Has anyone else seen the same thing? Or am I just on a really bad plan for natural gas supply?

I found a gas bill from 2009 where I was charged a rate of $0.01611 cents a megajoule, but now a megajoule is charged at $0.03287 a megajoule? This is from the same supplier.

To add insult to injury, they now charge based on peak periods. The reason that annoys me is that there is no time of usage metering, its just based on the quantity you use. So, for the first 4000 MJ you get charged the highest possible rate, and it falls into a different rate after that and another rate again.

How does that work? If anyone wants to reduce their usage of gas, they pay a higher rate per unit.

It's like they are having two bites of the cherry. They are getting a 'supply charge' and also whacking a premium on the first block of consumption.

Is there where the ipart thing has allowed them to increase prices just for the sake of it and their magical calculations to work out what they want to charge?

As far as I am aware, price rises for gas have been explained away by the price being tied to what they pay in China or somewhere like that. I guess the suppliers got together with the regulator and they worked out a way to separate the maximum amount of cash from the customer. This is how it works in Australia whenever we are buying stuff from a regulated market.

Other examples of rip offs in regulated markets I experience is the famous electricity price rip off with prices doubling in a short period of time and the Sydney Water rip off with prices going up 75% in seven years.

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Mobydisc said..
As far as I am aware, price rises for gas have been explained away by the price being tied to what they pay in China or somewhere like that. I guess the suppliers got together with the regulator and they worked out a way to separate the maximum amount of cash from the customer. This is how it works in Australia whenever we are buying stuff from a regulated market.

Other examples of rip offs in regulated markets I experience is the famous electricity price rip off with prices doubling in a short period of time and the Sydney Water rip off with prices going up 75% in seven years.

The Sydney water thing is crazy especially when you hear from ICAC that there were some corrupt people attaching themselves to Sydney Water and charging a bundle of money for doing nothing. I wonder how much other waste for that sort of thing is going on? I don't think people are wasteful when they are out there actually working on infrastructure, but the ICAC stuff suggests there were a couple of leeches there.

The electricity sell off that the current NSW premier is pushing is just going to lead to more of the same. Why would we sell off an asset when we know prices will go up, and they have already gone up.


I think the energy markets are meant to be 'unregulated'. Open and competitive they tell us. Competitive for who? Share holders or consumers?

They keep on going on about being able to switch plans to reduce your energy costs. I would love to see how that works. All talk, but no one can actually demonstrate these savings.

because inflation is only 2.2 percent

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FlySurfer said..
because inflation is only 2.2 percent

Yeah, its funny isn't it. Inflation is officially low, yet a lot of things that are necessities seem to keep going up. I think power costs are the ridiculous exception though. I think there was meant to be some tv program, that I missed, on this recently where someone has come out and told people how they have worked out the power prices. From what I recall, it was 'pluck a number that you want to earn, and then work backwards to justify it'.

I guess part of it is tied in with selling off more energy assets. You can't get great prices for them if they are not looking great on the books.

Even land rates, which are linked to rents indirectly, have gone up substantially each year much more than inflation. Yet, they seem to contribute nothing or little to CPI.

Ahh, but we can rest assured that loaves of bread are factored in, so eat up on that bread ;-)

There is no conspiracy here. It's simply the result of the fact that of the resource owning peoples, Australians are among the stupidest.
We allow global corporations to come along and take our resources, including gas, and sell them on the global market. We demand nothing in exchange apart from royalties.
Natural gas can be converted to LNG and sold overseas. The current price for LNG in Japan is $15/GJ. So in Australia, the price we pay is approaching what's known as net-back. Net-back is the price you can get for your gas as LNG minus the cost of converting to LNG. If that cost is, say $3/GJ, then you can net $12/GJ for your natural gas.
A couple of years ago most Australian utilities were paying about $5/GJ. Why would anybody sell their gas to Australians for $5/GJ when they can get $12/GJ by exporting?
So, expect the price of gas to keep going up until it gets to around $12/GJ. When your electricity generator has to renegotiate their gas contract expect your power bill to go up in proportion.
Next time you meet someone from Denmark tell them how we give our gas away and then compete with Japan to buy it back. Watch them piss themselves laughing.

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MrRubberbely said..
There is no conspiracy here. It's simply the result of the fact that of the resource owning peoples, Australians are among the stupidest.
We allow global corporations to come along and take our resources, including gas, and sell them on the global market. We demand nothing in exchange apart from royalties.
Natural gas can be converted to LNG and sold overseas. The current price for LNG in Japan is $15/GJ. So in Australia, the price we pay is approaching what's known as net-back. Net-back is the price you can get for your gas as LNG minus the cost of converting to LNG. If that cost is, say $3/GJ, then you can net $12/GJ for your natural gas.
A couple of years ago most Australian utilities were paying about $5/GJ. Why would anybody sell their gas to Australians for $5/GJ when they can get $12/GJ by exporting?
So, expect the price of gas to keep going up until it gets to around $12/GJ. When your electricity generator has to renegotiate their gas contract expect your power bill to go up in proportion.
Next time you meet someone from Denmark tell them how we give our gas away and then compete with Japan to buy it back. Watch them piss themselves laughing.

Isn't this the conspiracy though? Despite the fact Australia is a country full of gas and coal Australians pay amongst the highest prices in the world for energy. Someone is laughing all the way to the bank at our expense.

So, even if we were paying 'the same' price as the Japanese price for LNG, i.e. $15 a Gj, we would be paying 1.5 cents a Megajoule.

