I know this isn't a review, but it still in way promotes a certain kite hence thought this is best place for this - if not let me know.

Now used to bridled kites with mini-fifth line. Rebel uses complete fifth line. Normally if self lanching will put carabina on post/car hold kite up, then go back to bar and away. When landing can bring down to ground, either grab the middle lines and walk up kite slightly (after walking a little upwind) then at times flick over leading edge. Or just let out mini fifth and it just sits there - same process, or just put back on carabina then walk to kite. Safe and reduces draggin kite on sand.

Now what can you can can't you do on the rebels fifth line. I can find out myself obviously but rather not learn by mistakes as usual.

How to best self launch and self land the rebel - (my brother seems to always wait until i have come in, so he doesn't have to self land - anyone else kite with a guy like that?[}:)]

... using the 5th line self landing can be easy as pie and in my opinion easier and safer than 4 line kites with bridles. The only kite I use in 4 line is a Core kite which after a year of use, has never made me feel like its as safe or easy to land even though I haven't had a problem, its just that the Rebel or 5 line landing is sooo much easier.

I found that when I was teaching my son, I had to assume that he didn't understand a thing and I had to explain everything really simple which annoyed him but I wasn't prepared to compromise on a few things in kiting and one was self launching, self rescue and self landing. I feel completely at ease now and I can trust him (although he is a teenage kid and they seem to think on a different planet some times so a few choice words and threats of no kiting brings him back in line)

For me the following works.

1. If its windy, don't do this, check surroundings and punch out at waters edge making sure no one/thing is downwind of you.
2. Pick your spot and check where your landing and a big arc downwind of you for any obsticles.
3. Kite at 12 o'clock, pull depower fully and don't pull it too fast, nice and slowly.
4. Steer and drift kite down to ground at the edge of window, slowly.
5. As the tip just touches ground, reach up above the bar for the red line, let bar go and pull the red 5th line in quickly, pulling in 2 or 3 good arm full of line.
6. The kite should be on ground, run up and secure kite. smile.

I can usually land a kite in good winds and exactly where I want to, but on the rare occasion, it can slide down wind but since you have pulled in the 5th, it won't fly again. If windy, just keep pulling the 5th, it will, or rather should, not allow the kite to get out of control, that's why you pull it in really quickly. Commit to pulling in the 5th line, quicker the better, this pulling in yanks the kite forward and the wind pushes the kite to the ground and pinning it down, but, be careful in windy conditions 'cause some times they can slide.

I hope this helps a bit!

cheers,

Robbie

ps I got a wife who does that too me

Hey Eppo,

Robbie's info is good, but will also work by just letting go of the bar from 12 o'clock and pulling the chickenloop quick release. The kite will fall leading edge first and land in the landed position nose to wind and leading edge down.

Easy!

Regards,

DM

Thanks for that, sounds how I land the cores anyhow, except I grab all the 'middle lines'.

Couple of questions...

1. When you grab and quickly bring in fifth, do you also walk upwind a little, then back towards kite? Or just straight at it?

2. Also Darren: bit nervous about dropping my kite from 12 o'clock, haven't done that since the foil days! How fast will it hit the deck - surely bloody fast? Please correct me if wrong.


Okay self lanuching?? Will it sit there like a bridled/pulley kite on a secured carabina? Or do you have to self launch the old fashioned way off the deck (hate that - if so any tips on doing this without moving across the beach so much).

Cheers

again

Hi Eppo,

It should drop fairly slowly. Launch is like any hybrid.

If you're not confident, give it a go (release - self launch) over the water.

The thing with 5th line is that if you punch out of the QR, you can normally retrieve the bar in the water and re-assemble the CL and relaunch without tangles. That's my experience anyways.

Enjoy the Reb!

DM

... just to add to Darrens info!

You don't have to walk upwind or anything, just pull the 5th in, the kite will pop itself onto the ground, just pull straight in.

Putting the kite onto a secure anchor point is no worries and kite will sit on the edge all day, just depower kite while its there.

