it in the air when I wasn't ready and I almost end up in the trees.
Better to self launch, unless lots of rocks/shells at the beach.

^^I'm assuming you asked that they knew how to launch a kite, right? If not, all they should be doing is holding the thing on its wing tip!?!?

I'm amazed by how many people think self launching and landing is safer practice than asking a competent kiteboarder to lend a hand? Whats more, that it doesn't damage you're kite!?!?

I get the feeling you probably don't ride in anything more than 25 knots nor have you held your kite up to the light whilst inflated to see how many pin holes you've got at the LE - canopy boundary where your kite's been used as a $2000 beach sweeper.

... my 14m 2011 Rebel gets used the most in my quiver. If its light, my missus uses it, if its good I use it and if its really light wind, my son uses it. It gets used by 3 people and is just about always pumped up when we go to the beach (which is alot by the way). It is still going strong after a full year of use, but the 2010 I had was stretched and flapping like a school girls mouth 9 months in and I just about couldn't use it at the 12 month mark. It felt like a big bag o'sh!t. Not the 2011. They have definetly stepped up in long lasting and I'd say the 2012 is just as good if not better with the materials they use!! By 12 months old with the 2010 I was scared to loop it as it wouldn't even come close to complete the loop, it would go 3/4 or even only half way and I'd bang it in the drink!!!!

Anyway, their good now and I like 'em.

cheers,

Robbie

Hangman

Could be something to do with the equip you used before. Not so much the Blade but I did hear a couple of negatives on the Core's. (bars and kites)

Quite simply bar's and lines should be bullet proof, although one of the kite Co's seem to make a major stuff up every year ie Slingy's 5 use chicken line of a couple of years ago and Cabrinha replaced all early line sets from last year free of charge.

As for kites - smash em hard enough and every single one will break. No exceptions.

Strength is typically inverse to performance, it's why they throw away F1 engines after 2 uses.

Select to expand quote

iRideWainman said...

North's reportedly have valve issues, not sure if this has been sorted out since this post.

www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Kitesurfing/General/How-many-North-kite-valves-have-you-fixed/

SORTED

Select to expand quote

iRideWainman said...

Another thing that some manufacturers boast is their use of Teijin's technoforce ripstop material. Ozone go to a lot of effort and badge their kites with this; whereas other manufacturers just make mention to it in their technical notes.

Apparently these manufacturers use it:

Teijin Technoforce T9600: Naish, Liquid Force, Fone, North, Ozone, Slingshot

Ref: ww1.teijinfiber.com

Note: LF only use it on their Hi-Fi comp/Nirvana kites.

NORTH canopy material is called D2 and as far as i know they have the patent for this and no other manufacturer can use it atm

Select to expand quote

iRideWainman said...

^^I'm assuming you asked that they knew how to launch a kite, right? If not, all they should be doing is holding the thing on its wing tip!?!?

I'm amazed by how many people think self launching and landing is safer practice than asking a competent kiteboarder to lend a hand? Whats more, that it doesn't damage you're kite!?!?

I get the feeling you probably don't ride in anything more than 25 knots nor have you held your kite up to the light whilst inflated to see how many pin holes you've got at the LE - canopy boundary where your kite's been used as a $2000 beach sweeper.

You seem offended. 25+knots is not a tornado mate, you just need to bring a smaller kite and depower it. My 7m works quite well up to 35knots and usually with 35+ I use the 5metrers (which it's not as often as I would like).

Self launching/landing is a technique that you need to learn because you don't always have someone around to help you. But, you are right. A competent kiteboarder is better than self-doing it. Now, go with your competent mate to a beach and you launch his kite. How's launching yours?

By the way, next time I go to the beach I'll ask people if they are competent before launching or landing my kites, LOL!!

Don't laugh, asked a windsurfer to launch me once. He told me he'd done it before and proceeded to throw my kite into the air once the lines were taught. This without a thumbs up/nod or me in postition. Made me run upwind pretty quick though.

Select to expand quote

NickT said...

Don't laugh, asked a windsurfer to launch me once. He told me he'd done it before and proceeded to throw my kite into the air once the lines were taught. This without a thumbs up/nod or me in postition. Made me run upwind pretty quick though.

Ooh he knew exactly what he was doing [insert evil laugh here]

Select to expand quote

sausage said...

NickT said...

Don't laugh, asked a windsurfer to launch me once. He told me he'd done it before and proceeded to throw my kite into the air once the lines were taught. This without a thumbs up/nod or me in postition. Made me run upwind pretty quick though.

Ooh he knew exactly what he was doing [insert evil laugh here]

your windsurfer mate sounds like he learnt our 3 second rule. 3 seconds after reaching kite throw it in the air. Keeps everyone alert and your not standing there waiting for them to sort their lines

and everyone starts putting their leash on before they connect the chicken loop

Select to expand quote

INTHELOOP said...

iRideWainman said...

Another thing that some manufacturers boast is their use of Teijin's technoforce ripstop material. Ozone go to a lot of effort and badge their kites with this; whereas other manufacturers just make mention to it in their technical notes.

Apparently these manufacturers use it:

Teijin Technoforce T9600: Naish, Liquid Force, Fone, North, Ozone, Slingshot

Ref: www.teijinfiber.com/english/products/specifics/techno-force.html

Note: LF only use it on their Hi-Fi comp/Nirvana kites.

NORTH canopy material is called D2 and as far as i know they have the patent for this and no other manufacturer can use it atm

D2 is a Teijin product... i think

Select to expand quote

rober said...

You seem offended. 25+knots is not a tornado mate, you just need to bring a smaller kite and depower it. My 7m works quite well up to 35knots and usually with 35+ I use the 5metrers (which it's not as often as I would like).

Self launching/landing is a technique that you need to learn because you don't always have someone around to help you. But, you are right. A competent kiteboarder is better than self-doing it. Now, go with your competent mate to a beach and you launch his kite. How's launching yours?

By the way, next time I go to the beach I'll ask people if they are competent before launching or landing my kites, LOL!!

Maybe the fact that I haven't been kiting for over a month makes me a little more sensitive to peoples ignorance, but anyway thats another issue... Kudos to owning a 5m btw, although I'm not completely familiar with the term 'depower'?

Self launching/landing or getting assisted comes down to risk. A perfect self launch means walking around and stopping 3-4 times to slowly pull the kite around and keep all lines as taught as possible to prevent wing-tip and bridle catch.
I only get another kitesurfer to launch and land me as I can do them 100% safely by myself and dont mind getting my canopy wet to do it.
Ettiquite is important. If a guy is about to pump up his kite, dont ask them, wait till its secured, as with unrolling lines,let them finish. Be ready, with everything checked, walk your lines halfway there while waiting.
If a kite is deflating drop everything and assist with a land, you will save someones ass.
Peace out

slingshot make tough kites.
i saw a near new 2010 north rebel in half last season in the store, dude told me it got swamped by a wave and any kite would of done the same. well i kite scarborough and put my Best Waroos under the breakers on a regular basis for 4 years before killing them both within two weeks of each other in the winter storms.
Now got 2011 Slingshot Rallys they look bomb proof