2 examples of this at my local during the last month
1 had 4 lessons and hadn't been told about the wind window/ direction
Hence he travelled 300mtrs in the shallows directly upwind from his kite playing Roley poley amongst the long weekend holiday makers
No 2 hadn't been show any launch methods after 2 lessons and sat there waiting for someone to show him( me)
But hey they were sold all the latest gear
If your a school that teaches
Then the least you can do is teach properly
Before you release your latest prodigy onto our beaches

What are going through these kite instructors heads?

Should name the schools so they keep their standards up.

come on.... i do not believe for a second an instructor forgot to teach the wind window. seriously the students become very very routine very quickly. only thing instructors accidently skip is certain techniques or in a group session theyll carve off a chunk to the benefit of the more progressing student (often the boyfriend in a couple lesson or child in a family session (god parents suck)) the wind window?!?! impossible. that is as automated as saying hello my name is blahrdyblarhblarh i wil be your instructor today

the students were simply to occupied at the start of the lesson with eachother or putting on gear or takeing in the surroundings or simply just a bit to nervous to retain the information.

a half decent instructor would of got the student to EXPLAIN to them what the wind window was so that they were certain they could move on with analysis/qr's etc etc


the 2 lessons and not knowing how to launch i can believe... probably nill wind days and the school was demanding to teach so the instructor did theyre best by miraculously getting the kite in the air in sub 10 knot conditions. TWICE the students then went **** this bull**** im not bothering with a third lesson this ****s easy (having done 2 light wind lessons) and got themselves into strife. that is why i tell schools to eat a bag of dicks if they want me to teach ANY student in sub 15 knot winds. TWICE. you get ONE light wind lesson the next 2 are in appropriate winds or i go hungry and you save your money.

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Gfly said...
What are going through these kite instructors heads?

Should name the schools so they keep their standards up.

It's not the instructors IMHO, it's the schools
If you trade as a school it's your responsibility
Not your instructor
I could name one of the schools due to specific equipment
The other would between 2 schools
I looked up their credentials and reviews by people who wouldn't know the difference between good and bad tuition

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Kozzie said...
come on.... i do not believe for a second an instructor forgot to teach the wind window. seriously the students become very very routine very quickly. only thing instructors accidently skip is certain techniques or in a group session theyll carve off a chunk to the benefit of the more progressing student (often the boyfriend in a couple lesson or child in a family session (god parents suck)) the wind window?!?! impossible. that is as automated as saying hello my name is blahrdyblarhblarh i wil be your instructor today

the students were simply to occupied at the start of the lesson with eachother or putting on gear or takeing in the surroundings or simply just a bit to nervous to retain the information.

a half decent instructor would of got the student to EXPLAIN to them what the wind window was so that they were certain they could move on with analysis/qr's etc etc


the 2 lessons and not knowing how to launch i can believe... probably nill wind days and the school was demanding to teach so the instructor did theyre best by miraculously getting the kite in the air in sub 10 knot conditions. TWICE the students then went **** this bull**** im not bothering with a third lesson this ****s easy (having done 2 light wind lessons) and got themselves into strife. that is why i tell schools to eat a bag of dicks if they want me to teach ANY student in sub 15 knot winds. TWICE. you get ONE light wind lesson the next 2 are in appropriate winds or i go hungry and you save your money.

After spending a bit of time with the bloke , he asked me to spend some time giving him tuition ( paid)
Generally I've found a limited budget can sometimes relate to poor and limited schooling
But his 3 kites and board said he wasn't short of money
I'm in it for the sport not the money

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cauncy said..
I'm in it for the sport not the money

well thats lucky because there is no money :)

you will burn out with your generosity eventually tho. dont get me wrong ill still jump in to avoid most accidents for free. and allways if a chance of permanent damage or hurting a bystander etc but after ahwhile.... the little accidents... like a good hotlaunch draging...you just watch it happen.... no amount of instruction can replace the lessons learnt the hard way.