I found that the punching out at 12 is safe enough for the kite and not rough like say an old school 5 line kite. North have placed a ball above the Y point on the 5th line so that the kite will come down and stay down, it won't fly up again due to a little pressure kept on the front lines too, with this ball above the Y. There is no guarrentee it won't come down hard one time or another (sh!t can happen) but it is unlikely, especially since you'll proberly only need to do it when its windy and kite will flip in mid air anyway and just fall down steadily. Just check whats down wind of you!

cheers,

Robbie

Put it in air today, 13-16 crappy south south east, and wow, what a machine. On a 135 tt was almost staying upwind and jumping with waves. Immediate feedback, smooth depower and in the gusty crap the kite didn't even feel it, no twitching, no flutter, just kept the power on, can't wait for a real fly, 16 plus. So far just the best thing I've flown in 12 years and many many brands and styles.

Even my bro on the shore was like 'damn it looks good in the air'. My bro knows nothing about rebels or kites in general he just flies a kahoona and an older warroo, but straight away he said how 'tense' the canopy is. The D2 not a gimmick nor the wing shape and construction near the panel that flutters.

So far so good, I know there are reviews out there but i'll put my two bob worth in, reckon i got some history behind me to make some sense.

Cheers for the info, was weird though looking up at the bloody fifth with the big Y near the kite, just weird.

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eppo said...


Cheers for the info, was weird though looking up at the bloody fifth with the big Y near the kite, just weird.

... it does look close but its actually half way up!

Hey Eppo, did you get a 2012 Rebel or a 2011?

The tightness of the canopy even under load is just one of the things that make me dig these kites so much. That tight feel goes right through every thing you do with the kite and gives you confidence!!

cheers,

Robbie

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Puetz said...

eppo said...


Cheers for the info, was weird though looking up at the bloody fifth with the big Y near the kite, just weird.

... it does look close but its actually half way up!

Hey Eppo, did you get a 2012 Rebel or a 2011?

The tightness of the canopy even under load is just one of the things that make me dig these kites so much. That tight feel goes right through every thing you do with the kite and gives you confidence!!




This was a new 2011 - 8m, but getting the 2012 11m when they arrive at AKS in a week or two. Heard 2012 even better, but hey I wouldn't know any better right!

Yeh I was standing on the beach, just launched it was at most 14-15 knot south/south east, pulled it around the window and launched! I was like what the !!!, my bro goes are you sure it's the 8m? So was only checking out setup of new bar, kite in air etc hence no plan to actually kite, but my bro had brought his board down, so went out on his 135TT, and was almost staying upwind.

The pull through the kite is just consistent, no flapping, no jerk, no pulley delay, and I was actually getting some air off waves... knew where the kite was at all times. Swell was large, went down a wave, lost edge (not my board), it it still turned, the lines stayed taut - yeh can't wait for some real wind. Stoked so far.

I suppose you get what you pay for - always went cheaper kites like the kahoona -don't get me wrong loved the kite and anyone who has one can't complain, but the quality of finish on both kite and bar and in through the air of the more expensive kite is really noticeable - especially from a kiter of 12 years. But then again, the rebel from what I've read and heard suites my style, so biased.

Rebels, then a 11m edge for boosting and a small reo...better be real nice to my wife for at least a year or two!

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eppo said...

Puetz said...

eppo said...


Cheers for the info, was weird though looking up at the bloody fifth with the big Y near the kite, just weird.

...better be real nice to my wife for at least a year or two!

... tee hee, you better be reallllllly nice to the minister of warfare and home finances 'cause the buck stops there!!! After a few years of 'making' up excuses why I needed 'new' this and 'new' that, I finally got her into kiting and now both of us just gotta have that nice crispy new kite.

