Hi,
I'm a beginner freerider, 90 kg.
I plan to buy a 12m KITE for 15-20knots.
I ???reduced??? the options to Core Riot XR3, Bandit6 and North Evo 2013. The EVO is more expensive than the other two.
I don't buy new kites every year (financial reasons) so, this one should last (and should be fun as my kiting skills progress) for minimum 3 years.
I have a 10m Bandit5 and I like it except its built quality.
I couldn't find detailed review about Riot and never had the chance to try one...
Testers say only good things about Evo...but it has way higher price than the 'concurrents'.
Can anyone help me in decision? Does it worth to invest more in EVO? If it doesn't then which one should I go for Riot or Bandit ?
Any objective input will be highly appreciated.
Thanks in advance.

PS: should I consider 13m for 15-20 knots and 90kg instead of 12m?

Mate, I don't know where you kite or what board size you have, but I would recommend the following....

I am about 92-95kg, I ride a 134x38 cm twin tip and have a core XR2 17m light wind edition kite.

This is by far my favorite kite in my quiver and has a super wind range to it. I can start riding at about 10kts and my max that I have been out in has been about 20kts.....

20kts isn't that much fun, but the kite can be controlled so is usable.

I mainly ride flat water with a bit of chop, but this kite is aimed at everything.

Build quality has been great and the service from Core has been excellent when I had a fault with the bar.

If you can try to demo one of these, then go for it to work out your own opinion but for 10-20kts.... This would be my go to kite....

Can't speak to the other kites as I have never used them.

I would add support to the above comment. You are 90kg and unless you plan to use a Largish SB your best bet is a 17m for the winds you are talking about. I'm only 75kg and take my zephyr 2013 up to 20 knots, around 16 to 18 I'm thinking about changing down, but not worried about being over lit. Rather have too much power and use it than not enough.

I think someone like cauncy ish round your weight and uses a TT and he's smiling big at 15 to 20.

As far as those kites mentioned if you do go the bigger sizes then the core, zephyr, fat lady, infinity, contra are all good options if you don't want to go a more race kite. Then it comes down to personal preferences for power delivery etc.

Man I'm 75 and 15 to 20 I'm thinking an 11 or 12m at the top end of that on a TT!!

Jamdfingr, Eppo,
Thanks for your input. I ride a twin-tip RRD Placebo 140/43.
LW kite you say.....I have to think about it. Last time when I went out in 20 knots my 16.5m Gaastra was overpowered. I let the bar and the KITE was still pulling me. Went out from water,took the windmeter and measured average 18 knots and the max was 20 knots. I suppose advanced riders can handle similar situations with a 16.5m but I'm a beginner....I've just started the small jumps....
In other words I have a LW kite but I use it till 15knots.

Which one can you recommend to me above 15 knots? Bandit6, Riot XR3 or maybe North EVO?

One week ago I was able to go in the wavy Aegean sea with my 10m Bandit in 22-23 knots. It wasn't a 'park and ride' case, I had to generate power continuously but still an enjoyable ride.

Gastra, if its the one I, thinking about has a strong delta shape. Those deltas are always a handful at their upper end.

The ones I mentioned, especially the zephyr and core are more refined and have a useable top end.

Evo bar pressure gets quite high in the big sizes. Bandits, don't know if they even do a big kite.

Riot X3 from your list.

Your 90kg, its not really a light wind kite for you.

Unless you get a race board....

Demoed the evo last season and thought the kite was horrible, don't know why they're pushed over the fuse which is a way better option as a north 4 line. It was a 10, I found the bar pressure heavy, power was raw in it's delivery and not linear.

Kite is pushed as a good unhooking kite but it wasn't for me, too much like s delta!

The dice is apparently a good option as a north allrounder. Put the naish park and the ozone catalyst in your list, ditch the evo.

Agreed Nick just didn't want to be as direct. But hey while we are here.

Spoke to a guy whose a big Vegas/park rider. Loves the park.

Got out on the dice with drew from wa surf the other day.

He's going to get some dice kites.m

Although his Vegas experience was on a 2012, mmm I suggested he try the Vegas and dice back to back as the new Vegas is outstanding and will always give you more slack in the lines and he likes his freestyle.

