Do light wind kites work. Or what you gain in size, do you lose in terms of weight & lack of manoeuvrability (thanks spellcheck). I'm considering getting an ozone edge 13m or 17m. We've had so many days around 12kn this year. At 75kg my biggest kite is a 10m reo and gets me going ok on a surfboard at 12/13kn with no current assist. Am I kidding myself going kiting in less, or is it worth having a light wind machine for freeride. Anyone with a 13 or 17 edge can give me a heads up. Or could i work an 11m to get more bottom end than the reo with a bit of added glide? Can they self launch & relaunch in low wind? Cheers

14m RPM, usually in first group to actually be powered up and enjoying it.

Best thing about light winds is flat water and less people.

Plenty of wave orientated kiteboarders on Sydney's Northern Beaches dream of using a 10m kite during summer NE seabreezes.

Also lots of riders heavier than a paltry 75kg (I wish).

Try some large wave orientated kites and come back to us and report your findings. The large edges aren't to my liking... too slow to redirect.

I enjoy using my 12m, 9m is better... but sometimes the 17m and skim are necessary. Better than watching others from the beach...

Yep that's one I'm still trying to get my head around as well. suppose a better phrased question is would they work for you and needs to be answered based on what do you mean by 'work?'

10 knots has three odd times less power than 20. So need to adjust I suppose what you want to achieve in lighter winds. do you want a kite of lower aspect coupled with a more efficient boat to allow some free riding. Say a skim or for example a north nugget. Or do you want to couple an efficient board (notice the common aspect here) with a high aspect kite for cruising racing etc. (then the edge which will sh1t over the one mentioned above by a country mile). but if you still want to throw down some stuff then say an rpm or a catalyst.

Depends on what you want to do in those winds but you have to adjust expectations.

Currently I'm having fun trying to understand how this bloody skim works but hey it's light and I'm having fun on an 11m at your weight.

Pearl
My 2 cents, time on the water is time on the water, you know a big kite will have limitations especially bigger than 12m.
Most exciting 12m I've seen out for a while is the airush wave, not tried it but witnessed it weaving through the sky in the hands of sb kiter in the surf, he made it look pretty damn small. Very much on my wish list when winter arrives.
Maybe for consideration in kites greater than 12m, I've a mate at Lennox who loves his "donna" 12m Flysurfer for just those light conditions.
Packs to nothing, gets going in nothing.
cheers

Eppo not to derail the forum but will a skim negate the need for a larger kite.
Will 11m and a skim work for 12Knts. Arrr my winter preparation begins.
cheers

Light wind optimised boards are far more effective than big kites. Anything wide and flat will do.

Ordinary surfboards are poor because they have too much rocker and are usually too narrow. Dead flat on the bottom is the go. Too much rocker causes the board to dig in and push too much water. You want something flat that will lift up onto the plane.

I use a Sector 60, an F-One Fish 5'4", and a custom 135x48cm TT. I weigh 80kg. I mostly use a 10m Crossbow but sometimes use my 13m.

Get your boards sorted and your light wind technique then you can go and demo lighter wind kites from a position ofknowledge and experience.

Don't expect any kite to relaunch in truly light winds. Your only options are a) don't crash the kite, b) wait until the wind comes back (it usually does), or c) self rescue (which is fun when you get it right).

Thanks all.
I am looking to pop and glide freeride eppo, not quite dog style, maybe more of lawn mowing snail style in reality. Catalyst mmmmmm.
Don't encourage me with boards gorgo. The board room is overflowing ATM. I've been into shorter boards in the surf lately. Got a couple that are very flat for kiting strapless & agree with very thing you've said. Ta.
Guess I'm looking for the magic light wind answer & the reality is more down to earth. Those American forums are full of low wind claims. Should have known they were messing with me.
P.s. I can't do a doona. Not even in winter

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anoldman said...
Eppo not to derail the forum but will a skim negate the need for a larger kite.
Will 11m and a skim work for 12Knts. Arrr my winter preparation begins.
cheers

Mmm depends on the kite hey. On the edge yeh it is fine as it develops apparent wind and loves efficient boards. Although just recently on a cat 14m this to seemed to produce this apparent wind, man that designer is smart hey.

