Hi all, I bought a used speed 4 lotus after seeing some people on speed 3's ripping it up in lighter wind than my 16m lei could fly in.
I think i was ripped off because the cloth appears to be normal ripstop nylon. Hoping somebody can definitely tell me whether it is or not looking at this picture. Thanks for your time.

you might have gotten the speed 4 10m deluxe version: www.pbkiteboarding.com/Kiteboarding_Snowkiting_Equipment/Flysurfer_Kites_Canada_USA/Flysurfer_Kiteboarding_Snowkiting_Kites_Canada_USA.html

I have a Speed 3 21m which is made of the deluxe cloth. The white fabric in your picture looks very much the same as the deluxe cloth I have, not the lotus fabric. But I can't be certain of course.

Hi. You should be able to check the exact model and serial number on the kite - there is a plaque on the kite that contains this information

I think it is a 10m Deluxe Speed4 from what I can see. The Lotus models are the ones with the different fabric.

Has it been repaired - some of the white parts appear more white then others ? Or is that just the light in the photo.

James, I have yet to find any identification on the kite. It is an 18m and i havnt had a completely windless day to be able to thoroughly inspect it. The entire kite has that yellow discoloration. I am wondering if it is stain or fading from too much sun. I am thinking it is a lotus kite, and there has been so much sun exposure that the cloth doesnt look shiny like i expected lotus to look like.

Maybe give me a ring if you like. the Lotus cloth looks very different to the deluxe fabric - it's very smooth and plasticky. That definitely does not look like the Lotus fabric.

I'm surprised if you've managed to buy a second hand, discoloured 18 in Australia as they have not been out that long.

Hey Boardtoloop.

From the picture, this is the Speed 10m 4 DLX ,The cloth is definitely the Deluxe Cloth not the Lotus. The Lotus has a complete different color scheme.
You have been ripped off big time. The I.D Tag is on one the wingtip, the Size is printed on both outer sides of the wingtip. Where did you get this Kite from?


Cheers

I have to correct myself, in the picture there it looks like a jet flap, but the Speed 4 DLX 10m has no jet flaps.
But the cloth loos rather like the Dlx

Yeah looks like you have been ripped off.

Wait...

All Lotus cloth kites are Speed4, but not all Speed4 are Lotus. Did you see "Speed4" in the ad and just assume it was Lotus?

Update on my verification question. Thx all for your responses. There is no identification on the kite. It came in a flysurfer 18m lotus bag with serial number on it. Kite was bought on ebay from virginia beach, usa. I took it out to a large open grassy area in a park to fly it in 8 to 12mph. Got it launched anchored to a line. After flying it about 10 sec the wind suddenly picked up and the kite flew overhead. The bar was completely unsheeted and i tried to push it out more when BOOM! The bar broke in half and 3 of 4 flying lines broke. Manual says don't launch depowerd and i was just not thinking the wind could pick up that much so i thought i could ride it out with the kite at the edge of the window. So i have alot more respect for the kites power and when i should hit that quick release A thermal had been forecast for about 3 hours later and when it had gone through it was a perfect light breeze for trying the kite out. Sigh

I don't like the sound of what you've written - no serial number or markings, the bar broke, flying lines broke ? Bought on EBay ?

All production Flysurfer kites come with serial numbers on a small label - my Lotus have this on the inside of one of the front vents. They are pretty clearly marked. The Bar and safety are all clearly Flysurfer products aswell. Do the graphics match the genuine product ? From what you've described, it doesn't sound like you have the real thing.

Do Ebay give you some buyer protection - you might like to try getting your money back.

Sounds dodgy all round.

Really sorry to hear your issues Boardtoloop,

The sounds of it looks really dodgy. Flysurfer is making safe and good products for decade.

- First could you send a picture of the entire kite. That would help us finding out a bit more about the product you are riding. Obviously the bag is from a different kite.
- When checking the canopy, did you find that the black, white and blue material feel the same or are they different ?
- When checking the lotus canopy, it should feel really different that usual common canopy material. It's PU coated and looks more like latex material. Hope this help you to check.

Ebay/Paypal are usually really good in protecting the customer. Send a request.

Thanks James, with your info i found the serial # and model in the front vent. It only says Speed 4 so i am going to try to verify with Flysurfer that it is not lotus.

Thanks Ikon, the white canopy cloth does not look at all different from what my other kites are made from. The black and blue does but i am wondering if that is just the coloring. Hopefully now that i have the Serial # i can get a definitive answer from flysurfer.

