Have owned sunova boards for the past 3 yrs and couldn't be happier ,super strong , light ,great handles,seemed to be to good to be true.Well it was .Went away for camping trip ,board on roof in cover as you do Was a hot weekend,next time i took board out of the cover it was destroyed ..delaminated & core had melted .It was only 1 1/4 yrs old . it seem EPS FOAM that surfboard manufactures are using can't handle heat .which seems to be the consumers problem .isnt it the manufactures problem .arent they supplying a product that isn't appropriate for our climate .it never used to be such a big issue before eps foam .have emailed sunova and received a very poor response.i know its not just sunova .post a photo if this has happened to you .i have had board for 43 yrs and sup for the past 10 yrs .allways treated my boards the same way .this is a manufacture fault not ours like they want us to believe.this is not a beat up on sunova i really do love their boards but not happy with owning a ticking time bomb

Thanks for the info mate thats a real sunova bitch

Not fit for purpose. Would pursue some claim for refund. Sounds like the usual fob off, hoping you will just shut up and cop it sweet.

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mineral1 said..
Not fit for purpose. Would pursue some claim for refund. Sounds like the usual fob off, hoping you will just shut up and cop it sweet.

Not sure the purpose is in a bag on the roof in the sun.

Always has has been an issue with eps so your fault really. Been said lots of times before do not leave sups in the sun especially in a bag that will amplify the heat. Common sense.

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hilly said..

mineral1 said..
Not fit for purpose. Would pursue some claim for refund. Sounds like the usual fob off, hoping you will just shut up and cop it sweet.

Not sure the purpose is in a bag on the roof in the sun.

Always has has been an issue with eps so your fault really. Been said lots of times before do not leave sups in the sun especially in a bag that will amplify the heat. Common sense.

I concur, I understand the same thing happens with Surftech surfboards made out of "tufflite" construction (presumably the same or similar with EPS foam) there have been many punters who have left them in the sun, in certain conditions for too long, only to find them melt away and delaminate ! Not a manufacturing defect in my opinion, just misuse and neglect in those circumstances. I can't opine whether or not your fact situation is distinguishable from those. I would remark that posting on forums like this may not assist your case given the speculative nature of this forum and bad mouthing manufacturers in a public forum is not helpful to prosecuting a genuine claim. If it is a defect then get back to the manufacturer with more particulars as to why. Maybe the goretex vent was not fit for purpose, since if there was vent screw then you could have left that open for travelling and I doubt your issue would have occurred.. !

Never yet seen the core melt, that takes about 100deg or so. If yours has a melted core has it been repaired and some clown used old school resin, or applied pads over a crack, anything that let solvent in like a rub down with acetone over a cracked area?

But yes they will delaminate due to internal air expansion. Bit rough to bag out Sunova.

I agree with Mark, eps foam shouldn't melt from just being left in a bag. I cure my boards by wrapping in black plastic and leaving in the sun.

And I don't think you can by eps by it's melting point, pretty sure that would be very similar for all products.

SA has had some very hot weather lately, I guess if it's 45 degree air temp, and the bag is in full sun, and the bag is made of very dark material. It could get extremely hot inside. 60C is around the max temp you'd want to expose a board to.

No I'm not bagging sunova I'm bagging eps foam ,I love sunova boards ,I have been using them for past 3years and was very happy customer. .i named them cause its what happened to me .it no Chinese pop out ,u get what u pay for .its a issue that's is happening to most brands .why don't they solve the problem re engineer eps to have high res to heat all I want is to spark up a healthy discussion on an issue that does need attention..we should be able to go away with our boards on roof and not have to worrie about our boards destroying itself if you get delayed,stuck in traffic ect as for fail temp of eps ??? It's seems some say 60 deg some say more who really knows some blanks might not have been as heat res .its bit of cop out I think .solve the problem

They/we use eps because it's the lightest foam you can get at a decent price.
The main use for this foam is insulation.
No board makers have the resources of the major chemical companies, this is the foam they produce, we have to live with it.
If you want a light responsive, yet tough board, you just have to make sure it doesn't get too hot.

No I'm not bagging sunova I'm bagging eps foam ,I love sunova boards ,I have been using them for past 3years and was very happy customer. .i named them cause its what happened to me .it no Chinese pop out ,u get what u pay for .its a issue that's is happening to most brands .why don't they solve the problem re engineer eps to have high res to heat all I want is to spark up a healthy discussion on an issue that does need attention..we should be able to go away with our boards on roof and not have to worrie about our boards destroying itself if you get delayed,stuck in traffic ect as for fail temp of eps ??? It's seems some say 60 deg some say more who really knows some blanks might not have been as heat res .its bit of cop out I think .solve the problem

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Mark _australia said..
Never yet seen the core melt, that takes about 100deg or so. If yours has a melted core has it been repaired and some clown used old school resin, or applied pads over a crack, anything that let solvent in like a rub down with acetone over a cracked area?