OH!!! one more thing!! end of season right? old mate would of got 3 new kites as a wicked bargain AND!!! little known fact! instructors are ****ing OVER IT by the end of the season. schools keep insisting on teaching one month early and one month later then they should that last month can be pretty disheartening and ****. if its a good school the instructor may have had some personal time to progress on theyre own kitesurfing. if its a **** school (weird definition i know but hear me out as some best schools are busy 24/7) then that instructor is still performing trick wise where they were at the very start of the season and they have a dawning moment where they could of just worked a casual minimum wage job and got better at kiteing AND more money in same amount of time. taaahhhh daaaaa queue the slander this school and that school amongst instructors at the bonfire gatherings rant.

employers just need to be more accepting of theyre staffs goals and staff need to be more honest to theyre employers about what they hope to gain.... its an age thing. the kids get chewed up and spat out

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cauncy said...
But his 3 kites and board said he wasn't short of money

What kites and board did he have?

Which one rads
One would certainly point to a set school ,
One would point to 2
Either I won't mention, I have thought of an email to said schools though,
After a good chat the guy who said he had 4 lessons actually mentioned that the school hadn't run through many of the basics that I'd see as priority, especially on the water
I had a look at a guy teaching recently up here
Kite was set at fastest steering and at most powered setting on the kite, interesting in powered winds for a very new beginner, was my thinking
I've seen instructors in the water, behind their pupils body dragging, and I've seen instructors out kiting whilst their pupils are getting dragged offshore,

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Kozzie said..

cauncy said..
I'm in it for the sport not the money

well thats lucky because there is no money :)

You work for Briskites?

Actually there is one school that can't teach - well they can teach, but have very weird ways about it.

This one is in Melbourne (won't name location or school), but I saw them teaching a student the power of the kite in a way that left me gobsmacked and disturbed to be honest.

The teacher and a teacher's aid were holding the kite by the bridles and wing tips. No lines were connected to the kite. Winds were light (thankfully), but I looked at this and thought - hmmm ok... that lady student is going away knowing that you can control the power of a kite by holding the kite directly!

I hope she has fingers of steel.

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cauncy said..
Which one rads
One would certainly point to a set school ,
One would point to 2
Either I won't mention, I have thought of an email to said schools though,
After a good chat the guy who said he had 4 lessons actually mentioned that the school hadn't run through many of the basics that I'd see as priority, especially on the water
I had a look at a guy teaching recently up here
Kite was set at fastest steering and at most powered setting on the kite, interesting in powered winds for a very new beginner, was my thinking
I've seen instructors in the water, behind their pupils body dragging, and I've seen instructors out kiting whilst their pupils are getting dragged offshore,

How about both....?

Just imagine these two guys x 50.....then you may understand the number of numpties kiting at metro locations, especially the pond or woodies. Then you may understand why some metro locals get frustrated and "have a whinge" as some put it............

Then you have to look at the kite schools themselves. They have alot to answer for.....I know its all about the $$$ and everyone has to make some.........but ethics shouldnt be thrown out the window....... teaching where they know they shouldnt.....sending first time students out into crowds amongst hungry freestylers..... "fast tracked" learning.....then there are some instructors which are just plain retarded......others when not teaching so rude, obnoxious.... aggro even......

Schools seriously need to set ground rules and a code of conduct for their instructors in and out of lessons. I know the schools I definitely wont recommend to prospective students (or tell them to avoid) and for the most part it's because of incidents with their instructors.....

There may well be rogue schools out there with lazy or overworked instructors, however I think most of them would wish to stay in business and keep customers coming back (the more prominent schools that is)

I think there are many people who can not afford to kite, yet still really want to get into it.

As witnessed by the second hand market dropping considerably and people still complaining it's too expensive in their often very strongly worded opinions!

So you will find many people not buying what they consider 'expensive' lessons. Instead just getting their friends to teach them or you tubing it themselves.

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heyjoe said..


So you will find many people not buying what they consider 'expensive' lessons. Instead just getting their friends to teach them or you tubing it themselves.

And most likely none of your mates are insured either!

No sorry, home and contents insurance does not cover 3rd party damages outside of your home.

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Loftywinds said...
Actually there is one school that can't teach - well they can teach, but have very weird ways about it.

This one is in Melbourne (won't name location or school), but I saw them teaching a student the power of the kite in a way that left me gobsmacked and disturbed to be honest.

The teacher and a teacher's aid were holding the kite by the bridles and wing tips. No lines were connected to the kite. Winds were light (thankfully), but I looked at this and thought - hmmm ok... that lady student is going away knowing that you can control the power of a kite by holding the kite directly!

