Hi Breezers, got snow trip booked mid July and thinking of taking a kite for something different, any places near Jindabyne suitable to give it a go? Thinking of taking 8m neo or 12m peak. TIA.

Hi Scotty,

I used to work at Perisher as a snowboard instructor for 2 winters and brought my kites along with me hoping to get lots of snow kiting done. Despite my best intentions and my very limited time off, I managed to get a few crappy sessions right next to Perisher Valley in an area called Pipers Gap as per the image below. Works in NE to SE winds as long as you have good enough snow coverage. This would be your most easily accessible spot but as long as you don't have any high expectations. Be careful with kids and families usually playing around this area.

EDIT: Found this snow kite guide on the kiteboarding NSW website: www.kiteboardingnsw.org.au/snow/

they mentioned to avoid snow kiting there


I played around in the back of Guthega across the snowy river (image below) with limited success: good snow but not much wind. Obviously this is full on backcountry so wouldn't recommend you go there by yourself.


You'd get better terrain and conditions at the back of Thredbo's ski resort summit. I never snow kited there but been there and saw the potential. It's a fairly ''popular'' snow kite area so I'm sure you'll get good input from others in here.

Just be careful if you snow kite in higher elevations as you'll often have the strongest and gustiest winds there. The weather can get pretty wild at times.

As you can see from the location guide, the majority of spots require hiking / touring access, so hopefully you are prepared for that.

I'm sure you can hook up with someone who has experience and show you around when you're there.

Follow the Kosi kiters facebook group here: www.facebook.com/groups/632312726800269/

PS: New-Zealand has much better snow kiting :)

Christian - KiteBud

Hear over the last two years, it is not unusual to see kites when looking from the top of mt Perisher toward charlottes.

there is a road from Perisher to charlottes used by lots of cross country skiers and the odd transport to charlottes pass ski resort. (Is it 14km along the road?)

In the unlikely event of an injury, help would be far closer and more accessible, than somewhere off caroles out the back of Thredbo. perhaps leaving a car at dead horse gap would be sensible incase of injury or wind dropping if kiting from Thredbo.

I have never kited in snow, the thought makes me cold. On the plus side I would be wearing a dry suit!

Hi Scotty,
The top of Thredbo is an easy option, and you can leave your gear in the car and have a look for wind at the top of the basin t-bar. If it's on, get your gear. Otherwise, you'll find you waste a lot of days with bad conditions. Lots of times, it's hit and miss, either way too windy, dead calm or cloudy. You want reasonably clear Skys and lightish winds when starting. When it is on, it's great. There is a big valley to play around and heaps of area to go adventure and another basin above Ramshead, with loads of cool ways up. You can also start from the top of Karels.
I've tried the near the car park at Perisher, and it was terrible. Winds were NW that day and super gusty, maybe better in different winds.
The rolling grounds above Guthega is reasonable too, but it takes a fair walk to get above the trees (1hr moving fast), but is free. You'd want a split board or snowshoes.
Watch out for wind shadows; try to pick your way through the mountains as it's a pain when your kite drops.

Here's a vid I shot ages back from Thredbo to Kosi that gives you an idea of the area.


Good luck, I hope you score some good sessions!

Daz

Great video! Keep in mind these days the gear is heaps lighter, you can take a little backpack with two sub 1kg snow kites, a ultralight bar and micro-harness in your pack and just go and check it out. And the new single skin snow kites (like Gin Shaman3) have a huge range and instant power-kill etc, with two kites you can cover most conditions. Craig at snow kites Australia knows all about the gear and the Vic Snow areas, hit him up if you want some info. Have fun!

Hey guys,

I grew up on skis and got into kiting a few years back as well and ever since have dreamed about combining the 2 together around the NSW ski resorts somehow if possible.

I'm sure this question has been asked somewhere before but I'll throw it out here again anyway...

I notice in the video that you are all using what look to be foil kites, so, can you use your normal water / surf kites in the snow? I.e, My quiver consists of 10 and 12m ozone catalysts and I would be curious to know if I could use these same kites and kite sizes to kite in the snow.

I'm heading down in September and would love to give it a crack with someone who could help me get up and going for the first time - payment in beer can be negotiated

Hi Deecee,

Inflatable kites work really well in the snow. They typically have a wider wind range, handle gusty / strong winds better and have more ''depower''.

However, you don't need as much power on the snow. For example, let's say you need a 12m kite for 15-20 knots of wind on a twin-tip, you can easily cover that wind range with a 7m or 8m kite on the snow.

10 and 12m inflatable kites are too close together for snow kiting. I usually go 7m + 12m and cover a wind range from 7 to 30 knots. Cold winds are denser and therefore develop more power for the same wind speed compared to hot summer breezes.

Foil kites have the advantage of packing small, being light, quicker and easier to setup. However, they collapse easily in gusty winds and typically have less wind range. A collapsing foil kite can easily lead to inversions and bridle tangles which can get messy and dangerous. The newer single skin foils kites are extremely light which makes them ideal for sub 12 knots days on the snow.

