Hey!

Got a EPIRB for when I am out at sea and things go wrong alone. Have flares and inflating life jacket for big trips out at sea, but WHAT insurance do I /we need to cover the cost for a marine rescue from a police launch, helicopter, ship that changes course?

Will AKSA third party cover it?
Travel Insurance cover it - domestic?
Or need some from YA or another provider?

Thanks

Surely this is a joke....

EPIRBs are for emergencies .... Don't kite further out than you are prepared to swim... If you are doing a crossing or some other adventure make your own safety arrangements ie: chase boat.



The last thing the sport needs is some muppet on the news being rescued by the coast guard or helicopter (at the Tax payers expense Even if it's just perceived ) after pulling an EPIRB all because they wanted kite too far out to sea for no apparent reason.

I donk think people want the insurance premiums increased either.

harry potter said...
Surely this is a joke....

EPIRBs are for emergencies .... Don't kite further out than you are prepared to swim... If you are doing a crossing or some other adventure make your own safety arrangements ie: chase boat.



The last thing the sport needs is some muppet on the news being rescued by the coast guard or helicopter (at the Tax payers expense Even if it's just perceived ) after pulling an EPIRB all because they wanted kite too far out to sea for no apparent reason.

I donk think people want the insurance premiums increased either.

Really?
Your not that adventurous are you.

Shall we tell all yachties to not go out further than they can swim? fishermen?.....
What about the chase boat is that aloud an epirb?

What the world needs less of is epirb police muppets trying to cut down the adventurous.

Moist peeps should be able to swim 3 - 4km back to shore. Not sure how far you are going out. Beyond 5km in WA on a kite or windsurfer is breaking the law isn't it? I don't even know if you're being serious, but if you are then your behaviour/attitude is moronic. Aside from the $$ involved in rescuing you, there actually might be someone genuinely in need of rescuing, but can't be because the rescue services are too busy trying to rescue your stupid ar$e.

Geez this forum is full of knockers lately.

Why not have an EPIRB they are not just for boats and do save lives.

The rescue services would rather have GPS coordinates to navigate too than spend hours doing grid sweeps of the ocean after a flare was sighted or they get a report of someone in trouble.
Of course they shouldn't be set off unless you feel you are in real danger.

People carry epirb's when hiking in remote areas etc, do the knockers think maybe those people shouldn't carry them or that they should stick to the local footpaths?

Picker a few of us set off on a bit of a down wind kiting adventure on Sunday, we didn't have an EPIRB but we did have flares, PFDs and a couple of waterproof VHF radios, non of which was we had to use but I wouldn't have attempted the trip without.

Portable VHF radios are a great option that are not that expensive and are convenient because you can use them without setting off a full scale search but maybe just to alert authorities that things aren't going quite to plan so that they can monitor your progress etc.

Not sure about your insurance question though.

kiterboy said...
Nice replies from the agro front.

Guy was asking a question.

If you disagree with the concept, how about a balanced reply instead of name calling and agro?

There is name calling & agro, because it is a stupid idea that is expensive, unnecessary and has the potential to be harmful to others. There is nothing wrong with doing something risky and dangerous and carrying specific safety equipment including an EPRIB, however there is something wrong with someone doing something risky and dangerous and stupid. And completely unnecessary. The impression I got from the OP, was that he was going to get an EPIRB and then just kite out to sea, with no buddies, no support crew, jetskis etc etc If he can't swim 3 or 4kms back to shore he shouldn't be going that far out. We occasionally kite at a reef break 3 km off the coast, but we have a Jetski that comes with us. And if that fails, there is an inflatable dinghy and if that fails we could probably swim back to shore.

Surfzup, I consider myself a fairly good swimmer that would be able to make it back from a few K's offshore no worries but I nearly drowned once only a couple of hundred meters off the coast down near Margaret River (Three Bears) when big swell created a horrendous rip and I snapped my leggie and lost my board.
**** happens best to be prepared.

Every boat that goes to Rotto has an EPIRB but they are hardly ever set off, just because you are carrying one doesn't mean you have to use it.