I created a monster too, now she's gotta have the cloths that match, 'it goes nicely with my harness' and 'the colour matches this part of my canopy'. I would never have noticed that sort of crap, most of us blokes just don't notice but they damn sure do . Lucky our local dealer is such a cool dude about when he gets his money I think he owns half our house!!

cheers,

Robbie

damn that's funny...my girls a bassendean girl, not 'girth by sea' - i stuffed up when teaching her before kids and put up an absolute dog of a kite that kind of gave her a little scare - my bad, now she wont go near em'. And after kids just wasn't going to happen. Kids are 4 and 5, reckon 6 is a good age to start... he he he.

Hey can you tell me why i was keeping ground in 12-16/17 knots 85kg on a CB wave - 8m, damn those kites are good! Bro was out on a 11.5m kahoona and he was keeping ground just a little better than me. On my to be 11m I'd be boosting on the 3-4 foot waves coming in...Damn nice rig with the bar hey, and grunt, stuff me! Does this thing ever twitch and flutter when depowered - cause I an't seen it yet. (then again been light winds).

... actually I did the wrong thing early on too and tried to teach the missus on a Naish X2

When things went wrong, they went wrong and she payed the price and got flung 2m on the beach because the X2 was such un-compromising kite. She was scared off from kiting for a few years 'til she showed interest again so I tread ever so carefully, and bought a small kite. The day she came to me and said, 'I don't think the kite is big enough, should we get a slightly bigger one'. "By jove I think I've got a live one here", I knew I hooked her. The best thing I did was took it really slowly and let her learn at her pace. Anyway, now I gotta pull her back from spending too much money on kiting.

One suggestion for you Eppo. Every once in a while, check your line lengths. Its not such a problem for lighter guys and frequency of checking not such an issue but if your heavy or you ride your kite in the upper wind ranges, the front lines may get a bit of stretch and put the trim out. The rebels handle it well enough but it takes the shine off the performance and you sometimes scratch your head and wonder why it doesn't feel the same as you feel right now. The biggest or most important IMHO is check the front 3 lines are perfect. Secure the lines to an anchor point (screw driver shoved into the ground) and grab the single white front line just below the Y point and put some tension on the lines. Make sure that the red ball on the 5th line is under its own pressure against the ring, then check all lines are the same length. I found if the 5th is short or even longer by even just a little bit, the upwind abilities of the kite are affected. If you keep this one accurate to the millimeter the kite will keep its performance that you fell in love with.



cheers for now,

Robbie

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Puetz said...

... actually I did the wrong thing early on too and tried to teach the missus on a Naish X2

When things went wrong, they went wrong and she payed the price and got flung 2m on the beach because the X2 was such un-compromising kite. She was scared off from kiting for a few years 'til she showed interest again so I tread ever so carefully, and bought a small kite. The day she came to me and said, 'I don't think the kite is big enough, should we get a slightly bigger one'. "By jove I think I've got a live one here", I knew I hooked her. The best thing I did was took it really slowly and let her learn at her pace. Anyway, now I gotta pull her back from spending too much money on kiting.

One suggestion for you Eppo. Every once in a while, check your line lengths. Its not such a problem for lighter guys and frequency of checking not such an issue but if your heavy or you ride your kite in the upper wind ranges, the front lines may get a bit of stretch and put the trim out. The rebels handle it well enough but it takes the shine off the performance and you sometimes scratch your head and wonder why it doesn't feel the same as you feel right now. The biggest or most important IMHO is check the front 3 lines are perfect. Secure the lines to an anchor point (screw driver shoved into the ground) and grab the single white front line just below the Y point and put some tension on the lines. Make sure that the red ball on the 5th line is under its own pressure against the ring, then check all lines are the same length. I found if the 5th is short or even longer by even just a little bit, the upwind abilities of the kite are affected. If you keep this one accurate to the millimeter the kite will keep its performance that you fell in love with.



cheers for now,

Robbie

Yeh ta for that, darren at aks was saying the same thing, but you went into a little more detail, thanks for that, I'm always slow on the uptake. He did mention the red ball on the fifth. I like riding in the upper wind range, like to be powered and while not heavy I'm in the 84ish, 85ish category so not light either.

How often should I check this you reckon - I mean obviously when perfromance lags, but I assume in the first few months would be ideal as this is where the main stretch will occur.??

