Hi Bandit Kiters

I absolutely love my Bandit 4 Kites but yesterday the bar on my 12 m broke. It is a 2011, as are the others, so the bar has lasted just over 12 months (just out of warranty). It begs the question. When will the others break (I have 3)?Fortunately it was only blowing 12-14knts so no damage to me or other kiters/spectators.

The problem with where is has broken is that you couldn't have checked/noticed that it was about to break.

I'm interested to know if anyone has had a similar problem?

I'm also interested to know how F-One and their distributors respond to this because it is potentially a serious safety flaw in a product they have already had one recall on.

I'll keep you posted.

Have seen alot of corrosion on b4 bars . Why the hell would they use aluminum when carbon is stronger /lighter and corrosion resistant ....it's not as if they are a cheap ass kites

Hey Gregg

Found this.

Wednesday, November 16, 2011 - 09:45 - FONE Bandit 4 Bar Recall - we are replacing all FONE Bandit 4 bars under warranty due to corrosion on the bars ... please contact me (bruce@ocean2air.co.za) so we can arrange this. The Bandit 4 Bar will be replaced with a new Bandit 5 bar !!

On this site. ocean2air.co.za/news/

Hang on, stop the press- you say you have had the bar for just over a year!

Then on November 16, 2011 they issue a recall...(15months ago)

So did Bandit keep selling bars, full knowing there was a problem? – did retailers, not know? Or worse, not care?

Or have you had the bar for much longer than 12 months.

Sounds a tad like QANTAS selling airfares whilst full well knowing they were grounding the airliner. Ill wait for the facts to come out before I make any conclusion.

I'm interested to hear your response.

It's 2012

Saw a 2012 one that was corroding yesterday, GB at my local has one.

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Underoath said...

Then on November 16, 2011 they issue a recall...(15months ago)

You know it's 2012 right? So that makes it 3 months ago.

Yeah my bad. Make sure you give me a red thumb.

just curious, how is that piece of ally secured to the bar? is there a small screw, bolt or some other fastener in the base of the broken part, is it glued or is all part of the same casting and one piece of metal?

I took the thing apart last night. It is a moulded piece of alloy with a hole through it so the plastic can "mould" through it.

You'd expect a clean break (i.e. like a ceramic break) but it appears that the 2 broken pieces don't fit together as well as you'd think.

For years I was involved with corrosion in various metals in the aircraft industry.
Your photo could be clearer but from looking at it, as far as corrosion is concerned, that's the way it happens in alloy.

As you said, it was fortunate the wind was light when it happened.
I'll keep out of the politics of what should be done (forum rules) but hopefully F-one will look after you.

This is what they are supposed to look like.

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Subculture said...

For years I was involved with corrosion in various metals in the aircraft industry.
Your photo could be clearer but from looking at it, as far as corrosion is concerned, that's the way it happens in alloy.

Interesting.

Any thoughts / speculation on why it broke at that spot and not further up where the metal was narrower?

(just curious as I have no idea about that sort of stuff)

The metal is wider at the base of the bar because that is where the highest moment (force) is applied. Unfortunately it is also at the bottom of the plastic sleeve where it is difficult to remove all salt water after a session and therefor exposes it to more corrosion. It definitely appears to be a design fault. It's a pity as they are pretty good bars to use.

Galah,
As mentioned earlier, I've only got the two out of focus photos to go by – you'd really need a proper macro lens to get it right. The drawing helps too though.

You are right in wondering why it didn't break further up where it was narrower.

Here's the way I see it: It looks like the first problem has been salt water ingress down to the base of the plastic sheath. That would have started the corrosion process. The area right down at the breakage would have been highly unlikely to ever dry fully, whereas further up, it would have been more likely to dry if stored for a while. Corrosion loves a damp, dark area that never dries out.. [}:)] Left to sit, ultimately the whole area would have become corroded and essentially turned to dust..

You will notice at the outsides of the break point, corrosion eating more into that area than further up. The drilled hole provided the final weakness at the break point.

Then there's forces at work too boys.. For the break, think lever arm and fulcrum; the greatest sideways stress would have been right down at the breakage point. If you imagine your bar ends as you crank a big turn the steering lines will exert a lot of sideways force in conjunction with the obvious direct pull.

Also, if you look at the eye that the back line attaches to in one photo and the drawing, you will notice it is offset. (strange design..) That in itself will exert a sideways shearing force even under a direct (straight) pull with no steering forces applied. Ultimately it was just a matter of time.

Phew! I'm off to bed now..

EDIT - Damn! I could have got an earlier sleep if I'd noticed Harty's reply before, instead of after typing.. Hey, it's late, I must be more tired than I thought Sorry mate, didn't realise you already tackled it

On behalf of the F-one importer M8kite, they will replace any corroded bars they can, and are lobbying F-one for certainty. If you have a bar or are concerned simply send F-one serial no. to email@m8kite.com

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Nathan SKS said...

On behalf of the F-one importer M8kite, they will replace any corroded bars they can, and are lobbying F-one for certainty. If you have a bar or are concerned simply send F-one serial no. to email@m8kite.com

Nice picture. Is that blue steel or magnum?

Putting aside the bar issues.anyone else had problems with the b4 canopy?
I know of 3 separate 12 m b4's which have torn in half after minor crashes into the water? 3 just at our local beach , all the same size kite , different owners , torn in half in exactly the same spot all after minor crashes , is this just a coincidence?

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Subculture said...

Phew! I'm off to bed now..

Thanks for the writeup - interesting read

My B4 bar is also corroding. Shop and distributor have been great, new bar on the way.

Update - I received a new bar in the mail today. Thanks Mat. The Australian distributor has been great sorting this out (as you can see from Nathan's post above). I'll replace this one and then when the other bars arrive I'll get them sorted out.

BTW - I did get a response back from F-One directly. They suggested that I contact M8kite which I had done.

I'll let you know if anythign further tranpires.

@M8

Is this something people with B5's need to worry about?

Yep if you've a b5 the bar is basically the same and will suffer the same I urge anyone with one of the4 or5 bar to check them out, I told a local to check his out and he snapped them with his hands,just like breaking a twig, both bars, m8 have promised to replace them but said that the new one is likely to do the same,not bagging the brand just check them for safetys sake

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Rattlehead said...

Putting aside the bar issues.anyone else had problems with the b4 canopy?
I know of 3 separate 12 m b4's which have torn in half after minor crashes into the water? 3 just at our local beach , all the same size kite , different owners , torn in half in exactly the same spot all after minor crashes , is this just a coincidence?

I know of a 9m as well

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junglist said...

@M8

Is this something people with B5's need to worry about?

Not sure how legit this is. It is from another forum on same issue.
(quote)
well, you are not the only one, the same happen to me and to every one that kite on salt water, The problem is than in the rush of selling the B4, the bar was already late and they forget to anodized. I get in contact with my local dealer and they replace it immediately with a b5 bar that is anodized.

Heard of the new name F1 are calling their bars................ "THE ASPRO BAR"

just add water and watch it disolve!

One of our local guys had his b4 bar snap in half a couple of days ago , his words were " it just snapped like a carrot " ,this is a very dangerous defect ,anyone using one of these bars in salt water would be advised to change it out .