Do you want to skim though. Man I'm loving it , but hating it as well. I feel like a complete kook again hey. A guy who I helped through last wing after his lessons, had a good old laugh at me today. But I was in the ocean, hard to learn how to change direction in these conditions. Excuses but my ego needs it at the moment. But I was out hey, and having fun. Again it depends.
At 75 surely we don't need anything bigger than a 14m though.

Gotta really define where you ride, the conditions and how you want to ride.

For the record I will be getting a 14m cat at some stage. So at 10 to 12 I will have power to spare. After this I may even get on my makos, which after all is my bread and butter for dog styler ( mask, 2013), action.

I've been thinking about kite size versus board size a lot recently as well. I only have two boards both TT's and I won't take the larger 164 into the waves. So I use my 134 and a 17m blade (90kg) which works okay down to sporadic white cap (8-10) sort of conditions. Thinking of trading the larger TT in for a SB to get some more apparent wind going. Cause I actually don't mind light wind kiting in the surf, have a bit of fun off some smaller waves and not get pounded so hard when you stuff up... I don't have any issues with manoeuvrability of the kite, it sines nimbly enough if you initiate the turn a bit earlier.

a monster door and 19-21m foil kite will have you going twice the windspeed at 6-10knts ;)

Flat water the monster door rips, once you have any sort of wave though i find it's not so enjoyable. Heading back into shore the waves seem to take you by surprise and you end porpoising the front end. Not to mention trying to control that massive surface area in the break if you happen to come off!

Eppo,

What's a Cat 14? Sorry not sure what brand.

Happy birthday toeside.

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INTHELOOP said...
a monster door and 19-21m foil kite will have you going twice the windspeed at 6-10knts ;)

Soo... what would it be like if I took out my 10' longboard?

Recently I bought a 17m Blade Fat Lady kite, as I have always had a interest in light wind kitesurfing. Using my 136cm twin tip I can hold my ground with small floaty jumps in about 10-12kts, but at 14kts I am tearing upwind and I would compare it to using a 12m kite in 16-18kts. I like that it has very light bar pressure and turns almost as quick as my 12m Rebel. The end result is that I have had at least another 6 sessions on the water, where as in the past I wouldn't have bothered with my 12m.

How much do you weigh coastflyer?

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zarb said...
How much do you weigh coastflyer?

I weigh 90kgs with boardies on.

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zarb said...

INTHELOOP said...
a monster door and 19-21m foil kite will have you going twice the windspeed at 6-10knts ;)

Soo... what would it be like if I took out my 10' longboard?

Zarb, I have used my 9ft 6in Mal and it is really good fun, especially in light winds. Here's a guy doing just that.

Excellent. Now I have a light wind option! Need to work on hanging10, kite will get me up the nose faster

Light wind kites do work but you will still need a good understanding of sheeting and how to ride a board efficiently to get the most out of the bottom end.

The next step is choosing a kite that suits your style, decide what you like to do on your normal sized kites and apply it to your LW kite purchase.
The most fun LW kites i have ridden are the Naish Fly and Blade Fat Lady, both are very fast turning for large kites, give excellent bottom end and allow you to throw down some unhooked tricks. A lot of the larger kites just feel boring to ride after a short time, these two have some liveleness and are even fun through loops!

HI Pearl,

It depends on whether you would prefer to sit on the beach and watch others on light wind kites riding or be out there riding.

I've had sessions in 8 knots in the waves off Pinnaroo and spent hours riding waves and blasting back and forth and then come back to the beach to overhear guys that sat and watched praying for 3-4 more knots say "Yeah, but flying big kites sux". LOL!