Naish: when I had my very first lessons at Tarifa there were several kite schools out there. One of them used Naish kites. Not sure whether the kites were used???or because of other reasons but people were struggling with them. In 4 days I saw two burst Naish kites. Again, I admit that the kites used by schools are not in the best shape after they are thrown several times by newbies. But unfortunately for a laic like me this is what remains about Naish kites ???till I won???t see/have different ???live??? experience. So, for now I excluded Naish.

Yesterday I had the chance to talk to a guy who is repairing kites for a store and for a kite school. And I heard interesting things. So far I thought that Core kites have one of the best quality. But this fellow states that the stitching is one of the cheapest one???.one should handle this opinion reservedly as the store doesn???t distribute Core kites. But - as I???m so undecided ??? this made me to eliminate Riot XR3 from my list.

???Put the naish park and the ozone catalyst in your list, ditch the evo??? ??? it???s interesting as yesterday I ???interviewed??? other guys as well, right on the beach, and they also mentioned the Catalyst. One of them rode both Catalyst2013 and Bandit (Bandit5 only) and as per his opinion both of them are good. Differences: Ozone has far better bar and QR system and its quality is superior comparing to Bandit. On the other hand Bandit is more powerful and pulls better. ??????.when the wind conditions require a 12m Catalyst you can go out with a 10m Bandit???.???. Also, their opinion was that a Bandit can serve you even when you step up from beginner to intermediate level.

They recommended to me to consider Slingshot Rally and RPM as well???.it???s like a never ending story, as soon as I cancelled two kites from my list (Riot and Evo) three others fill the void ???

I leave out Dice as it???s a brand new kite on a high price.
Thank you.

So, what is your opinion about this quartet Slingshot RPM, Rally and Bandit6, Catalyst?
Should I concentrate only to Bandit and Catalyst or it worth to spend time and deep dive in Slingshot tests?

Well if you can demo all of them it would be great. I've never been impressed with the rpm, always need one size bigger and I never felt they had decent drift capabilities. But there are some who absolutely love em!

The catalyst will take you to immediate and beyond just like the bandit.

I wouldn't write of Naish the local kite repairer (neil) has said for a long time Naish kites he sees the less for repairs.

But yes a bandit and a cat would be a good focus for your demo ideas for sure. Naish park has to be on that list as well.

It will come down to power delivery, which one clicks with you as a rider.

The dice is not as new as you think. In fact you talk to old Vegas riders and they swear it looks and feels a lot like the vegases of old before they went more C. It is essentially a toned down Vegas( well it was built on the Neo and the lessons they learnt off the Neo was put into the 2013 and 2014 vegases and hence why they are soooo much bette than the 2012 Vegas).

A tried and true wing in a lot of respects. But price...I agree.

I wanted to try the new core XR3 but I now got 9m & 13m edges.
Has anyone ridden the XR3 yet?

Thanks eppo.
I'll try to test a Catalyst. Unfortunately I won't have the possibility to demo a Park in the next two weeks (by 19 Sep I want a 12m as I'll go back to Rhodes for kiteboarding).
I'm really interested how the Catalyst works for me.

Hi kitcho,
Are you happy with the Edge?
Is it too slow or it's still enjoyable?
Is the 13m powerful? How about relaunch?

Silly me has bought 2 edges without even test riding them.
I went from BEST kites and really liked them. Especially the Nemesis.
Then bought an 11m C4 to try fooling around with freestyle. Don't mind it. Wasn't too much fun in 38kn in last session.
But there is so much hype about these bloody edges for freeride I thought I better give them a run.

I've just went through above posts and realized that my quotation marks became question marks when I posted the text. Sorry for that

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kitcho207 said..

Silly me has bought 2 edges without even test riding them.
I went from BEST kites and really liked them. Especially the Nemesis.
Then bought an 11m C4 to try fooling around with freestyle. Don't mind it. Wasn't too much fun in 38kn in last session.
But there is so much hype about these bloody edges for freeride I thought I better give them a run.

wouldnt call you silly, not sure about the 13, but if you carnt make the hair on the back of your neck stand on end with the 9 your either not going hard enough or youve got addisons disease ( bodies inability to produce addrenalin )

What he said above...

that's exactly the reason i got them.

really looking to see what all the hype is about...

everyone loves them and i like riding powered up so should be good.

