Is there a kite shop in Perth that stocks these kites, looking at the speed 3 range any info would be great

Cheers

Don't know who stocks in Perth. I'm in nz. but I do have a 15m speed 3 dlx. what do you need to know?

I wanted to have a look at one, to see what the quality of the gear is like. I'm in the market for a light wind kite, I've seen a few guys out with them and was wanting to know how they bought them online or locally. The other light wind kites I was looking at are both ozone kites which I can get access to from my local shop, but wanted to check out the fly surfer before I made any decisions. What's the wind range like on your 15m speed 3 and what are the flying characteristics like from memory I think someone said they fly similar to an ozone edge, but any info would be great cheers Plummet. This probably should be in the gear reviews section, but anyway thanks for any help anyway.

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PRAWNDOG said..

I wanted to have a look at one, to see what the quality of the gear is like. I'm in the market for a light wind kite, I've seen a few guys out with them and was wanting to know how they bought them online or locally. The other light wind kites I was looking at are both ozone kites which I can get access to from my local shop, but wanted to check out the fly surfer before I made any decisions. What's the wind range like on your 15m speed 3 and what are the flying characteristics like from memory I think someone said they fly similar to an ozone edge, but any info would be great cheers Plummet. This probably should be in the gear reviews section, but anyway thanks for any help anyway.

19m edge give it a go, it wont disappoint!

OK.

I can give some info.

I also have a 13m 2010 7 strut edge and have flown a 2012 zephur.

At 82pies with wind rage for the 15m speed is up to 22 knots. to be fair 18+ knots is silly. The low end depends on the board and water conditions.

The speed is soooo freaken high aspect its not funny. It builds huge power with apparent wind and speed. Huge power with speed.... yes I repeated myself. That means you in light wind you need board speed to create power. So.... it works best on a flat water spot when you can crank some speed up. Then you can feel the train like power cranken in. In the waves,chop, swell it cant really build that power efficiently. So its not as good in the ocean as it is on the flat water.

Low end for me in ocean with chop, white wash, current etc is around 12 knots. This is with my rounded tipped mutant board. Its not the best light wind board. On the flat with my same board i'll be staying upwind sub 10 knots maybe 8?.

The kite is SLOW compared to lei's Very slow. I makes it very difficult in the waves. It also needs constant line tension. you cant run toward it and slack line the kite. That does not end well.

Power wise the 15m speed has more power than the 17 zephur and a heap more than my 13 edge. But in the ocean it doesn't really offer much more low end to my 13 edge as the edge can be flown faster and worked through and over the waves better.

Ok. So far it sounds pretty shiiit.... So why get one?

Glide! want to feel like you dangling from a paraglider with endless glide? this is the beast. It kicks my 13 edge for float/glide by a factor of 2 to 1. It really is astonishing how you simply float above the earth for so long and land so so softly. It is definitely a different experience to an lei in terms of float.

Launching/landing involves a different technique. But once you have it dialled its significantly faster than setting up an lei. Imagine no pumping at all. Walk onto the beach sand a wind tip let the kite flag out. close the vents unwind your lines (which you leave attached) at 45 deg. peel the kite off the deck and your launched. I can launch sub 3 minutes from getting my gear out of the car. Pack up is similar about 3 mins.

So if time is not on your side then super fast launch and land might be a real advantage.

Oh yeah upwind is better than anything you have tried before. Yes its better than the edge. Before all the edge lovers say No.....,! why don't speeds win light wind races? You can actually go a lot faster on an edge. The speed will have you churning upwind at a silly angle the edge will have you motoring a lot faster. Also the edge is way better down wind than the speed.

hehehe... not a very flowing review just observations as they fall from my head.

In short. If you want a fast launching flat water, up wind churning light wind gliding monster. Speed is for you.

Open ocean swell, waves, chop... look at the leis instead.

PS self rescue really isn't and option with the foil. If you like being miles of shore look at leis.

I am a big fan - I have a Speed 2 15m and a Pulse 2 8m, there is definitely a learning curve when first switching to foils, but I am a convert - for the right conditions. Funnily enough I mostly use the 15m with a surfboard at Scarborough - it wouldnt be my first choice for a downwinder, but if you want to ride waves and stay upwind in 10-12kts, no problem. Set up is real quick, and the feel is quite different to LEI's - much smoother power delivery. If you want to have a go PM me - happy to meet up for a demo.

I think you'll be horrified when you get to use a Flysurfer if you've never flown any kind of foil, you'll find them very strange indeed.

I'm a fan of them too, but you gotta use the right tool for the job to really enjoy them... lots of what Plummet said is true. I use mine on the choppy lake and they're magic. But my Speed3 12 doesn't really get used too much cos it's very on/off in the chop. When you boost though... jesus!

Things that really suck... stalling the kite and getting them twisted up. You can untwist them and you can even fly them back to the beach, twisted up. But every now and then, you have to swim. I've done it 3 times and it sucks. LEIs are better at that.

But the boosts... jesus! More wind, sir? Sure why not. JESUS! S3 15 wind range is as big as your balls.

They're crap in punchy wind - can be quite scary, cos they're just small paragliders and see above about jesus when the wind is gusty.

