In lightervwinds I use an old dinosaur 15m.
And I can't understand why it struggles to go upwind.

I have the same kite in 11m & 7m and its fantastic. The 11m is the nicest kite and its always simple to stay upwind even when underpowered.
I used my 11m last week when others were riding 17m (my big dinosaur was being repaired).... And although I wasn't going as fast or have as much power as the boys on the 17m, I was still able to stay upwind and comfortably load & pop.

The next week, my 15m dinosaur is back in action but its just impossible to get upwind....... It seems sorta strange to me...... I had plenty of power, and even when I edge much harder than normal this kite just hates going upwind.

Admittedly they are older kites (circa 09)....
I'm wondering if over the years the change shape from stretch and how much of this could affect my upwind ability.

So what can actually cause a kite to hate going upwind?

Is it normal to have different sizes of the same kite that behave so differently?

My dinosaur has a few repairs, could this be affecting its upwind ability?
Is there anything I can do to fix it?

Has anybody else had acquiver of the same kite and found one of the sizes is poop to fly?

What's your thoughts??

speed is your friend in light wind,
loop your kite to build speed, edging hard won't do it for you,
edging hard can be like hitting the brakes in light wind

Too open a face to the wind can do it also
Longer power lines ,
If you've sufficient wind trim it back a bit

Hey Ragzilla. research the net or youtube and learn to tune your lines (really easy) then apply this to your 15m .Sounds as if its over tuned. (front and steering lines are not in the correct length ratio )Over tuning will make a kite fly further back in the wind window [b]pulling you down wind. Worth a try and is a necessity to keep your kites flying nicely, cheers Jeff, [/b]

Bigger kites have far thicker leading edges and more material. This equates to far more drag which increases exponentially as you increase velocity somewhat negating the benefit of the huge benefit of apparent wind in lighter conditions. In gusts they also will pull you down wind quickly.

Try keeping the kite really high in the window to minimise this extra drag and provide you with extra lift so you can go slower. This was the only thing which worked for me on my old 17m dinosaur until I sold it and gave up on big kites..

Get a bigger board or floaty surfboard ... I have been getting out in these winds 14-16kn with a 10m no problem while another guy who was smaller than me was going the same as me but on a 17m (and a surfboard)

Everytime I get a larger kite I ask myself why I bothered in the first place and move it on. They are heavier, turn slower and have more drag although the modern ones are made a bit lighter (less struts, thinner bladders, less dacron etc).

But if your front lines are stretched can cause the kite to lose power (on full power) because it will close up trapping air and in the worst case jellyfish, try lengthening back lines and let the kite fly itself a bit more.

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cauncy said..

Longer power lines ,

teach ourselves to kite did we cauncy?

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Kozzie said...

cauncy said..

Longer power lines ,

teach ourselves to kite did we cauncy?

Always throttle my kites kozzie

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jgfoster said...
Hey Ragzilla. research the net or youtube and learn to tune your lines (really easy) then apply this to your 15m .Sounds as if its over tuned. (front and steering lines are not in the correct length ratio )Over tuning will make a kite fly further back in the wind window [b]pulling you down wind. Worth a try and is a necessity to keep your kites flying nicely, cheers Jeff, [/b]

Thanks Jeff.
However I use the same bar on all my kites. My lines are deff tuned. We arectalking exact same bar, exact same kite, exact same bridles, and all lines are correct sizes..... But still this mother ship just hates going up wind.

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psychojoe said...
speed is your friend in light wind,
loop your kite to build speed, edging hard won't do it for you,
edging hard can be like hitting the brakes in light wind

Man!!... I work this thing, I dive it hard some times, and I've even tried diving it hard out to the edge of the window....

I can hold my tack just fine, but I just can't point up high with this kite....
I'm a good kiter in light & underpowered conditions. I know its all about keeping the kite moving (or apparent wind)......

Like I said, I've been riding my 11m in 15knots (I'm 120kg BTW) and been killing it ...... Next week I'm on the 15m in same winds but I can not get it up! (Ask my girlfriend!)

I've got a similar issue I've got a 12m SB and stay upwind great with that from 18knots, (range up to 30knots) but when I use my 17m Core Lw even when I feel powered up I struggle to make gains up wind and got to really focus to hold ground.

I don't use the 17m Core LW, very often and find it does take a lot more finesse to find the sweet spot. I used it yesterday at Brighton Le sands (botany bay NSW) started in 16-19knots and felt right at the upper limit in the gusts and was smoking upwind and wishing for more trim to de-power. As soon as the wind dropped to 14-16knots I was lucky to hold ground. Still happy with the session as a lot of other kiters at that point stayed on the beach but it was a constant battle to stay upwind even though I felt like I had plenty of power and was edging hard.

I think I'll use longer lines next time, for bigger power strokes and probably just more practice! (But interested what people suggest)

(All the chop from the bloody jet ski's doesn't help either!)