Light wind kiting is a different experience, but still very pleasurable. Just don't expect to go out and ride as you would on a smaller kite in 25 knots. It's the fact that you are out and planing, there are few, if any others out, the water is calm and smooth and you can see through the surface to the bottom as it's not churned up by waves or chop or the rippling effect of wind on the water.

These kinda days are perfect for going on a long fast cruise with a waterproof MP3 player and your favourite choons cranking. All the better if it is something mellow and ambient with a nice beat.

Here's a few vids I've done with light wind kites. You decide whether I had a good session in these vids as compared to the others who couldn't get going and sat there frustrated or went home to get hassled by their partner.

It's all about time on the water.

DM

-KAiWxbOROi1mirq09TFbA

-KAiWxbOROi1mirq09TFbA

-KAiWxbOROi1mirq09TFbA

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pearl said...

Do light wind kites work. Or what you gain in size, do you lose in terms of weight & lack of manoeuvrability (thanks spellcheck). I'm considering getting an ozone edge 13m or 17m. We've had so many days around 12kn this year. At 75kg my biggest kite is a 10m reo and gets me going ok on a surfboard at 12/13kn with no current assist. Am I kidding myself going kiting in less, or is it worth having a light wind machine for freeride. Anyone with a 13 or 17 edge can give me a heads up. Or could i work an 11m to get more bottom end than the reo with a bit of added glide? Can they self launch & relaunch in low wind? Cheers

Had an awesome day yesterday 12pm started out with 12knots so pulled my core xr2 19m out wind slowly kept picking up come 3pm was still kiting 18-20 knots until a rain squal headed my way so quickly came back in, was on a TT139x41 and weigh 88kgs

Light wind kites definitely work. but question is, how do you want them to work.
b4 i found some amazing LW kites I was reading so much about the Ozones.
All of it seemed to make sense at the time but after I flew them back to back, I worked out it was all mumbo jumbo.
big Edges are fairly powerful but so slow. zephers are faster turning but nowhere near the low end of the Edges.
My mates & I have got on to old Cabs. They destroy the Ozones for LW.
No competition.
One of the lads got a 17m core and is going good at 8-10kts on a SB or large TT. I reckon it would go at 6-8 kts on a LW TT but we~re waiting for the postman, so let you know l8r on that one. Again, the cabs slaughter the core for flat out LW ability. The 15 convert has as much low wind as the core, which probably has a little more than the zephyr. The core way nicer and faster kite to fly than the zephyr which is relatively boring. try them both for yourself.
Our little bunch kite in waves only as we~ve no flat water. and water flow direction relative to wind direction plays a big part on the 6-8kt days. We~re never out the back on these days but on a favourable water flow direction, we are sliding around like crazy.
We have found that a lot of the older cabrinha kites have amazing low end, way better in fact than any of the modern kites listed above. In fact nothing we have tried will touch these old beasts for LW - not even close. The thing the old cabs don~t have is high range - they run out of range fast and when they do, look out! lol. For instance my mates 17m core will go up to 20kts and my 15m 2009 convert is way maxing out at 15kts. in fact i don~t bother with this kite after 12kts, it~s too much of a handful.
I~ve never tried the Argos and TRX~s and they look good on the videos.
and apparently go in 6-8kts, but then, once again you~ll only really know once you try one yourself. Also the SS turbine has an amazing video where it looks totally not windy!
I would love to ride some Ozone cats and c4s but for LW there are simply too many way better kites out there for dedicated LW and for the 8kts and over range, and at way better prices. Explore your options IMO m8

^^^
Very true about Cabs. I've ridden 13m Xbow 2009 for 3 years, ripping in LW (59kg, :)).

Now crying loud why I've sold it...But, there might be a marketing issue how Cab advartise their sizes. 13m at the end might be much bigger than 13:)

The same for bigger sizes....