But yes they will delaminate due to internal air expansion. Bit rough to bag out Sunova.

never dinged it mate found them indestructible,.it is what it is mate ...its over heated and it a sunova ...my argument is why do so many eps boards do this .they should be designed to handle hot weather that's when u go down the beach surfing even when there's no surf.

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decrepit said..
They/we use eps because it's the lightest foam you can get at a decent price.
The main use for this foam is insulation.
No board makers have the resources of the major chemical companies, this is the foam they produce, we have to live with it.
If you want a light responsive, yet tough board, you just have to make sure it doesn't get too hot.

than as a industry you should address the problem .as more surfboard manufactures brag about becoming more environmentally friendly we the consumer are dumping these boards in landfill.i get your point and I don't disagree .my next board will still be a sunova .but I'm going to put my wife on the roof on the way home and the board in the air con car

If your whinge is about EPS, then take Sunova out of the title.
Every time somebody googles it now they see that Sunova self destructs. I reckon thats a bit rough.
Further it didn't self destruct, u applied a ****eload of heat.

Now - EPS would not melt so I'd like to see you back that up with a pic or something.
I think what you really meant was your board went pop? and so you think EPS sucks compared to old school PU construction?

ALL boards with an EPS core don't like being in extreme heat (or an aeroplane) as core expansion will cause delam. You can't say some EPS cores may be less heat resistant. They are all the same.

If you want a 15kg SUP then go for it..... go back to PU construction. Else stick with the proven new construction but be aware you can't abuse it.....

Get one with a vent if you want to have it on the roof in 45 deg (well 2 vents really for a SUP, and not the Goretex things unless you want to wash the vent every time and replace them religiously very year)

Get a white one.

And BTW some "chinese popouts" get a bad rap from the early experience from with cheap surfboards. However there are also ones moulded with A1 materials and with tonnes of pressure etc so they are tougher for the same weight than you'd get in a custom board.
Chinese popouts is a derogatory term from old surf purists but they might need to get with the program....

windsurfers have been made with eps foam for about 30 years now, I've never heard of one with sun melted foam.
If your's really has, perhaps it's the bag that's not fit for purpose.
It should be keeping the board cool not melting it.

And if there was a viable alternative to eps, we'd be using it.
I hate the stuff!

I spend most of my time trying to dry boards out when doing repairs. Eps just sucks water in as soon as there's the smallest leak.

I'm waiting for the you should be trying xxxx foam. It bla bla bla's and sucks your xxxx at the same time.

It was in the sun to long. It's Australia, land of melting thong. Move along . Nothing is radical free.

Some basics.
No EPS board should be made w/o a vent, period.
Screw vents are the best, Goretex can clog, always leave the screw open if the board is going to get hot.
Black board bags are worthless, unless they are well vented.
Anything short of that is on the owner.

I would be interested to see picture s of the board .
i would say it must of got real hot ..as the ply and glass I thought would hold its shape .

do you wash your board off ,it my have been a built up of salt on you air breather .or it packed it in .
sorry for your board mate .

Yeah I want to see a picture of the board.

Pretty gutted for you. I leave my board out in the sun for reasonable amounts of time too on occassion (NZ but) but would be pretty annoyed if I got an unsatisfactory response from the manufacturer.

As much as the foam itself is the problem, the manufacturer needs to make sure they pander to the customers in the right way cos' otherwise it ends up on a forum, and that's just the way it rolls with every company these days. Often, if a company really looks after its customers the word spreads pretty fast and then a company can turn a negative into a positive.
Modern consumer relations eh

We could try a little experiment if you like.

Try and determine the melting point of any undamaged foam in your board. And I'll do the same for samples of varies ages and densities of scraps I have lying around in the shed. That way we can tell for sure if your board has an odd low melting point foam in it.
Later today when I get a bit of time, I'll use an old kettle to boil water and see if any of the foam melts.
My feeling is that it will get soft and pliable but not actually melt.
I'll be back later with any results.

