hi all

ive only ever kited flat water until recently, and i know the evils of leashes and have never used one.

However now im faced with riding in surf, i see a lot of experoinced kited using surfboards with normal surfboard leg ropes.

Is this less dangerous than a normal leash in flat water? Is it suicide? Why do people seem to do this ona regular basis?

thanks in advance for your thoughts.

Hi mate, I see a mix around and I personally use a reel leash. No issues so far (touch wood) but also I don't jump or do tricks or unhook and I'm also on a twin tip. Another guy I kite with occasionally rides a surfboard and a standard leash with no problems, but again he doesn't jump.

I might get canned here but for what it's worth I think if your advanced and jumping and doing tricks don't go near them, but if your not really leaving the water it may be 'safer'. The reel leash never returns your board as it doesn't have the spring to wind up against the water tension. I suspect standard surf leashes would spring your board back a bit more.

The reel leash is normally around your waist area and they are really long so when you come off the board it can be 6-8 foot away from you whereas a surfboard leash goes around you ankle and are normally 6 foot long or there abouts so when you come off and your legs are down in the water the board will end up very close to you.

I think you really need to consider what tricks and jumps etc your doing before going down the leash track, remember how light and floaty surfboards are compared to twin tips.

general rule - people are stupid
leash = increased risk of injury

A surfboard with a leash is really dangerous, imagine what happens when yr board goes through your lines, even worse if you have dropped your kite. Best bet is to body drag back to your board.

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Daniel1973 said..
Hi mate, I see a mix around and I personally use a reel leash. No issues so far (touch wood) but also I don't jump or do tricks or unhook and I'm also on a twin tip. Another guy I kite with occasionally rides a surfboard and a standard leash with no problems, but again he doesn't jump.

I might get canned here but for what it's worth I think if your advanced and jumping and doing tricks don't go near them, but if your not really leaving the water it may be 'safer'. The reel leash never returns your board as it doesn't have the spring to wind up against the water tension. I suspect standard surf leashes would spring your board back a bit more.

The reel leash is normally around your waist area and they are really long so when you come off the board it can be 6-8 foot away from you whereas a surfboard leash goes around you ankle and are normally 6 foot long or there abouts so when you come off and your legs are down in the water the board will end up very close to you.

I think you really need to consider what tricks and jumps etc your doing before going down the leash track, remember how light and floaty surfboards are compared to twin tips.

that is by far the worst and incorrect advice given . Reel leashes are a real danger and i can tell you Daniel that reel leashes can and do return your board at high speed .

i would suggest loosing the reel leash and learn to body drag

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Daniel1973 said..
Hi mate, I see a mix around and I personally use a reel leash. No issues so far (touch wood) but also I don't jump or do tricks or unhook and I'm also on a twin tip. Another guy I kite with occasionally rides a surfboard and a standard leash with no problems, but again he doesn't jump.

I might get canned here but for what it's worth I think if your advanced and jumping and doing tricks don't go near them, but if your not really leaving the water it may be 'safer'. The reel leash never returns your board as it doesn't have the spring to wind up against the water tension. I suspect standard surf leashes would spring your board back a bit more.

The reel leash is normally around your waist area and they are really long so when you come off the board it can be 6-8 foot away from you whereas a surfboard leash goes around you ankle and are normally 6 foot long or there abouts so when you come off and your legs are down in the water the board will end up very close to you.

I think you really need to consider what tricks and jumps etc your doing before going down the leash track, remember how light and floaty surfboards are compared to twin tips.

why would u need a leash when mowing the lawn?

Wavekites are really easy to drop all the power out of them. An experienced kiter essentially never has the uncontrolled drag through the water thing behind a wave kite.

In big-ass scary surf, being without a board can be more dangerous than the unlikely event of board through the lines - I have had both experiences and I know which I prefer.

It is a question of relative risk. Neither is completely safe - but that is kitesurfing.

Dogma is bollocks. Anyone who says "never" has not thought more broadly about the issues. It should always be a case of which is the most risk.

If you are doing flicky spinny stuff powered up, a leash IS dangerous. I do not use a leash at all in this setting.

If you are doing an unassisted deep ocean crossing for 50km, what scares you more - the unlikely event of being hit by a board (when you would be kiting conservatively anyway) or body dragging 25km. For me, it is a no-brainer.