I hope she has fingers of steel.

An instructor holding a kite by its bridles in order to describe said kite and its parts is a valid teaching tool.
Not though for anything else.

Basically two types of people who become instructors: 1. Someone who likes kiting and wants to get people out there, 2. Someone who wants to make as much money for the season. I've come across as many bad instructors as good ones. 50/50

If someone is paying you $200+ and entrusting their kite safety to you, good enough just doesn't cut it.

One would think kite schools have the basic responsibility to train their instructors and ensure a minimum teaching standard is kept among their instructors…unfortunately in reality it’s almost never the case. As a result you can have a big difference in teaching quality within the same school, depending on each instructor’s skill, level of training and previous experience.

The majority of instructors are on working-holidays visas and you’re lucky if they do an entire season in the same school. From experience I can tell you that training instructors to achieve a higher level of instructing is no small task and requires a lot of time, effort, and discipline…hence why most schools won’t bother. Every instructor needs quality mentoring and training after their instructor course, but it’s very rare they actually get it…

All that schools really care about is that students are safe and having a great time. As said above, the average student won’t ever notice the difference between an average lesson and a great lesson, as long as they are having fun.

This may come as a surprise, but the teaching standards outlined in instructor courses are actually fairly strict and in depth. If you wanted to follow these standards by the book with an average student, you would have to teach them one-on-one for at least 12 hours! Only about 10-20% of students will actually book more than 5-6 hours of lessons. This means schools are putting pressure on instructors so students can learn to ride in within those 5-6 hours and often in groups!...which of course can only be achieved by cutting corners (such as skipping some theory stuff, safety stuff, etc.)…This might be hard to believe but I’ve worked with schools who refused to teach (and refuse that I teach) practical self-rescue with students. I've seen students who were taught to water start but have actually never setup a kite on their own!

The future of kite instructing and teaching standardization is within online preparation/training. It may take some time until we get there, but if this happens all schools would share the same online program to all students signing up for lessons across the country, so whether a student is learning in Brisbane or Perth they can all benefit from the same knowledge and learn about theory (wind, wind window, etc.), technical knowledge, terminology, safety precautions and skills as well as prepare or refresh practical skills (kite setup, launch/land, etc.).

Christian

Well written Christian.

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cbulota said..
This may come as a surprise, but the teaching standards outlined in instructor courses are actually fairly strict and in depth. If you wanted to follow these standards by the book with an average student, you would have to teach them one-on-one for at least 12 hours! Only about 10-20% of students will actually book more than 5-6 hours of lessons. This means schools are putting pressure on instructors so students can learn to ride in within those 5-6 hours and often in groups!...which of course can only be achieved by cutting corners (such as skipping some theory stuff, safety stuff, etc.)…This might be hard to believe but I’ve worked with schools who refused to teach (and refuse that I teach) practical self-rescue with students....
Christian

No. That does not surprise me in the least.

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[b]cbulota said..

Good stuff

Seriously Christian , you could make a living out of this

the sport has been around for 18+ years now so has teaching, many teaching manuals have been written.
it is common sense to follow the important learning steps for any new activity, particularly dangerous ones
every kiter 'sharing their teaching tips' would be aware of the process, tho some not so good to pass them on
each person learning should know what they covered and what they have not!

maybe someone can post a link showing the basic learning stages that need to be ticked off to learn properly??

ps. the lesson wind conditions and personal safety play a majorly huge part
some students understand and do the process, some do not, may feel unsafe or whatever and give up

I was in a fortunate position in that there were two kite schools at my disposal to learn here in Mozambique. One school's full course was 8 hours and the other one 10 hours. For the same price. And judging based on the information that was given on the website one school made a much better impression on me than the other.

I must be honest. The school I used is a single instructor with an assistant. Both were very capable. I got a good safety briefing and also spent a good amount on theory. So I was very satisfied with my instructor. So at the end of the 10 hours I was able to consistently keep my place and even ride upwind and make some small jumps. Currently I have progressed to making jumps in the range of 10 feet and some board grabs.

So what I am getting to is that there are some schools that are good and the few bad ones tend to put people off from all schools. I might be wrong but just my two cents worth.