Hey Coastflyer
Love the mal vid , any idea what size kite hes on and wind or what size kite and conditions do you use your mal.
thanks

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pearl said...

Do light wind kites work. Or what you gain in size, do you lose in terms of weight & lack of manoeuvrability (thanks spellcheck). I'm considering getting an ozone edge 13m or 17m. We've had so many days around 12kn this year. At 75kg my biggest kite is a 10m reo and gets me going ok on a surfboard at 12/13kn with no current assist. Am I kidding myself going kiting in less, or is it worth having a light wind machine for freeride. Anyone with a 13 or 17 edge can give me a heads up. Or could i work an 11m to get more bottom end than the reo with a bit of added glide? Can they self launch & relaunch in low wind? Cheers

In my experience Light winds kites only offer about up to 1 extra knot of wind range per square meter once you go over about the 12-13m sizes using the same board. So for example if a 17m kite gets you to enjoy 12 to 15 knots days on a regular twin tip then you would normally be fine on a 12-13m from 15 to 18 knots on the same board.

As Gorgo said, the board makes more difference than the kite. An Airush sector is making light wind kiting effortless once you learn to ride it well. With a 17m kite an a sector I can go upwind effortlessly in winds as low as 7-8 knots even at 85kg.

But above all what makes the most difference in light wind is skill, experience and practice. Most people I see with larger light wind kites use them in conditions where they would normally be fine on a 12m kite for instance. Light wind kiting is difficult and frustrating at first, especially when you plan to go under 12 knots. The ability to develop constant power and apparent wind is essential. Kiteloops and downloops for transitions and avoiding to drop the kite in water are also essential skills. Not only it's difficult to relaunch below 12 knots but also the kite fly's better when dry (lighter). Line extensions help in marginal winds (6-8 knots) but you will loose the ability to go upwind as easily....Something that's not much of a problem if you use a light wind specific board like the Sector.

I even find myself enjoying some basic freestyle moves in light winds (10 knots) on the sector like the backrolll and (newly) the front roll.

Depends what you like, if you look at Ozone edges in the large sizes you'd probably find it fits best with a race/light wind board. Also from my experience Ozone Edges are very hard to relaunch in very light winds (6-10 knots) in comparison with Ozone Zephyr or Core XR in the same size. Self-Launch from the beach is always easy regardless of the kite size or the wind speed with the correct technique. Worst case in very light wind you reverse launch it straight into the power zone.

My advice would be to get light wind specific board first and learn to ride it and enjoy lighter winds than usual with it with your normal size kite. Then the big light wind kite will make the most difference.

Here's my take on light wind.

First of all yes big light wind kites work. But you need to mentally prepair yourself for a different experience. If your expecting to rip the same way you do in 20 knots your going to be dissappointed.

If you want to add a couple knots to your low end of wave riding then look at a big 14m ish low aspect kite like ozone catalyst. It will have the low down grunt to smash you through whitewash/swell and will turn fast for a light wind beast. yourll get to ride waves in lighter wind.

if you want to crank further down maybe sub 10 knots then you need to step into the slower turning high aspect light wind specific kites. they will generally suck in the surf because they need speed to create aparent wind. the white wash, swell, wave combo is constantly slowing you down. But on flat water, low swell days these kite rule. You gain huge power with speed and aparent wind. So once your up and running on flat water there's no looking back.

Of course landkiting in lightwind is another option if you have a hard beach or grass area with clean wind. I have some of my most fun sessions on my 15m flysurfer on the landboard. 4 knots and i'm cruising, 8 knots I can start jumping back roll kite loops. 12 knots i'm doing nice floaty airs 30m + distance. jumping boulders. theres usually half a doz guys on the beach watching and waiting for the wind to build so they can hit the water.

Can I add, really good post and really great advice here.

Big kites work,but u need to know what trim is all about. If ur a stuff the bar and forget type rider then light winds might not be ur slice of pie,regardless the size of ur gear.

awesome profile pic above...