Ladies and gentlemen,

according to Mr. Hirschausen - from WA - C kites relaunch faster than Bow kites. I and many others challenge that statement.

Given Mr. Hirschausen lives in Geralton, which is not really around the corner, I propose the following.

Lets make use of a video "referee" to see who's right.

Rules:
1. The kite needs to be lying in the water straight downwind on its leading edge
2. The film needs to contain a section displaying a windmeter at the exact location and time where the kite is going to be relaunched and the measurements need to be displayed in knots.
3. The tape counter information needs to be displayed at all times on the video feed (this is to avoid sneaky editing and higher speed playback to cheat on the time)
4. The total relaunch time is defined as the time where the rider grabs any of the lines to initiate the relaunch procedure until the kite has reached the zenith (defined as any point between 11am and 1pm up in the sky.)
5. The tape needs to record the kite size, brand, etc.
6. Only standard line lengths are allowed (by standard I mean the line length that is provided with the kite in a normal configuration). The line length must be quoted.
7. Only “safe” relaunches will be considered as valid (i.e. any style of potentially dangerous hot launches will not be considered as they don’t represent what a kiter would do in normal conditions)

The footage can be posted under youtube.com and shared through a link on this forum.

Please feel free to add any rules that may help making this exercise clear and comparable.

M

Justin,

can you clarify what you mean by rolling on it's back. If you mean just lying on the water like a "U" (similar to the interim C-relaunch position) it's fairly easy to get it to relauch. I normally give one of the outside lines a good yank and in 95% of the cases one of the wingtips folds and the kite goes onto a wingtip and is up in the air.

If you mean invert with your rolling on it's back, you make a fair point. I have learnt to minimise that by keeping the tension on the lines at all times. This stops the kite from rolling over and inverting.

But even if the kite inverts it is quite easy to univert if you pull on the outside lines a bit more than usual. It may happen that your lines are crossed once the kite is back in the air, but even that is easy to fix (even when in the water).

The considerations you have to make are:
1. On a powered trick would you rather have less risk of inversion (and as I said, that can be minimised) or more confidence that the kite will depower instantly potentially avoiding some serious injury??
2. Would you rather have a kite that is very likely to crash and end up on it's LE or a kite the often even remains up in the air after missing a handle pass for example or when it crashes often ends up on the wing tip just waiting for you to relaunch??
3. In wave riding, would you rather have a kite that allows you to fly a smaller/faster one (given the higher projected area of Bows) or a bigger C-kite??
4. In waves, where hard core crashes are less likely, would you rather have a kite that relaunches easily or a kite that looses valuable time to be relaunched??
5. In waves, would you like to have a kite that allows you to almost completely turn the power off in bottom or top turns allowing you to ride the wave more like a surfer or a kite that doesn't offer that???
5. In any water, would you prefer having to pay for 3-4 kites to cover the same wind range as 2 bows

I think there are a lot of reasons for Bows, even though I miss quite a few things on them (e.g. the direct feel of a C, the constand power during loops, etc.).

I'm hopefull that the kitecompanies will make their Cs have more of the benefits of bows and bows have more of the good things about Cs.

Anyway, that's a different topic. This thread is about which kites can relaunch quicker under normal circumstances....

M

Moritz,

Thanks for the clarification. When I say "on its back" I do mean it looks like a "U". Problem is with my bow once it gets into that position it normally inverts a few seconds later. Fair enough with line tension this can be prevented, but with a C kite there is nothing to worry about.

I guess all I am saying is that for your comp you need to define what is "normal" for relaunching "from". For my bow, 70% of the time it is as you describe (i.e. I have maintained line tension) - but 30% of the time it is in the U (and likely inverted) position (i.e. I didn't grab it quick enough). I would say for the people I have taught on my bow it is more like 30% / 70%.

I do hear your argument about why bows are better (I ride one!), just wanted to clarify the starting point for your comp. And as I said, they have probably sorted it out for the newer models.

Cheers
Justin

No Youngie! You Can't! You are not allowed to let the world know the secrets of the flysurfer re-launch.

I will openly admit that Ian will beat me, there yuo all have it.

But Ian, feel free to come up. I'll have a crack! Maybe you will have a bad session. (If we can get you back from the waves to actually do it)

Moritz:

I propose a change to your conditions, - attempt a handle pass trick and throw the bar while inverted. Let's do it from when the kiter hits the water to riding away again.