One of the downsides of inflatables is when you have subzero temperatures, the one-way inflation valve trap can have trouble closing shut when you remove your inflation hose, which can make it quite painful to get your kite to the right pressure.

If you snow-kite only a few days/weeks per year, it's hard to justify spending money on foil kites you might only use then.

hope this helps

Christian

Select to expand quote

cbulota said..
Hi Deecee,

Inflatable kites work really well in the snow. They typically have a wider wind range, handle gusty / strong winds better and have more ''depower''.

However, you don't need as much power on the snow. For example, let's say you need a 12m kite for 15-20 knots of wind on a twin-tip, you can easily cover that wind range with a 7m or 8m kite on the snow.

10 and 12m inflatable kites are too close together for snow kiting. I usually go 7m + 12m and cover a wind range from 7 to 30 knots. Cold winds are denser and therefore develop more power for the same wind speed compared to hot summer breezes.

Foil kites have the advantage of packing small, being light, quicker and easier to setup. However, they collapse easily in gusty winds and typically have less wind range. A collapsing foil kite can easily lead to inversions and bridle tangles which can get messy and dangerous. The newer single skin foils kites are extremely light which makes them ideal for sub 12 knots days on the snow.

One of the downsides of inflatables is when you have subzero temperatures, the one-way inflation valve trap can have trouble closing shut when you remove your inflation hose, which can make it quite painful to get your kite to the right pressure.

If you snow-kite only a few days/weeks per year, it's hard to justify spending money on foil kites you might only use then.

hope this helps

Christian

There are several types of foil kites, some work well on snow, others are strongly recommended for water use only. Examples of kites suitable for snow are dedicated snow kites, like the Ozone Sub Zero. This kite is open cell with 5th line and internal safety system and not designed for water use. There are several other manufacturers who make open cell foil kites for land or snow use.
Then there are convertible kites like the Ozone Hyperlink which has the ability to be open or closed cell. When this kite is used on land it can be easily converted to use a 5th line safety system which collapses the kite instantly when the primary chicken loop release is activated. When its used on water the 5th line is removed and it is then a single front line flag out kite, like almost all inflatables.
Dedicated twin skin foil snow kites have at least as much depower and wind range as inflatable kites. These kites are extremely popular on snow because they are safer and easier to use than inflatable kites. If they are used to ride up a mountain, the safety system kills all power when at the summit, they can be quickly wound up and stuffed into their purpose-built backpack bags, and then the kiter ski's or snowboards back down. Ski's are the choice of most snowkiters, especially when used to ride up and ski down. Ski's are easier to use with kites in the snow because you can still sidestep with skis on and launch your kite, this is much more difficult when strapped into your snowboard bindings. Snowboards are more popular on flat areas and the best option is to have a kite launcher handy.

Single skin foil kites from Ozone Flysurfer and Gin also work extremely well but lack the power and turn speed of twin skin open cell foil kites. Twin skin open cell foils are designed to turn fast and with power so that riders can easily climb steep sections and narrow gullies by downlooping and flying figure 8 horizontally.

The reason closed cell foil kites are not recommended and rarely used on snow is that they are the kites that are more prone to frontal collapse, and single front line safety systems can damage this type of kite when used in gusty winds on land.

Lastly, inflatable kites do work well on snow, but dedicated foil snow kites are better. They can be a bit trickier to launch on snow because the kite has a tendency to slide, but they are definitely doable.

One thing that should not be overlooked is a dedicated snow kite harness that is designed to fit over your clothing, water harnesses can be quite restrictive and do not fit well over your clothes. Test how your harness fits over your ski gear before you leave to go to the snow.
Always let someone know where you are going and carry at least a mobile phone (check there is reception!)
You'll tend to want to kite in the snow in lighter winds under 20 knots because as the wind strength increases visibility decreases, so take larger kites and on the really windy days do something else.

The right tools for the job are always better and inflatable kites are a bit of a compromise on land or snow (but definitely doable and fun)

Goodwinds
Steve McCormack

Hey Christian and Steve

Thanks heaps for the info from both of you. I don't know if I'm ready to fork out $$$ on any new kites for the snow just yet - regardless of whether its a dedicated foil kite or a smaller size inflatable. One way or another I'm going to be paying $160+ just to get up the mountain to then ski off the back somewhere for a kite, so seeing as how I'm going to be paying a ridiculous amount for the "privilege" to be in the resort, I can only justify using my existing kite gear if practicable, and if the conditions allow for it.

That being said - I'm pretty keen to give it a go, so based on both your posts, I'm guessing the next steps are:
* Take both kites and keep my fingers crossed for decent conditions - probably more likely to use the 10m rather than the 12m
* Make sure my harness works around my ski gear
* Don't go solo - Kosi kiters seem to be the "go to" gang for a hook up and a hand getting going for the first time, otherwise, I'm open to any other suggestions from anyone else out there that is keen to exchange snow kite experience for beer

Cheers

I've been thinking about giving this a try, too. Jennie Milton has some good info about it on her FB page (search for Adrenajen). Also see kitethrills.com/pages/snow-kite-and-speed-riding-sept-2021 for some good info.