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billyyorkes said..
Have owned sunova boards for the past 3 yrs and couldn't be happier ,super strong , light ,great handles,seemed to be to good to be true.Well it was .Went away for camping trip ,board on roof in cover as you do Was a hot weekend,next time i took board out of the cover it was destroyed ..delaminated & core had melted .It was only 1 1/4 yrs old . it seem EPS FOAM that surfboard manufactures are using can't handle heat .which seems to be the consumers problem .isnt it the manufactures problem .arent they supplying a product that isn't appropriate for our climate .it never used to be such a big issue before eps foam .have emailed sunova and received a very poor response.i know its not just sunova .post a photo if this has happened to you .i have had board for 43 yrs and sup for the past 10 yrs .allways treated my boards the same way .this is a manufacture fault not ours like they want us to believe.this is not a beat up on sunova i really do love their boards but not happy with owning a ticking time bomb

not great photo ironically has been over cast and cool for last weekso no sun to really highlight how bad it is some ..have suggested it might be the vent... then where the roof staps were .why was it unaffected.also from back strap to tail were fins are unaffected ...also most people I know thought board bags protect board not cook them.silver reflects heat ?.thought its better than sun beating down directly onto glass...ive live at Marion bay Sa .a small little surf & fishing community visited by heaps of Adelaide & interstate crew .and they all have multiple boards on the roof 90% stay on the roof in boardbags unless in the water .where do you put the one your not surfing .in the car to heat up ,on the roof ? Or under the car for you to run over or for someone to steal.surfer aren't going to change we are a bit ferral especially us country surfer.we don't wash our boards.all we want to do is sleep eat and surf .this is us .they need to cater for us ..heat will become more of an issue as global warming kicks in .stop bring up the same old excuses and fix the problem .

When you said melted foam, I assumed the board had opened up and you could see the melted foam inside.
From the pics, that board is still intact, and as you say. it's hard to see any damage.
Is it depressed where the straps go? Epoxy and eps both get soft with heat, strap pressure could then deform the board.

Yep, silver reflects heat, but still lets some through. If there is no airflow the heat can slowly build up inside. The board is probably better off in the open air, especially if it's painted white, although the light balsa colour should reflect heat OK

Wow ...never thought I'd see one go like that ..un rideable .

Notes to self:
(1) Don't buy a board from SUP Island if they think the "ply and glass" should hold together a styro core board thru anything.
That's a pretty normal garden-variety delam for major heat stress on an EPS core board. I just saw windsurf boards (far better construction than any SUP) do exactly the same oooh 3 times in last year. But I've had mine in extreme heat plenty with the vent open just fine. VENTING!!!!

(2) Don't believe posters who say the core has "melted".

(3) Buy a Sunova, cos after this unfair slamming they deserve a sale.


Notes to OP:

Heat causes expansion.

The unaffected areas are normal - it had to warp somewhere and didn't warp where the straps were.
It didn't at the tail possibly due to tail patch glass and also in a narrower area it is stiffer (delam normally in the middle 60% of the board.) Adhesion to a stringer, boxes and rails can stop the delam in those areas.


I would be sad also, but EPS makes a great light product and you just need to treat it right. Like you service a race car/bike more than a postie bike that will run forever with olive oil in the sump.

Silver bags on a car roof will cook a board. The best option is a light coloured stretch cover that allows the board to cool, not just suck in the heat. Here is the Board lady's article re heat damage, note that 130 Fahrenheit is only 54 Celsius.

boardlady.com/heatdamage.htm

I saw the same model at a local shop with about 60% of the bottom delaminated just as this one, just one big bubble.
Dont know of the boards history or what may have caused it.
I was told it was replaced under warranty.
Having said that, I've had two Suniva boards that I couldn't fault and have a third on order at the moment.

Just checked sunova website, and it seems they now use goretex vents.
Personally I don't trust them, I've had one that blocked up and wouldn't breath.
In theory if the vent is working properly heat related delams shouldn't happen.

Delams can still happen through eps fatigue, due to flexing.

I might have to retract my statements if they are now Goretex and it was two of them seen to major delam...

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Mark _australia said..
Notes to self:
(1) Don't buy a board from SUP Island if they think the "ply and glass" should hold together a styro core board thru anything.
That's a pretty normal garden-variety delam for major heat stress on an EPS core board. I just saw windsurf boards (far better construction than any SUP) do exactly the same oooh 3 times in last year. But I've had mine in extreme heat plenty with the vent open just fine. VENTING!!!!

(2) Don't believe posters who say the core has "melted".

(3) Buy a Sunova, cos after this unfair slamming they deserve a sale.


Notes to OP:

Heat causes expansion.

The unaffected areas are normal - it had to warp somewhere and didn't warp where the straps were.
It didn't at the tail possibly due to tail patch glass and also in a narrower area it is stiffer (delam normally in the middle 60% of the board.) Adhesion to a stringer, boxes and rails can stop the delam in those areas.