We aren't. Lucky us, we are paying 3.2 cents a Megajoule.

So, Moby, you are right, someone's making a bundle. They are making double the price on the cost per unit AND they are charging an access fee of close to 50 cents a day.

So, how do we get stuck with this garbage? How is it that even a free market price is lower than what we pay?

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FormulaNova said..
So, even if we were paying 'the same' price as the Japanese price for LNG, i.e. $15 a Gj, we would be paying 1.5 cents a Megajoule.

We aren't. Lucky us, we are paying 3.2 cents a Megajoule.

So, Moby, you are right, someone's making a bundle. They are making double the price on the cost per unit AND they are charging an access fee of close to 50 cents a day.

So, how do we get stuck with this garbage? How is it that even a free market price is lower than what we pay?

The only way to get out of this system of rip offs is break free of the systems. The hippies did this in the early 70s however most of them stayed on the system by claiming the dole and pensions. Many of us can do this today through technology. Breakthroughs are coming with battery and energy generation technology that will really make it possible to get off the grid. Hopefully this will lead to a downward or death spiral for energy utilities.

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Mobydisc said..

The only way to get out of this system of rip offs is break free of the systems. The hippies did this in the early 70s however most of them stayed on the system by claiming the dole and pensions. Many of us can do this today through technology. Breakthroughs are coming with battery and energy generation technology that will really make it possible to get off the grid. Hopefully this will lead to a downward or death spiral for energy utilities.

Nooooooooo.... When usage drops, the energy companies then complain and argue that they need to support their infrastructure with higher prices.

Don't think so? This has already happened. Apparently our electricity use has fallen in the last couple of years, so they argued they need to increase charges. I wonder if this is due to compact fluorescents and led lights?

So, if you try and break free of the system by lowering your usage first, you will be charged more unless you can break free entirely. It's a crazy game where prices can only go up.

Electricity is the main competitor for gas. If the price of electricity rises like it has, then I guess the gas guys can hike up their prices.

Gee in W.A we even give them free land ,as well as the gas. Hope Colin gets his job at Chevron when he leaves politics

"Why have gas charges doubled in 5 years?"

Because we won't let them frack around with our land...

(...apparently that is 'their' reason, and what is being put to governments now as a solution to high gas prices!)

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Sailhack said..
"Why have gas charges doubled in 5 years?"

Because we won't let them frack around with our land...

(...apparently that is 'their' reason, and what is being put to governments now as a solution to high gas prices!)

Ahh, so they must argue that up until 2009, we did let them frack

I think I would rather pay the higher prices than allow fracking, but its a no-win scenario. If we let them frack, there will be an excuse to increase prices. If we don't they will use that as an excuse to push prices higher again.

How can China pay more than we are wanting to, and that includes shipping it there?

Yes that's one of the more outrageous lines being peddled at the moment: let us frack and gas will be cheaper. Won't make more difference than a hill of beans to the global price.
It started with ****ushima, the Japanese shut down their nukes and had to replace with gas fired generation. The situation is unlikely to change anytime soon.
Again; the issue is that we are so stupid that we allow global corporations to take our resources from us and have us compete to buy them back. We are so dumb that when the government proposed a relatively modest tax to get at least something back we all lined up to protest with Twiggy and Gina. A Prime Minister was made an example of, and the other politicians got the message.
As for why the retail price we pay for gas is twice the wholesale price paid by utilities; that is actually not all that unusual with primary produce.

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MrRubberbely said..
Yes that's one of the more outrageous lines being peddled at the moment: let us frack and gas will be cheaper. Won't make more difference than a hill of beans to the global price.
It started with ****ushima, the Japanese shut down their nukes and had to replace with gas fired generation. The situation is unlikely to change anytime soon.
Again; the issue is that we are so stupid that we allow global corporations to take our resources from us and have us compete to buy them back. We are so dumb that when the government proposed a relatively modest tax to get at least something back we all lined up to protest with Twiggy and Gina. A Prime Minister was made an example of, and the other politicians got the message.
As for why the retail price we pay for gas is twice the wholesale price paid by utilities; that actually is not all that unusual with primary produce.

F u kushima is moderated because F u k sounds like f u c k?? are you guys Mormons or something?

I remember when I put gas on the truck and I got suckered into that one and Whammy gas bill soared.
We are going to get fed bull**** until the day we die as we are are all just milking cows for governments and business.

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pueter66 said..
I remember when I put gas on the truck and I got suckered into that one and Whammy gas bill soared.
We are going to get fed bull**** until the day we die as we are are all just milking cows for governments and business.

Really? can i say bullpoo, I hear harsher language than that from a nun driving

UP here in Townsville, most homes are on stand-alone gas bottles and they are cheap as. I think we last paid $35 for over 4 months worth of gas! Yeah it's crazy.

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Loftywinds said..
UP here in Townsville, most homes are on stand-alone gas bottles and they are cheap as. I think we last paid $35 for over 4 months worth of gas! Yeah it's crazy.

We pay $129 for a bottle here

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Loftywinds said..
UP here in Townsville, most homes are on stand-alone gas bottles and they are cheap as. I think we last paid $35 for over 4 months worth of gas! Yeah it's crazy.

Yeah, its bad when bottled gas can be similar in cost.

I am tempted to replace the hot water system with an electric unit and convert to an LPG cooktop. I think off-peak hot water is about the same cost as gas.

I like cooking with a gas cooktop so I am not sure if I could give that up.

The access charges for electricity and gas are significant, but if I went to electricity only it would get rid of the access charge for gas.