Skin86 posted this quoted question in the newbies forum.
Being one of my particular 'topics of interest' I thought it worthy of a post here where all might read it.

quote:
Skin86 said...

Concidering practicing for a deep water kite launching from a tinnie in the gulf, QLD. has anyone who had kited before got any pointers? it is a large boat with pleanty of room to hokd a kite.
: unquote

Some of the 'accredited' teaching programs round the world teach deep water boat launch with student in the water > kite in the boat.
This is absolute garbage.
Its extremely kite unfriendly considering the knobs & whistles that make up boat hardware and fittings.
Its extremely line unfriendly getting the boat to a crosswind launch position.
But most concerning is the no. & extent of dangers it can present to the kiter.
The most probable problem being the necessary certainty that the only object of danger - the boat - will be in a position which is exactly where the kiter may end up - at high speed - if the launch goes wrong. This is esp true in the very likely event that the launch ends up being a hot launch from a boat which is directly downwind. The boat will always drift downwind much faster than the kiter in the water.

The ONLY reasonable method is as per a standard drift launch:
- Rig the kite to bar & lines on shore with all the normal checks.
- Wrap up the deflated, pre-rigged kite with lines still attached.
- Using a high tech 'turbo launcher' or the less sophisticated; but equally effective; lines in a bucket, condense your lines from the bar end towards the kite.
- Now the whole kit is all nicely compact for travelling.
- In neutral or motor-off allow the boat to drift while launching.
- Pump the kite on the downwind side of the boat.
- Position the kiter with bar etc. to allow for safe departure from the boat regardless of what goes down (or more particularly up) once the kite is free.
- Release the kite, LE down, and feed out lines as it drifts downwind.
- Kiter checks lines and harness connection etc once the kite lines are fully extended.
- Kiter enters the water and drifts off a safe distance.
- When safe the boat motors though an upwind half circle to oversee the launch from a position outside the 'kill zone'.

IMO this method is not just 'best practice' but 'only practice'.

I would be interested in hearing of other safe methods if they exist.

Kite in the boat rider in the water only works well if you are on a sandbar or something.
Otherwise drift launch, line management is all it takes really. Kite can be tethered to the boat, then hooked on the kiter once its settled at the end of its lines. We are doing this almost every lesson, hundreds of times per year. We use a RIB especially made for lessons, but it still has some line catchy bits, including the motor!!

A good vid with boat launch is on our australia day vid west of here.

A big boat helps and team players
#at=26

Any time you try something "a bit out of the box" you should consider carefully what you are attempting before you start.

Drift launches are not difficult once you get the hang of them, but it is very easy for them to get out of control and dangerous very very fast.

This is especially the case when there actually is wind as the kite does not "drift downwind" but acts like a spinaker

GalahOnTheSafetyBay

i'd also add not to hook in or clip on your leash until the lines are fed out completely. hold onto the chicken loop with one hand and feed out the lines with the other. if something goes wrong you can always let the whole lot go and chase it down with the tinny.
and get in the water before you launch the kite- i got dragged over the outboard once by launching from in the boat

Just received a PM from another noteworthy Oz instructor who suggested all the same as my rundown but added that the IKO standard is to put the kiter in the water first - runout the lines as you drift apart - when all good place the kite (LE down) in the water then motor round to get out of the kill zone.
This is OK too - the issue I have is where the kite launch is attempted - beach style - by the launch assistant holding the kite up IN the boat. Thats the bit that creates all the problems.

I would not be in the water waiting for the boat crew where we kite

from someone whose never having boat launched before!
but from a being a "tinny" launch. Put boat in reverse into wind launch from bow using precautions as said previously nearing launch length drop in to water every one free and clear. boat upwind rider/kite down

Darki

don't assume there is someone to drive the boat while you launch. every time i've done a boat launch its been from an anchored tinny. someone has to go last....

Ok just to clear things up a bit, I am on a commercial fishing boat in the gulf and I can be guaranteed 15 to 25 knot winds every day like clockwork, just they are only off shore winds. I have a large tinnie to launch from and retrieve me if need be, and someone to hold the kite and someone to drive it. I've been kiting for 4 tears so I am not a beginner just nervous about not being blown out to sea, there are large things with teeth up here. Thanks for all the input so far but as they say a picture sais a 1000 words so anybody got any other picts or vids on exactly what to do
Thanks heaps

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Skin86 said...

Ok just to clear things up a bit, I am on a commercial fishing boat in the gulf and I can be guaranteed 15 to 25 knot winds every day like clockwork, just they are only off shore winds. I have a large tinnie to launch from and retrieve me if need be, and someone to hold the kite and someone to drive it. I've been kiting for 4 tears so I am not a beginner just nervous about not being blown out to sea, there are large things with teeth up here. Thanks for all the input so far but as they say a picture sais a 1000 words so anybody got any other picts or vids on exactly what to do
Thanks heaps

Whats the make and model of the kite? Mini Mal's video above shows the best way to do it.
You just need something to store your lines on in the correct order for connecting to the kite. That yellow line keeper that comes with slingshot kites is ideal. Have a hand on the flagging system safety release until you are sure lines are ok and the just water relaunch as usual.