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jb74 said..

Hi,
I'm a beginner freerider, 90 kg.


PS: should I consider 13m for 15-20 knots and 90kg instead of 12m?

Yep and a LW Twin Tip like a King George or SS Glide or North Spike or similar
This will have you covering a range from around 10 - 30 kts tacked on to your bandit , Placebo and a 13m kite.

Check out 13 m Epic Renegades and LF Envy's for super easy to fly kites with plenty of low end and high range to smooth out the 20kt gusts before you hafta swap back to the Bandit.
They're also well put together and heaps cheaper than all the kites in your list

Hi pattie,
You're right, sooner or later I will have to invest in a light wind board as well.
After all eppo convinced me me to go for a 14m Catalyst. I'm looking forward to get in my hand this kite

Hey JB, I wouldn't say I convinced ya mate. Just put forward what I know. The renegade as mentioned above is worth checking out to man...but as you said, hard to find a demo in your area.

I will be trying one soon, well a 9 and a 12, so if you could hold out a bit. I can only tell ya what I know and I don't know anything about say the renegade. But some crew rave about it.

Just saying, don't take what I say as gospel, that's all.

Like to get on a XR3 as well...near the top of my list now.

Until then I can't comment on them, but I do know the cat well enough.

You owe Eppo a Stella, Heard good things about the Cat's but never got on one to date.

Renegades are super easy that's for sure. They boost better in the smaller sizes but the larger sizes are super steady and smooth for rolls and turns. Screamers boost bigger so if you want that then check them out.

Dimitri Maramenedes, Epic's poster boy and part owner is Greek, that's why I thought it should be a no brainer to find one over there?
If not he'll definitely send one over and you could pick it up at his mums lol

Sorry Eppo, maybe I did not formulate properly. So, I was convinced by the reviews and other infos I collected from the net to go for a Catalyst.
Honestly, I???ve never seen Epic kites in the shops in Europe (although it can happen that it???s a European company). Checking their website I realized that they are not so widespread (based on the number of the dealers) as the other brands.
Unfortunately I don???t live in a windy region. Even if a local distributor would offer me different kites and sizes to test, I wouldn???t be able to take the chance. This is why I have to rely on reviews and other info I find on the web. Then I try to leave out the subjectivity of the writers and focus on the facts. Not the best way to pick the right kite but I don???t have other option.
In other word I won???t have possibility to demo a Renegade in the foreseeable future.

Yeh thought so.

Have you tried kiteforum as well? Worth posting something there, some really experienced guys on that forum.

Given you are 90kg, have some experience, but not a whole lot and want 15 to 20, then the 14m cat is a good option nevertheless. It will do exactly as you have you asked in the emails to me.

Personally though....I'd still go a zephyr

Which is what I said originally.

Hey JB, email a guy called cauncy, he's a good bloke to talk to as well, knows his stuff.

...... and Eppo is sooo stoked you don't know which Ozone to pick, lol

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jb74 said..

Hi kitcho,
Are you happy with the Edge?
Is it too slow or it's still enjoyable?
Is the 13m powerful? How about relaunch?

OK OK OK... now i see what all the fuss is about regarding edges.
was only 12-15kn sea breeze and i had a ball on the 13m egde. I was sceptical i would even get up riding with the monk as the board is quite power hungry but had no problem cranking up wind.
didn't take too long to dial in the slower turning and yes its notability slower, but its a very smooth kite and jumps effortlessly. Well outweighing turning speed.
big grins.
will be bigger grins when its fully powered up.
didn't get to try the relaunch. its so stable looks like ill be relaunching less.
is it powerful? well it was only peaking around 15kn and it was ok at the lower end too. It didnt have the real low end grunt of my CORE LW17, but the core doesn't jump like the edge. and too there is 4m of kite between them. I can relaunch the core easily in 8kn, im not so sure i would have the same luck with the edge.
still have the 9m sitting on the shelf too that i haven't tried.
so yes i love it. sell everything and buy one. hahaha. well at least demo one

kitch

Get on a 10m in 25 knots then you will know.