Hows that sound.

I recon everyone brings 1 slab each
we throw them all in a big hole full of ice
and winner takes the left overs

No 6 liners, helium or handles allowed.

quote:

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Originally posted by em

Moritz?... You really need some wind BADLY mate... (don't stress: it's coming back tomorrow!!!)

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Em,

I'm sorry, but I think you missed the point. I started this new thread as a challenge that Hirschauser had proposed in the Pro rider thread.

It has nothing to do with not enough wind. He stated Cs launch better than bows and I happen to disagree (like many others).

M

Who ever crashes in all situations and has the most successful relaunches takes the beers. All wind strengths included.

Yeah, yeah,
Bring it on. Let's just drink beers and have a re-launch comp, I still reckon I'll win no matter how much you try to convince me that the SB CB or LB can do (I have no idea which kite you are talkig about by the way as I don't get acronyms)

Just chuck it, video it, time it and post it. I'll expect the beers to come via registered post though.

Youngie, you coming up?. I'll have some beers soon to wager against you and your modified parachutes.

Yea, relaunch comp at Kitestock..you coming Gav?

Nick

PS I ride a bow too Loved it today,nice light wind kite...IMO everyone learns to relaunch their own special type...no biggie, just practice. I do like the way bows just hang there when you throw the bar...50% of the time for me.

Fantastic andrewm....now that's the benchmark.

quote:

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Originally posted by em

Moritz?... You really need some wind BADLY mate... (don't stress: it's coming back tomorrow!!!)
1- who cares which one relaunches better, as long as it does relaunch??? Kites are like boardies... the one that fits you is the right one for you... nah? Of course, if it's a pink boardie, it's A LOT better....
2- Is it really that important to find out if lemon tart taste better than blueberry one?
But if you want to put a footage on youtube of which tart gets eaten the fastest, do: might be a lot more fun to watch!
3- My north Rhino just doesn't want to crash on it's leading edge... whenever I crash it, it relaunches right away on its own... 1 second and bang, back up in the sky...that's really too bad: it means I can't be a part of your competition.... Bummer...
4- I'm trying to find out which one makes hotter riders, blond or dark guys? Can you help me???? I would really like to know before purchasing one....

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What tha ! there must be some logic in this but buggered if I can see it. Lack of wind is bending minds

EM not enough cigarettes in your pocket??? I always thought that the Frensh were known for the dumbest competitions!

quote:

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Originally posted by Moritz
Em,
I'm sorry, but I think you missed the point. I started this new thread as a challenge that Hirschauser had proposed in the Pro rider thread.
It has nothing to do with not enough wind. He stated Cs launch better than bows and I happen to disagree (like many others).
M

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You said it mate: people DISAGREE... Do you really think that this thread is going to change anything to this fact???
Agree to disagree and let it go. Seriously, this whole C versus bow is really getting old by now. This isn't a challenge, it's a waste of wind and fun!
Ride and let ride, relaunch your kite faster than anybody and let people struggle if they're happy to...
Any way, we all know by now bow's are gay, so why give a damn????
Plus it seems like the wind is coming back, so it's more likely that you're going to forget about this brilliant competition very soon.... We will go eat tarts afterwards if you want and we can disagree on which one taste the nicest... I'm definitely blueberry, telling you right away... We can start arguing about it right now if you want...
or we can also accept the fact that different people like different things...
which is all goooooood....

hm, Maxxl? You lost me mate....

quote:

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Originally posted by NJPornstar


FOR THE BEER!
We need All situations, hopefully your good enough and your kite lasts all day.

-Well powered unhooked kite loop release.

-Fack an airpass, point the kite directly at the water 30-35 knts and release.

-We need to tangle 2 kites in 35knts and see what happens.

-You need to self land successfully 100% of the time in 30-35knts.

- Also a slider. Keep hitting it all day. First to loose their kite or get dragged over the slider looses their stash of beers.

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I like you!

quote:

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Originally posted by NJPornstar

Hey Em I like you too.
What flavour of beer do you like?

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LOL.
Beer???? Did you say Beer?
I only drink Vodka mate. Zubrowka if possible... Best vodka in the world. Me think. But you can disagree if you want... And if you want, we can even have both. You have your beer, I have my vodka in a perfect happy world: how sweet!
So, when do we start our wasted comp?????

hell, you can crash a bow in a set, and get it up before the next wave hits you, on a c-kite you would have already flagged it