About half the time when I kite with a surfboard I use a standard surfboard leash. I find it particularly useful in dead-onshore wind with a long whitewater zone, especially if a little underpowered - if you come off your board once it invariably ends up back on shore. You then struggle mightily for 10 minutes to get back out, only for it to happen again.

In four years of doing this, I have had a single occasion where the board went through the lines when I was rumbled in the waves. Scary? Hell yeah! But recovered it quickly without crashing the kite. Just undid the ankle strap - wow that was hard!

nearly died this season due to leggy in the easter Friday swell, lines tangles up round ankle preventing removal of leash, kite pulling underwater by leg, lines cut through skin. Massive swell with no chance to escape, no knife so my bad. Still leggy cause massive problems when it hits it.

I reckon you weigh up the alternatives and make an assessment. Metro sandy beaches - worst that can happen with no leash is your board washes up on the beach and you have to go get it. Scary remote reef break, no beach, sea urchins, waves breaking right onto cliffs and rock ledges - I'd use a leash every time.

Oh, this old chestnut.

A leash of any kind is pretty stupid. You make the decision as to what you prefer, but there is absolutely no denying that using a leash adds an element of risk of serious injury and in a worse case scenario, could even lead to a fatality. There are very few instances where a leash would be necessary. It's the fall back of the lazy kiter.

And yes, I have kited remote offshore, urchin covered reefs, sharky water and huge sucky scary waves and I still choose no leash. I'm not adverse to copping a fin cut to the back of the head or body, but I don't want to wear my board in the face or the teeth.

BTW, you don't need to be jumping or doing freestyle to be at risk of a board hit from a leash, you only need to be riding fast. You fall, the kite pulls you when you hit the water, the board catches and then springs at you at the speed you were travelling at once you stop.

Seriously? Just lose the leash. This isn't surfing, we have a means of propulsion to retrieve our board if we fall of it in surf or flat water.

DM

Get rid of it. I used one for a few years until I split my knee open.I no longer use one and I now rarely loose my board.Best tip a can give you is to get a dyno bar. I truly believe I can now body drag much higher into the wind.

It's not about jumping, what board you ride or what "tricks" you into pulling, it's about falling off your board and not being competent enough to retrieve it when you do splash. Leashes are deadly and should never be used! I say learn one of the most basic "tricks" body dragging back to your board. Even if you can only hold your ground body dragging (not make headway up wind) your board will soon drift down to you or be washed in shore where you would / should be by then to retrieve it. Learn the basics and progress.

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brady said..

Wavekites are really easy to drop all the power out of them. An experienced kiter essentially never has the uncontrolled drag through the water thing behind a wave kite.

What a load of cr@p... If the kite can pull you (which all do if you are riding behind it) then "uncontrolled drag" is possible on any kite.Any leggy tangled through lines will loop you uncontrollably until the kite crashes or you hit something. Fact.Why do I use a leggy sometimes???
Mostly for the safety of other beach users. Your board caught in a wave, could potentially kill someone if hit in the head. I also use one where there's a chance of the board going into rocks, or it's a spot/setup where I don't want to be dragging for my board all the time.There is always a risk when using a leggy, the real question is whether you are competent enough and aware enough to plan for those risks and cope with dangerous situations if they occur??? You have to ask yourself those questions before using one I think.

I don't use a leggie but made one adapting a fcs leggie to a quick release attaching to my harness.
Or you could just attach leggie to harness just Make sure it's easy to get off.

No right answer on this one.

yep... seems to casue a differnce of opinion doesnt it.. thanks everyone. ill probably body drag for the near future

I Have no opinion on leashes, but just thought I'd leave this here

Used a leggy once on a tt back in 2000, having a great arvi sail at boat ramps then fell and got dragged, the leash just stretched until the board came out the water, straight into the back of my head with the rail, lucky I had a Gath on, saw stars hay! Cut my head open through the helmet 4 stitches, the helmet still got the dent in it.
Happy days = no leash

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ActionSportsWA said..
Oh, this old chestnut.

A leash of any kind is pretty stupid. You make the decision as to what you prefer, but there is absolutely no denying that using a leash adds an element of risk of serious injury and in a worse case scenario, could even lead to a fatality. There are very few instances where a leash would be necessary. It's the fall back of the lazy kiter.

And yes, I have kited remote offshore, urchin covered reefs, sharky water and huge sucky scary waves and I still choose no leash. I'm not adverse to copping a fin cut to the back of the head or body, but I don't want to wear my board in the face or the teeth.