I would be sad also, but EPS makes a great light product and you just need to treat it right. Like you service a race car/bike more than a postie bike that will run forever with olive oil in the sump.

u know there's two ways to look at what u said.
you say this will hurt sunova but you could say this help sunova .heres most people sticking up for them and here me the pissed of customer saying he is going to still buy one .the fact is ,I'm not well off ,I can't afford to buy a board every time it gets 36deg and your caught out camping .if martin at sunova valued his customers he should return there emails to..as far as board bags go **** 95 % travellers are playing Russian roulette with there boards .im a carpenter .imagine if I built your house to only withstand 35 knt wind and it was blown down by a 40knt wind my excuse is oh it lighter and cheaper .you should have tied it down .any way you had it 14months bad luck .oh yes bet you would be pissed but then with very little investigating to find out it's very common with. Most""""Brands"""""Ps don't really care what you call it ,melted sucked in,delaminated call it what you like ,it's not good .it happens ,and it don't take long to go .its seems to be happening more than you are making out .

^^^But it doesn't happen more than I made out
there are SUPS on the roof in 40deg all over australia every day.
You made it sound like Sunova was ****ty construction based on one board popping in the heat and that's rubbish

You also said EPS is a useless construction method and that's clearly rubbish as its been used for 20-30yrs in windsurfing and 10yrs plus in SUP.

BUT NOW we hear about a second Sunova popping and also they have changed to Goretex vents well now there is a story in it perhaps. Recently saw a board implode when it hit cold water as it didn't vent.
So I did say I'd retract my statements if there is a higher failure rate in Sunova, especially if it is after they changed vents. I hate Goretax.


BTW, I don't have Sunova, never even used one, never even picked one up. I am not defending them, I was responding to your initial post that bagged EPS construction and didn't need Sunova in the title if u r talkinga bout EPS and how you hate it - I reckon.

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billyyorkes said..

Mark _australia said..
Notes to self:
(1) Don't buy a board from SUP Island if they think the "ply and glass" should hold together a styro core board thru anything.
That's a pretty normal garden-variety delam for major heat stress on an EPS core board. I just saw windsurf boards (far better construction than any SUP) do exactly the same oooh 3 times in last year. But I've had mine in extreme heat plenty with the vent open just fine. VENTING!!!!

(2) Don't believe posters who say the core has "melted".

(3) Buy a Sunova, cos after this unfair slamming they deserve a sale.


Notes to OP:

Heat causes expansion.

The unaffected areas are normal - it had to warp somewhere and didn't warp where the straps were.
It didn't at the tail possibly due to tail patch glass and also in a narrower area it is stiffer (delam normally in the middle 60% of the board.) Adhesion to a stringer, boxes and rails can stop the delam in those areas.


I would be sad also, but EPS makes a great light product and you just need to treat it right. Like you service a race car/bike more than a postie bike that will run forever with olive oil in the sump.

u know there's two ways to look at what u said.
you say this will hurt sunova but you could say this help sunova .heres most people sticking up for them and here me the pissed of customer saying he is going to still buy one .the fact is ,I'm not well off ,I can't afford to buy a board every time it gets 36deg and your caught out camping .if martin at sunova valued his customers he should return there emails to..as far as board bags go **** 95 % travellers are playing Russian roulette with there boards .im a carpenter .imagine if I built your house to only withstand 35 knt wind and it was blown down by a 40knt wind my excuse is oh it lighter and cheaper .you should have tied it down .any way you had it 14months bad luck .oh yes bet you would be pissed but then with very little investigating to find out it's very common with. Most""""Brands"""""Ps don't really care what you call it ,melted sucked in,delaminated call it what you like ,it's not good .it happens ,and it don't take long to go .its seems to be happening more than you are making out .

Been up north in very hot weather with a full range of boards including no vent (Smik), goretex vents (PSH, Sunova) and a screw vent (Naish left in). Board on roof in bag with the zip undone or under camper with no issues. I have seen boards delam in full sun with black logos and in bags done up with no air flow. It sucks but Sunova would be extremely generous to warranty yours. Saying that they warranted that one in NZ that was clearly user error. Good luck with it but I would take Sunova out of the title if you want a positive outcome.

You can have issues putting wet boards in bags. I think you are better off having the board on the car unbagged or better still putting a soft board on top of the sup to provide some shade. It works for me.

Try unique climate "heat wave" few other places in the world !
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_disasters_in_Australia_by_death_toll

If you were to do a look-up of "solar panel housing material temperatures", normative can climb to max 120 degrees Celsius in the sun in summer severely lowering the output of the cells as much as 30% for a short period of under an hour in the middle of the day.

Roughly nowhere else on earth !