I've got a 140*43 board and I'm 110kgs

longer lines, bigger fins, flatter board, bar sheeted out, depower your kite

Tav,

I find with light wind kiting in the conditions you summarize yesterday that in the lulls you really need to change your riding technique. Get the kite high in the window and really push your hips forward to take as much weight off your feet and the edge of the board. As the gusts come through you need to then resume your usual stance and edge harder. I have two LW kites a 19m Core XR3 and a Zephyr....(Interesting story how I ended up with two very different LW kites)

Compared to the Zephyr the Core is a beast (its heavy and slow to turn and the leading edge is really thick) and has such a small wind range. The Core does not sit well at the front of the window so it gets overpowered really easily if its gusty and takes a lot of strength to hold it in a safe position in the gusts. If you have a Core LW IMO you need minimum 27m lines in order for it to behave well in light conditions. In saying all this I do find the Core is optimal in 9 - 14 knots and is a lot of fun on a LW board. You can actually jump quite high in about 12 knots and it provides nice lofty jumps where most other LW kites are just mowing the grass at that wind range with a 110kg rider.

My advice: for your weight invest in a light wind board. I highly recommend the King Gee 150x55 LW board. It performs really well is light and adds easily another 3knots range on the low end. It will get you upwind much more easily and allow you to perfect your light wind riding technique.

If you want a light wind kite that handles gusty conditions really well then you might want to consider dumping the Core and looking at a Zephyr. IMO the best LW kite I have ever ridden.

Thanks Kitebt, will try those things and see how it goes.

Side note, At time of buying was keen on the Zephyr or Contra but neither in stock at the time and was told in the store that the Core LW was as good as the others! Shame but I guess you can't blame them for selling when the buyer is keen. All good just got to work on the technique abit more, as in the right conditions it is a very fun kite with the lofty jumps!

Dont kite in light winds.

In my view, the best way to ride upwind is to use a keel or a proper fin. Not the little fins most kite board have, but something more like this ...

flysurfer-uk.com/product/flydoor-5/

The FlyDoor has a small (detachable) fin (or I prefer a keel) in the middle of the board, to actually give you really good upwind control, just like a sail boat.

There are some other variations out there with even bigger keels, but the concept is the same, as per sailing.

Why is a keel important (and why foil kiters always go where ever they want - especially up wind)?

www.discoverboating.com/resources/article.aspx?id=251

Everyone seems to talk bigger kite or a bigger board (both), and yeah they help, but really good upwind stability and control of direction, can only come when you command it by placing a keel down into the water. Without something like that, you're still skimming the surface - literally. Besides, a bigger board only acts as a keel more than a smaller board because you have more of the corner of the board in the water - hence it acts like a keel or rudder.

But meh, what do I know right?!

check the line lengths. If the back lines are too short then it might be stalling the kite

Lofty excellent point made, I use to sail and sailboard a lot so I know how important a keel/centerboard is and often thought it would be good to have a detachable centerboard on your kite board. For now just trying to make the best out of the current kite and board I have.

I guess if your that keen on light wind / upwind performance you get your self a foil board or race board.

The only problem you have with a keel on your board is that you are limited to mowing the lawn. I think good technique is much better to getting up wind than things like keels.

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kitebt said..
The only problem you have with a keel on your board is that you are limited to mowing the lawn. I think good technique is much better to getting up wind than things like keels.

Yes and no.

The Flydoor (correct me here) has a detachable keel, so you pull it out when you want to go back down-wind.

You can still jump with your board, keel or not.

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Underoath said...
Dont kite in light winds.

I dis agree kite when ever the **** u can I kite from 10knots and I'm far from skinny :-)

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Underoath said..
Dont kite in light winds.

seriously the people that kite in high pressure systems need theyre heads examined. you can do virtually EVERY SPORT in a high pressure system diving surfing fishing gliding hiking climbing bikeing skateing skiing rideing anything you can think of EXCEPT kiteing! kiteing is for lows with theyre winds (seabreezes aside and various other windy windy winds but you get the point)

oh its ****ing sunny as balls and theres a gentle breeze out LETS GO KITEING!!! NOOOOPPPPPEEE!!! and if you really must go kiteing in sub 10knots bust out the ****ing stunt kites or something the whole idea of the sport is to harness the elements and half you ****ers dont even understand them the fact underoath was redthumbed to balivion is proof

dont kite in light winds. light winds is time to do virtually EVERYTHING ELSE IN THE WORLD when its windy THEN go kiteing. peanuts the lot of ya..... hay what happened to brazilnuts anyways?!?least he could do some ****

ONE MORE GARDENING!! NO WIND?!?! PLANT A POTATO!!

AND EVEN ANOTHER BURNING!! BURN **** IF ITS NOT WINDY NOT KITESURFING!!!??!?!!?11k1kk1

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Underoath said...
Dont kite in light winds.

I dis agree kite when ever the **** u can I kite from 10knots and I'm far from skinny :-)