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eppo said...

Puetz said...

... actually I did the wrong thing early on too and tried to teach the missus on a Naish X2

When things went wrong, they went wrong and she payed the price and got flung 2m on the beach because the X2 was such un-compromising kite. She was scared off from kiting for a few years 'til she showed interest again so I tread ever so carefully, and bought a small kite. The day she came to me and said, 'I don't think the kite is big enough, should we get a slightly bigger one'. "By jove I think I've got a live one here", I knew I hooked her. The best thing I did was took it really slowly and let her learn at her pace. Anyway, now I gotta pull her back from spending too much money on kiting.



One suggestion for you Eppo. Every once in a while, check your line lengths. Its not such a problem for lighter guys and frequency of checking not such an issue but if your heavy or you ride your kite in the upper wind ranges, the front lines may get a bit of stretch and put the trim out. The rebels handle it well enough but it takes the shine off the performance and you sometimes scratch your head and wonder why it doesn't feel the same as you feel right now. The biggest or most important IMHO is check the front 3 lines are perfect. Secure the lines to an anchor point (screw driver shoved into the ground) and grab the single white front line just below the Y point and put some tension on the lines. Make sure that the red ball on the 5th line is under its own pressure against the ring, then check all lines are the same length. I found if the 5th is short or even longer by even just a little bit, the upwind abilities of the kite are affected. If you keep this one accurate to the millimeter the kite will keep its performance that you fell in love with.



cheers for now,

Robbie

Yeh ta for that, darren at aks was saying the same thing, but you went into a little more detail, thanks for that, I'm always slow on the uptake. He did mention the red ball on the fifth. I like riding in the upper wind range, like to be powered and while not heavy I'm in the 84ish, 85ish category so not light either.

How often should I check this you reckon - I mean obviously when perfromance lags, but I assume in the first few months would be ideal as this is where the main stretch will occur.??

Darren also mentioned alway always having slight slack in the red safety line - which I assume is ultimately connected to the red ball near the Y being under it's own pressure.

Select to expand quote

eppo said...

eppo said...

Puetz said...

... actually I did the wrong thing early on too and tried to teach the missus on a Naish X2

When things went wrong, they went wrong and she payed the price and got flung 2m on the beach because the X2 was such un-compromising kite. She was scared off from kiting for a few years 'til she showed interest again so I tread ever so carefully, and bought a small kite. The day she came to me and said, 'I don't think the kite is big enough, should we get a slightly bigger one'. "By jove I think I've got a live one here", I knew I hooked her. The best thing I did was took it really slowly and let her learn at her pace. Anyway, now I gotta pull her back from spending too much money on kiting.



One suggestion for you Eppo. Every once in a while, check your line lengths. Its not such a problem for lighter guys and frequency of checking not such an issue but if your heavy or you ride your kite in the upper wind ranges, the front lines may get a bit of stretch and put the trim out. The rebels handle it well enough but it takes the shine off the performance and you sometimes scratch your head and wonder why it doesn't feel the same as you feel right now. The biggest or most important IMHO is check the front 3 lines are perfect. Secure the lines to an anchor point (screw driver shoved into the ground) and grab the single white front line just below the Y point and put some tension on the lines. Make sure that the red ball on the 5th line is under its own pressure against the ring, then check all lines are the same length. I found if the 5th is short or even longer by even just a little bit, the upwind abilities of the kite are affected. If you keep this one accurate to the millimeter the kite will keep its performance that you fell in love with.



cheers for now,

Robbie

Yeh ta for that, darren at aks was saying the same thing, but you went into a little more detail, thanks for that, I'm always slow on the uptake. He did mention the red ball on the fifth. I like riding in the upper wind range, like to be powered and while not heavy I'm in the 84ish, 85ish category so not light either.

How often should I check this you reckon - I mean obviously when perfromance lags, but I assume in the first few months would be ideal as this is where the main stretch will occur.??

Darren also mentioned alway always having slight slack in the red safety line - which I assume is ultimately connected to the red ball near the Y being under it's own pressure.