I can't see myself boat launching anytime soon, but out of curiosity, what's the best method for getting me and the kite back in the boat?

kite to boat ,grab it and drop kite onto the water at edge of wind window. Climb in or hand the bar to your mate then get in the boat. Fith line kites are easy just flag the kite and get assistant to wind up the lines onto the bar as you pull kite to boat. All neat and tidy. With four line kites grab the top front line and start pulling it , kite may land leading edge down and will usually sit calmly out the back but to the side of the boat . Get old mate to wind up lines as you pull it in ready for another launch after a few refreshments. Try and keep haul line low to water to minimize kite flipping . Easy

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Skin86 said...

Ok just to clear things up a bit, I am on a commercial fishing boat in the gulf and I can be guaranteed 15 to 25 knot winds every day like clockwork, just they are only off shore winds. I have a large tinnie to launch from and retrieve me if need be, and someone to hold the kite and someone to drive it. I've been kiting for 4 tears so I am not a beginner just nervous about not being blown out to sea, there are large things with teeth up here. Thanks for all the input so far but as they say a picture sais a 1000 words so anybody got any other picts or vids on exactly what to do
Thanks heaps

... hey skin86, which boat you on and which part of the gulf you at? I've kited Cape Arhnem and know how good that wind can be, orsm!!!

cheers,

Robbie!

found this video on youtube, it doesn't show much except from launching the kite from the boat but i assume the guy just swam out unraveling his lines while his friend in the boat holded his kite. not the safest way though

Hay everyone thanks for the input, i have a 2011 rebel 9m. What i have been doing so far is to rig up on the beach and drag the kite out to the water. I hang up wind for as long as I can however the wind at the beach is supper gusty because its flowing over the island so you have no way of making it back to the beach. I had my mates throw me a rope from the boat and I grab myself and then the kite back to the boat. my only problem is I haven't been able to perfect the boat launch yet because I can't seem to work out how to pre rig my kite right, then inflate it on the boat, without tangling it.

Also Puetz Im on FV Wildcard run by a guy called Bruce, most people in the fishing industry up here know the guy, at the moment I've only been kiting at Buri beach on Mornington island but the wind here as you know has been perfect!

If you have trouble pre rigging your kite for boat launches these simple line organizers can help. I got the idea off Kiteforum - more info there.





Sort your lines out on land and clip them into the organizer in the right order, leaving a few metres to connect up to the kite when you're on the boat. Then wind them on your bar as normal. Pump up kite on boat and connect lines. Still requires careful attention to detail though

Also a really thick rope off the stern of the boat helps get back on board and doesn't get tangled around you in the water.

Leave your lines atached to kite on land and boats at all times. Take care with the bar and its easy

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Mini Mal said...

Leave your lines atached to kite on land and boats at all times. Take care with the bar and its easy

Actually I do both - a bit obsessive - but with the line organizer I can see that I haven't dropped the bar through the line set and stuffed up when unpacking and pumping up the kite.

I can't believe people swim away from the boat to launch the kite off the boat.
Much easier and safer to anchor up and drift the kite back off the stern.
Apart from what's been said I would add splash some water on the canopy to keep it nose down into the wind and run it out with the lines wrapped on the bar and the safety line pulled short.
As you let the line off the bar keep the chicken loop attached to a leash off the transom of the boat and finally ease the safety line out.
Also the key to setting your lines up is not to let any lines to go behind the bar so when packing the bar in the kite attach your chicken loop up to the leading edge where your pump attaches.
Can't wait to have to do it again even if it is the short straw.

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Skin86 said...

Hay everyone thanks for the input, i have a 2011 rebel 9m. What i have been doing so far is to rig up on the beach and drag the kite out to the water. I hang up wind for as long as I can however the wind at the beach is supper gusty because its flowing over the island so you have no way of making it back to the beach. I had my mates throw me a rope from the boat and I grab myself and then the kite back to the boat. my only problem is I haven't been able to perfect the boat launch yet because I can't seem to work out how to pre rig my kite right, then inflate it on the boat, without tangling it.

Also Puetz Im on FV Wildcard run by a guy called Bruce, most people in the fishing industry up here know the guy, at the moment I've only been kiting at Buri beach on Mornington island but the wind here as you know has been perfect!

... hey Skin86, I know Bruce, bit of a character! I did some work on Wildcard a few years ago when the boat came to Darwin (wheelhouse electronics). Maybe you need to launch from the dingy rather than Wildcard, since the stern is so cluttered. I think you may have to pre rig on the beach as in, set up lines with them attached to kite, then wind up the bar and lines pack kite down. Roll the kite up with the dump valve closed, rolling kite from tip to center for both ends so when you pump up the kite un-furls easily.

When your ready, unwind the bar with the lines over the side, pump up the kite with lines laying over the side till completely pumped up, then drift launch from there. Anyway, just an idea!

Just spent the day at Groote yesterday, wind was howling as usual, wish I could have pumped up. The Gulf is an untapped resource for sure!

Have you got someone croc spotting, there are a couple gekkos in those parts!

cheers for now,

Robbie

I haven't tried this method from a boat, but have tried it successfully from shallow water with no beach space to launch. (Plus also thought I should through the doona two cents in :P)

It is interesting, though a bit old... would definitely want that rubber duck to stay close at hand and have knife handy.