I am now trying to see what ebay will do with their warranty if the item is not as listed. Would like your opinion from looking at the 2 pics (top and underside of canopy) whether this qualifies as a lightly used kite with no stains or fading. Thanks

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boardtoloop said..
Update on my verification question. Thx all for your responses. There is no identification on the kite. It came in a flysurfer 18m lotus bag with serial number on it. Kite was bought on ebay from virginia beach, usa. I took it out to a large open grassy area in a park to fly it in 8 to 12mph. Got it launched anchored to a line. After flying it about 10 sec the wind suddenly picked up and the kite flew overhead. The bar was completely unsheeted and i tried to push it out more when BOOM! The bar broke in half and 3 of 4 flying lines broke. Manual says don't launch depowerd and i was just not thinking the wind could pick up that much so i thought i could ride it out with the kite at the edge of the window. So i have alot more respect for the kites power and when i should hit that quick release A thermal had been forecast for about 3 hours later and when it had gone through it was a perfect light breeze for trying the kite out. Sigh

You "got it launched anchored to a line?" If you set up a tethered launch, and a good solid gust hit, then you would expect "Boom! Bar broke in half and 3 of 4 lines broke . Sounds like thats possibly what happened. As far as I know,you can't tether launch a foil like you can do an LEI (on edge of the window.) If you hot launched it straight down wind and tethered to a fixed object in gusty wind overpowered, you are lucky it was only the kite got mutilated and not you. This would be an easy mistake to make if unfamiliar with flying foils.

I used to buy my flysurfer kites from Virginia Beach. The US importer is based there, his name is Ted Bautista. If he was the ebay seller I doubt it would be dodgy, he is a great guy. I'm a bit out of touch these days but I don't think the Lotus cloth can be printed on, this may explain why yours has no ID on it.

I am a WA dealer and my Lotus Kites all have a serial plaque on the canopy. I'm waiting to hear what the official repoonse is - the OP has contacted FS directly.

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Septic said..

boardtoloop said..
Update on my verification question. Thx all for your responses. There is no identification on the kite. It came in a flysurfer 18m lotus bag with serial number on it. Kite was bought on ebay from virginia beach, usa. I took it out to a large open grassy area in a park to fly it in 8 to 12mph. Got it launched anchored to a line. After flying it about 10 sec the wind suddenly picked up and the kite flew overhead. The bar was completely unsheeted and i tried to push it out more when BOOM! The bar broke in half and 3 of 4 flying lines broke. Manual says don't launch depowerd and i was just not thinking the wind could pick up that much so i thought i could ride it out with the kite at the edge of the window. So i have alot more respect for the kites power and when i should hit that quick release A thermal had been forecast for about 3 hours later and when it had gone through it was a perfect light breeze for trying the kite out. Sigh

You "got it launched anchored to a line?" If you set up a tethered launch, and a good solid gust hit, then you would expect "Boom! Bar broke in half and 3 of 4 lines broke . Sounds like thats possibly what happened. As far as I know,you can't tether launch a foil like you can do an LEI (on edge of the window.) If you hot launched it straight down wind and tethered to a fixed object in gusty wind overpowered, you are lucky it was only the kite got mutilated and not you. This would be an easy mistake to make if unfamiliar with flying foils.

Good point, I missed that.

You can tether land foils, but it's a tad dicey. I've had dozens go fine, then last month the wind was shifty and I missed the kite when I went to grab it. It flew back up to the zenith then... snapped the chicken loop in half. Kite flew over the beach, trees, across the road and into trees on the other side of the road, lines trailing across 2 lanes of traffic.

Thought I was pretty lucky that the only damage was the CL and the leaders I had to cut to free the lines....

Looking at the kite, it is dirty from launching on dirty sand perhaps? White fabric will do that. It does not look faded or too worn. I can see it's dirty on the wingtip, perhaps from launching from that wingtip. If you destroyed the bar and lines doing something silly, you can't be making the seller eat that. Where are you in the States? I learned on foils, though I eventually gravitated to inflatables. I teach kiting. More than happy to help you fix your kite and instruct you on the foil basics if you are on the West Coast. Foils are mean machines when overpowered. I love them on snow, so good for gliding. I think thats a great kite you have there.

Thanks for the offer Septic, I live on Lake Ontario in NY. At this point i am only hoping to get a line set that seller said he would get for me as i had pointed out some worn areas. Nice to hear you think canopy is just dirty and not faded. Flysurfer has not responded to my email so its nice to get some info from people who have experience with them. I am looking forward to getting the kite back together and finding a wide beach with a gentle breeze and no thermal in the forecast to try it out.

"Flysurfer" not responding to emails is weird. Did you email them at the .com site or the U.S. site? Cos Ted is often away and getting hold of him via email is tricky...

I posted a separate thread to explain why the FS Lotus is called 'Lotus'. If your kite does not do that to water then it's not a Lotus, it's either the DLX or Standard cloth.