BTW, you don't need to be jumping or doing freestyle to be at risk of a board hit from a leash, you only need to be riding fast. You fall, the kite pulls you when you hit the water, the board catches and then springs at you at the speed you were travelling at once you stop.

Seriously? Just lose the leash. This isn't surfing, we have a means of propulsion to retrieve our board if we fall of it in surf or flat water.

DM

So what do you do when you loose your board on the so called remote offshore, urchin covered reefs, sharky water and huge sucky scary waves or are you that good that this does not happen to you ??

I am not for or against leashes however a mate has the type that connects to a plastic clip to harness , when there is too much load on the cable the plastic clip breaks , there fore no board getting sprung back at you...

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fingerbone said..

ActionSportsWA said..
Oh, this old chestnut.

A leash of any kind is pretty stupid. You make the decision as to what you prefer, but there is absolutely no denying that using a leash adds an element of risk of serious injury and in a worse case scenario, could even lead to a fatality. There are very few instances where a leash would be necessary. It's the fall back of the lazy kiter.

And yes, I have kited remote offshore, urchin covered reefs, sharky water and huge sucky scary waves and I still choose no leash. I'm not adverse to copping a fin cut to the back of the head or body, but I don't want to wear my board in the face or the teeth.

BTW, you don't need to be jumping or doing freestyle to be at risk of a board hit from a leash, you only need to be riding fast. You fall, the kite pulls you when you hit the water, the board catches and then springs at you at the speed you were travelling at once you stop.

Seriously? Just lose the leash. This isn't surfing, we have a means of propulsion to retrieve our board if we fall of it in surf or flat water.

DM

So what do you do when you loose your board on the so called remote offshore, urchin covered reefs, sharky water and huge sucky scary waves or are you that good that this does not happen to you ??

I am not for or against leashes however a mate has the type that connects to a plastic clip to harness , when there is too much load on the cable the plastic clip breaks , there fore no board getting sprung back at you...

i use no leggy on the type of waves you mention^^^.
climbing up onto rocky ledges suck, but i'd rather do that then have a constant annoyance around my feet.
and having the board rap around the bar sucks....

i find the board always washes into the calm water anyway, when on big grarly reefs.
either inside, or floats back into the channel.

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juicerider said..




I Have no opinion on leashes, but just thought I'd leave this here

Me thinks that will cleave a fresh axe wound on this poor lass!

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ActionSportsWA said..

A leash of any kind is pretty stupid.

Lose the kite leash too. ^^^

Why would you want to tether yourself to a power kite in high surf ?

lol.

On a more practical note. If you have a nice beach to wash onto I see no point in having a leash. its definitely more dangerous than not having one.

But I do see a place a leash may be safer than not having one. That is when you are at a point break with cliffs, raged boulders inshore. Loosing the board would mean a dangerous long body drag around the cliffs past the boulders back to the beach. In that instance a leash may male more sense than not using one.

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jamesperth said..
I reckon you weigh up the alternatives and make an assessment. Metro sandy beaches - worst that can happen with no leash is your board washes up on the beach and you have to go get it. Scary remote reef break, no beach, sea urchins, waves breaking right onto cliffs and rock ledges - I'd use a leash every time.

For surf, I agree with this bloke, and the guy who said a leggie may be useful in total onshore, underpowered, crumbly wave conditions where if you lose your board you'll spend 10 minutes trying to get off the beach again, and again, and again. For TT work, learning and flat water, learn to body drag up wind. It ain't hard, once you can do it.

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dusta said...

Daniel1973 said..
Hi mate, I see a mix around and I personally use a reel leash. No issues so far (touch wood) but also I don't jump or do tricks or unhook and I'm also on a twin tip. Another guy I kite with occasionally rides a surfboard and a standard leash with no problems, but again he doesn't jump.

I might get canned here but for what it's worth I think if your advanced and jumping and doing tricks don't go near them, but if your not really leaving the water it may be 'safer'. The reel leash never returns your board as it doesn't have the spring to wind up against the water tension. I suspect standard surf leashes would spring your board back a bit more.

The reel leash is normally around your waist area and they are really long so when you come off the board it can be 6-8 foot away from you whereas a surfboard leash goes around you ankle and are normally 6 foot long or there abouts so when you come off and your legs are down in the water the board will end up very close to you.