G'day Eppo,

I'm super heavy and I find every 4 or 5 sessions I check them and find some sort of adjustment is required but usually because I ride the kites at the top end of the wind range. I tend to take my kites past the recommended range all the time, so after a particularly heavy sesh, next free moment I check it.

When you get very familiar with your kite you will sooo feel it when its out and even 5 or 10mm can start the ball rolling. With such a good crisp accurate feeling kite, why not make it accurate with perfect lines so you enjoy every little bump in the road and fly it as the designers had intended. Most people don't feel it but hours under it you will know exactly what I mean.

The red line Darren was mentioning is below the Y point and if you notice, there is a small tail up about 4m high where you can adjust later down the track for front line stretch (ie the single white line attached to the depower rope pully). This line stretches also and after, say 4 months under me, I have to adjust too. I think the manual describes it better than I can. If you don't adjust this the red line starts to pull the 5th line in and even though you got above the Y 100%, it is still causing the kites trim problems by pulling the nose down. Try it as an experiment, pull the red line in and watch what happens to the kite.

Hope this helps,

cheers,

Robbie

Cheers for that mate, will check it after a few sessions early on in the season.

Yeh I pulled in the front line and saw what you meant, and how a tight red line will do that. Still don't understand the red ball stopper thingy yet but will get it out tonight (no wind - booo), and get familiar with the mechanism.

Never really checked my lines before (only for wear), but seeing as though these babies are at the upper price range (and fly accordingly) I agree, best to have a ferrari drive at it's best, who give a shyte how the diahatsu runs, as long as it runs, right. HA HA HA

Good info here for other rebel riders and to be...drop ya an email, when I've had a crack on the 11m 2012.

... I had my 5th line snap above the Y point and boy did the Rebel fly like sh!t, infact the kite is just about not flyable at all, it sat about 45 degrees downwind of me and I had to feather the bar just to keep it from crashing. If the red ball isn't there, the front of the kite lifts up and causes the whole kite to fly back to 45 degrees. Experiment and try to launch your kite with the 5th line not connected, you'll see for yourself, or even just put a short extention to see what happens.

Anyway, cheers for now,

Robbie

mmm shows you the 5th line is part and parcel of how the kite actually flies, it is just not an attached accessory for 'oh Shyte moments'. Saw the post before will check and if things go to Shyte at least I know what's up. Been flying for 12 years so confident I can at least get the thing under suitable control... in theory!!

Eppo,

I'm sooooo looking forward to your thoughts after you have a lit up session on it. Hehe, should be a hoot.

DM

... yeah me too.

Eppo, I like to know what happens when x or y breaks how the kite or situation pans out and only been flying for 8 years, still get new things come up. With the 2011 Rebel no 5th attached, the kite was not useable except to go downwind and let it drag you back to beach, so long as it's downwind of you. If you drop it in the drink, you've got f all chance to get going again, but like I said, I've only snapped one, once in 6 or 7 years

I am always on the look out for info, especially when it comes to safety and especially when it comes to my missus and son's safety. Hence why I experiment or test things so I can pass on to them how to handle the situation safely, or sometimes quickly. When I get a new kite, I fly it for a quick fly then I put it in the drink to see how it goes, at least I'm not surprised if I end up out the back on the first run wondering why the f'ing thing won't go due to my ignorance.

cheers for now,

Robbie

Yeh agreed on all accounts. That's why a forum like this is so fantastic (although some use it - including me in the past - to rant and rave like a headless diqhead),

To learn the specfics of land/relaunch and what could happen for eg the fifth go, line lengths etc, rather than learn as I have done over the years by trial and error - too expensive as well.



... and dazza, I'm thinking the 11m 2012 in 20-24 knots, lit up, cranked up and saying farq to the world!

....a headless diqhead, yeh good one eppo? Students are currently writing an essay (I have a SOSE relief - I thought they just coloured in in SOSE), and they keep looking out the window wondering why I keep looking out there...if only they understood...