I was a FSR skipper and whilst I would have preferred it if people didnt doo anything stupid or get in trouble, if you are going to attempt anything with risk involved I would have preferred you to have one as I'm sure most would.

I disagree and I will leave it at that.

Edit: actually I won't leave it at that because that sounds wrong when I re read it, I disagree with the fact that there is no place for EPIRB's on kiters.
You are never going to stop people pushing the boundaries and so if they are I feel it is better that they are prepared.
Yes they shouldn't just be heading miles out to sea for the sake of it and no they shouldn't rely on an EPIRB to save them, there are lots of other options that should be used first hence the reason I mentioned VHF radios, but I believe it is a good idea to have one as a last resort if you are doing something that you know has risks involved.

Your average Sunday arvo kiter def should not have one.

If you set of an epirb and its not a genuine life threatening situation, your in for a world of hurt.i cant remember the figures but by the time they send out a chopper etc it all adds up

Being stuck 1km offshore is not life threatening but if your that worried carry a radio (and learn the rules) or why not a personal locator beacon which is a much smaller option designed for adventurers.

Radio is the safest way though.

^^^^^ couldnt agree more you beat me to it


and I think few of you are missing the point........... a kite is not an appropriate craft for venturing far out to sea...

I personally have an EPIRB (I take it when sailing ( ocean ) as a backup as there is one permanently in the boat ) I have never had to use it as the yacht is a purpose built craft for going out to sea...... we have had gear breakages and have had to use the motor to limp to port, we have had to use a sea anchor overnight before being able to conduct repairs to rigging. I would only use the EPIRB when all other avenues have failed and it is a matter of life or death... eg: you have no other forms of communication and or you are in the life rafts and adrift

I also take the EPIRB in my 4x4 but again we also have a UHF and HF radios and travel with another vehicle when in remote areas eg:The Simpson etc.... We also carry enough water and food should we need to stop for a few days to conduct repairs.... again have never had to use the EPIRB and could only imagine using it in an emergency ie : remote car accident and no other forms of communication.

An EPIRB is not a primary form of communication it is a locating beacon for an emergency only. If you go to sea you have to take a certain responsibility for your situation. On a kite far offshore broken gear or a drop of wind means an immediate emergency.

If you are kiting out at sea you have no ability to care for an injury, you presumably have no food and or limited water and are completly exposed.... imagine someone riding a pushbike out into the simpson desert with no water, no food no tent just carrying an EPIRB you would think they were an idiot.

The reference to hikers completely misses the point......You would have food, water and shelter and could survive extended periods of time even with a serious injury ie: broken leg.

Other issues include : EPIRBs have been known to fail, a rescue could take many many hours...... ( how long will you survive immersed in the water ).


Im not against adventure Im all for it and have done plenty of it... but Im about doing it properly and being prepared. If you venture far away you must be properly prepared which means an appropriate vehicle or craft fit for the purpose, ( a kiteboard is not an appropriate craft for travelling at sea) and be prepared to have some sort or self rescue or contingency plan.

By all means if you want to attempt some sort of crossing on a kite ie: Tassie to Victoria as some have done make your own arrangements for a rescue/chase boat and take every precaution. An EPIRB should not be your primary form of communication it is last resort.

Rant Over

surfzup said...

kiterboy said...
Nice replies from the agro front.

Guy was asking a question.

If you disagree with the concept, how about a balanced reply instead of name calling and agro?

There is name calling & agro, because it is a stupid idea that is expensive, unnecessary and has the potential to be harmful to others. There is nothing wrong with doing something risky and dangerous and carrying specific safety equipment including an EPRIB, however there is something wrong with someone doing something risky and dangerous and stupid. And completely unnecessary. The impression I got from the OP, was that he was going to get an EPIRB and then just kite out to sea, with no buddies, no support crew, jetskis etc etc If he can't swim 3 or 4kms back to shore he shouldn't be going that far out. We occasionally kite at a reef break 3 km off the coast, but we have a Jetski that comes with us. And if that fails, there is an inflatable dinghy and if that fails we could probably swim back to shore.