I think you really need to consider what tricks and jumps etc your doing before going down the leash track, remember how light and floaty surfboards are compared to twin tips.

that is by far the worst and incorrect advice given . Reel leashes are a real danger and i can tell you Daniel that reel leashes can and do return your board at high speed .

i would suggest loosing the reel leash and learn to body drag

Hi Dusta,

Have you ever used a reel leash?

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why would u need a leash when mowing the lawn?

More time mowing perhaps?

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surfingboye said..

fingerbone said..

ActionSportsWA said..
Oh, this old chestnut.

A leash of any kind is pretty stupid. You make the decision as to what you prefer, but there is absolutely no denying that using a leash adds an element of risk of serious injury and in a worse case scenario, could even lead to a fatality. There are very few instances where a leash would be necessary. It's the fall back of the lazy kiter.

And yes, I have kited remote offshore, urchin covered reefs, sharky water and huge sucky scary waves and I still choose no leash. I'm not adverse to copping a fin cut to the back of the head or body, but I don't want to wear my board in the face or the teeth.

BTW, you don't need to be jumping or doing freestyle to be at risk of a board hit from a leash, you only need to be riding fast. You fall, the kite pulls you when you hit the water, the board catches and then springs at you at the speed you were travelling at once you stop.

Seriously? Just lose the leash. This isn't surfing, we have a means of propulsion to retrieve our board if we fall of it in surf or flat water.

DM

So what do you do when you loose your board on the so called remote offshore, urchin covered reefs, sharky water and huge sucky scary waves or are you that good that this does not happen to you ??

I am not for or against leashes however a mate has the type that connects to a plastic clip to harness , when there is too much load on the cable the plastic clip breaks , there fore no board getting sprung back at you...

i use no leggy on the type of waves you mention^^^.
climbing up onto rocky ledges suck, but i'd rather do that then have a constant annoyance around my feet.
and having the board rap around the bar sucks....

i find the board always washes into the calm water anyway, when on big grarly reefs.
either inside, or floats back into the channel.

Hi surfingboye,

Just bodydrag around the reef. There is always a channel, to get through if you need to, or most often than not, the reef I'm talking about is cross to cross off at parts so just wait out off the shoulder and the board will wash out, it always does, and no I'm not pro league, but I know what I'm doing in the surf. The leash also creates drag and prevents doing board flicky upwind aerial stuff. I hate leashes on my feet when kiting, I've never felt it a problem not having one and I have kited in everything from small cross shore to huge onshore winter storm surf. These are just my thoughts based on 14 years of kiting experience, you don't have to agree with me. I offer the benefits of this experience to help others.

DM

nah DM, I totally agree with what you said...
the quote was quoting fingerbone's post!

because boards are disposable...
sure its gonna suck to see a $500 piece of foam get pounded on the rocks, but i'd rather that then the cons of the leash.

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surfingboye said..
nah DM, I totally agree with what you said...
the quote was quoting fingerbone's post!

because boards are disposable...
sure its gonna suck to see a $500 piece of foam get pounded on the rocks, but i'd rather that then the cons of the leash.

hmmm good call on the no leg rope... dont use one but always considered to use one if in sketchy surf spot but thinking about the amount of times my board gets swept over my head or bar and reading this discussion on the legrope getting wrapped around my lines really gives me the heeby jeebies

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THE DONG said...

surfingboye said..
nah DM, I totally agree with what you said...
the quote was quoting fingerbone's post!

because boards are disposable...
sure its gonna suck to see a $500 piece of foam get pounded on the rocks, but i'd rather that then the cons of the leash.

hmmm good call on the no leg rope... dont use one but always considered to use one if in sketchy surf spot but thinking about the amount of times my board gets swept over my head or bar and reading this discussion on the legrope getting wrapped around my lines really gives me the heeby jeebies

Plus you'd probably loose a board and get someone you know to shape you a new one so you could paint it the Colours of the gay pride flag! Let's face it you don't use a leggy because they don't make them in vivid purple!

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absimmons said..
hi all
i see a lot of experoinced kited using surfboards with normal surfboard leg ropes.

Leave the leggies to the experienced guys.

unless you are kitesurfing a rocky shore its not worth the risk. Let it go when you stack and just half loop your kite to catch up to it. Your board is gonna be the last thing on your mind if you drop your kite in the waves anyway.

play it safe and leave it on your paddleboard.

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juicerider said..




I Have no opinion on leashes, but just thought I'd leave this here

id like to offer medical aid to her gash