But my best kiting days have been probably 75% on my foils

Thanks everyone for your advice,this has been pretty intresting for me, I think I'll stick to an LEI, purely for the versatility factor. Time to demo the zephyr, you got to love buying new kites

Cheers All

Aw dude, still try one - you might be surprised. 15's and smaller are much easier to handle... just take a book or something with you so you've got something to do with all the time in the air

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PRAWNDOG said..

Thanks everyone for your advice,this has been pretty intresting for me, I think I'll stick to an LEI, purely for the versatility factor. Time to demo the zephyr, you got to love buying new kites

Cheers All

im pretty biased to the ozones, but the zephyr is a long way short on lightwind ability as the flysurfer,the 21 gets you going in very light wind compared to the zephyr which imo is only fun in the teens, ive seen plenty of guys buying a specialist lightwind kite then exspect to be boosting in 10 knts, sorry to say it just doesnt happen

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cauncy said..

PRAWNDOG said..

Thanks everyone for your advice,this has been pretty intresting for me, I think I'll stick to an LEI, purely for the versatility factor. Time to demo the zephyr, you got to love buying new kites

Cheers All

im pretty biased to the ozones, but the zephyr is a long way short on lightwind ability as the flysurfer,the 21 gets you going in very light wind compared to the zephyr which imo is only fun in the teens, ive seen plenty of guys buying a specialist lightwind kite then exspect to be boosting in 10 knts, sorry to say it just doesnt happen

The 19 Edge though and Flysurfer 21 are almost the same in LW performance, but the Edge actually turns quite well whereas the 21FS just takes forever. The point can be proven by looking at kite racing, no-one is using FS kites (at least no-one thats winning against the top LEI riders).
Comparing the Zephyr 17M to a 21M kite is not a fair comparison. Matching the 17M Zephyr/Edge with a decent low wind board like the Airush Sectors, or even one of the large LW TT's and you have a combo that will get a 75-80kg rider going well in winds from 8 knots.
Boosting in 10 knots, have to agree, that is nonsense. Cruising upwind and having fun getting some exercise definitely possible and something I see a lot of people really enjoying. Small jumps transitioning are possible on the Zephyr and a TT, but the emphasis is on small.
Smaller FS kites definitely boost well, at least as good as most well designed LEI's, larger foils do not boost as well as LEI's, they tend to go lower and longer though, definitely a bit more glide, but not by as much as some make out, maybe 10-20% better than most well designed LEI's (that will jump higher though).

One thing that just occured to me - I can confidently self launch and land my Speed 2 15 in light wind, which is handy because on light days there are generally no other kiters around. I am considering a Speed 3 21m for super light days, but probably should consider a 19 Edge before making a decision. Has anyone got any feedback on how self launching / landing goes in <10 kts on the Edge ?

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jamesperth said..

One thing that just occured to me - I can confidently self launch and land my Speed 2 15 in light wind, which is handy because on light days there are generally no other kiters around.

If I cant self launch (inflatable) in light winds - its too light to kite.. Light winds when self landing (inflatable) - awesome!

My old 7 strut edge is interesting to launch sub 10 knots. but if your are man of reverse launching knowledge then its easy peasy. just don't reverse launch around your average kitesurfer. they will freak out and think your CRAZY.

I agree with kitepower. lei's take you higher foils take you longer and lower.

But my experience is that the foils float a lot more than leis. a lot more.... I've tested the zephur back to back with the 15 manta and 15 flysurfer. To be fair it was light wind 12 knots max and I was landboarding on a sand dune getting some ridge lift. So it wasn't a flat water ground test. In that back to back test the foils cained the arse of the lei for glide. it was no contest at all,,, not even in the same ball park.

When ever I do a back to back session with building wind with my 15 speed then switching to my 13 edge. The speed glide is significantly more.

BUT. And I like big buts and I do not lie.

Glide is not the be all and end all of kite flying. Sure its glorious and on the land a very high priority. But on the water and in the ocean the turning speed of the kite is most likely a higher priority. On the sessions when I use the speed in my location with surf/swell/whitewash. It is fun. but a battle against the elements not to get smashed by the incoming waves. It turns into a bump and jump gliding ridiculous amounts down wind. When I switch to the edge its instantly easier in the waves. timing the boost of the lip is easier with the faster kite and I can get amongst the waves with some riding the face without getting torn off it like a dag doll.

Ultimately leis are more fun in the open ocean.

I'm almost getting around to land 4x front rotations on the S3 21 in "light wind" sessions... 70kg guys on 14m and TTs are doing one stunt per tack and just holding ground. More than enough float!

Keen to try an Edge 19... shame the Japanese Ozone distributers are useless. Gawd, everyone here is useless.

Speeds point upwind very well but aren't the fastest but go downwind badly. That's why they don't win races

Played with a doona once and actually didn't like the auto zenith thing - was a PL foil 15M but the flysurfer foils still make me wonder - hopefully this youtube vid gives the potential of the high aspect kite - almost scary if the conditions are gusty - wizard of Oz phenomena ??



Personally I'm now sticking with the LEI kites after my short play with the 'doona' (weird and slower turning) but in certain conditions maybe the deal?? LEI are to me the way to go for mainstream kiteboarding !!

Pl arcs feel completely different to fs speeds. But yes still a completely different feel to lei. but still slow turning.

The large Speeds are certainly unlike any LEI. The turning is slower and the dynamics are different.
There are no LEI at the moment that get you going anywhere near as early as a 21m Speed.
Foils are still being used successfully in races as the Russian girl Elanour displayed at the African championships -