I disagree with your argument. You d*ck.

Is that how it's done then?

Very well said Harry Potter.

surfzup said...

kiterboy said...

surfzup said...

kiterboy said...
Nice replies from the agro front.

Guy was asking a question.

If you disagree with the concept, how about a balanced reply instead of name calling and agro?

There is name calling & agro, because it is a stupid idea that is expensive, unnecessary and has the potential to be harmful to others. There is nothing wrong with doing something risky and dangerous and carrying specific safety equipment including an EPRIB, however there is something wrong with someone doing something risky and dangerous and stupid. And completely unnecessary. The impression I got from the OP, was that he was going to get an EPIRB and then just kite out to sea, with no buddies, no support crew, jetskis etc etc If he can't swim 3 or 4kms back to shore he shouldn't be going that far out. We occasionally kite at a reef break 3 km off the coast, but we have a Jetski that comes with us. And if that fails, there is an inflatable dinghy and if that fails we could probably swim back to shore.

I disagree with your argument. You d*ck.

Is that how it's done then?

Stop being childish. We're having a nice healthy debate here, don't ruin it with infantile comments. And if you're aiming to reply with more petty insults I'll just ignore you.

But you're the one who advocated name calling.
I was just trying to follow your lead.

tightlines said...
Geez this forum is full of knockers lately.

Why not have an EPIRB they are not just for boats and do save lives.

The rescue services would rather have GPS coordinates to navigate too than spend hours doing grid sweeps of the ocean after a flare was sighted or they get a report of someone in trouble.
Of course they shouldn't be set off unless you feel you are in real danger.

People carry epirb's when hiking in remote areas etc, do the knockers think maybe those people shouldn't carry them or that they should stick to the local footpaths?

Picker a few of us set off on a bit of a down wind kiting adventure on Sunday, we didn't have an EPIRB but we did have flares, PFDs and a couple of waterproof VHF radios, non of which was we had to use but I wouldn't have attempted the trip without.

Portable VHF radios are a great option that are not that expensive and are convenient because you can use them without setting off a full scale search but maybe just to alert authorities that things aren't going quite to plan so that they can monitor your progress etc.

Not sure about your insurance question though.

As one of the crew on this expedition (that didnt' work due to poor winds unfortunately...) there's one more bit of 'safety' related advice I'd suggest:

If crew are doing a long distance DW/expedition - (Sunday was going to be 50km) or going some distance off-shore (say several kilometres or more), let the local Sea Rescue Group know of your plans - how many, route, expected time of return & when you get back, call to let them know you're all back safe.

Fremantle Sea Rescue: 9335 1332; VHF channel 73 or 16 (emergency)
Cockburn Sea Rescue: 9410 1544; VHF channel 73 or 16 (emergency).

One phone call isn't going over the top but provides an extra bit of 'cover' just in case.

www.transport.wa.gov.au/imarine/19164.asp

Going by this site, you should have one if over 2nm from shore (among other situations).
I haven't seen an official mention made as to whether kiters should or shouldn't be that far out and doesn't explicitly state that kiters shouldn't carry one.

PLBs are discouraged for water use though.

However common sense, planning and alternatives should avoid having to use one as stated on the page.

"When to activate a distress beacon

Distress beacons are for use only in life-threatening situations. In the event of an emergency, you should first signal other people in your area using radios or other methods of attracting attention."

Ok I said I wasn't but couldn't resist.
Everyone anti Epirb for kites is assuming that you are miles out to sea.
Most long Kitesurf adventures are along the coast.
Perth to Lancelin has been done before and no doubt will be done again, I also know of kite trips for hundreds of kilometers along remote stretches of the South coast.
Perhaps they shouldn't be doing it but they did.

So if we are talking senarios how about you have first aid kits, radios, flares, phones, food, water, have let people know your route etc but you have broken your leg and are on a beach somewhere miles from the nearest town with no radio or phone reception.

It is then that I would be glad to have a Epirb and I would use it.