I can understand L Plates. But why have P Plates. It just gives open licence drivers something to crap on about.

If we are going to have P plates maybe we should have some other plates as well.
O - Old Driver
N - Doesn't use indicators
I - Uses indicators
S - alway drives 10ks under the speed limit
F - always drives 10k over the speed limit

Then drivers could put a few plates on their car just so other driver are a lot more informed about their driving technique. Hence - SON - Old Slow Driver who doesn't use indicators.

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Crusoe said..
I can understand L Plates. But why have P Plates. It just gives open licence drivers something to crap on about.

Agreed, you've certainly proved that point

So the cops can identify who is on a different set of rules.
Like E plates.

Expert drivers?

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elmo said..
Expert drivers?

In the wearers mind

^^^ yeah prob what got them into the predicament lol
A lot more rare to see them now I think

I actually think the green and red P plate system we have (in WA at least) is good. Tells me what to expect from the driver of said vehicle.

green = slower moving, not completely competent yet, so give them space/go round them.


red = cocky, prone to erratic manoeuvres, gods gift to driving (till they get shut down by the cops/have a crash) still learning civility on the road.

seriously though, p plates let everyone on the road know that the person driving the car is reasonably fresh, so give them space/time to grasp being on the rd. Imagine the crap someone would get on day one of a full licence, with nothing there to let others know they're fresh out of passing school.

Female P platers need a seperate colour. They seem to be the more aggressive/non aware driver. Boys do dumb sh!t, but seem more spatially aware (not to say they don't cock it up).

Also need a plate for 'I'm FIFO and have just flown in'.

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Toph said.. Also need a plate for 'I'm FIFO and have just flown in'.

You can tell by the fact its a lifted F350 with 26" rims and cutting everyone off

My dad used to turn my P plates upside down cause I drove like a d1ck

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Crusoe said..

S - alway drives 10ks under the speed limit

They're the ones who paid attention in yr 12 physics.
( Vf^2 - Vi^2 = 2as )

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Ian K said..

Crusoe said.

S - alway drives 10ks under the speed limit

They're the ones who paid attention in yr 12 physics.
( Vf^2 - Vi^2 = 2as )

Legion. If you please.

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Buster fin said..

Ian K said..

Crusoe said.

S - alway drives 10ks under the speed limit

They're the ones who paid attention in yr 12 physics.
( Vf^2 - Vi^2 = 2as )

Legion. If you please.

Sorry. I was assuming those who paid attention didn't need one and those that didn't wouldn't be interested anyway.

Vf is the final velocity. ie your collision velocity after you've jammed the brakes on when a car unexpectedly comes through a red light say 20 metres in front of you. Or a drunk or a toddler.

Vi is your initial velocity say 65 kph (18 m/sec) in a 70kph zone or 75 kph (20.8) in the same 70 kph zone.
a is the deceleration -0.7 g
~ -7 m/sec^2 might be typical of a modern car.
s is the distance of deceleration (let's try 20 metres)
In the first case Vf ^2 - 18^2 = 2 X -7 X20 ... Vf^2 = 324 - 280 = 44 Vf = 6.6 m/sec = 23.8 kph

In the case of the fast driver the collision speed is
Vf^2 - 20.833^2 = 2 X -7 X 20 ... Vf^2 = 434.0 - 280 = 12.41 m/sec = 44.68 kph

So the collision speed is doubled for only an extra 10 kph on board. This is once the brakes are applied so the distance covered in the reaction time is extra. This will make it even worse for the faster driver. He closes down more of the remaining gap so would have to have identified the red light runner sooner. 1.5 seconds is a typical driver reaction time. ie 27 metres for the driver doing 18 m/sec and 31 metres for the faster driver. Do the calculations again with 4 metre less stopping distance ie. 16 metres for the faster driver and you get

Vf^2 = 434.0 - 224 ...... Vf = 14.49 m/sec or 52.16 kph. More than double the collision speed of the person 5 kph under the limit.

These simple equations were the basis of the Victorian TAC campaign. But it was discontinued. I think they found that unless you go through the equations, and most people don't, you'd just say "Bull **** "

target practice drivers for the more aggressive drivers

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Ian K said..
They're the ones who paid attention in yr 12 physics.
( Vf^2 - Vi^2 = 2as )

Our high school physics teacher always gave us exam questions about working out how long it would take a car doing a certain speed to stop if it applied brakes so many meters before the pedestrian crossing. The answer would always be a few meters past the crossing. Maybe he was trying to teach us something, but we always just thought he was a sadist.

Your equation is missing a few key factors. Any self respecting hoon has the very best brakes and tyres, this in itself can dramatically decrease braking distance. The speeder is a more focused driver with much quicker reaction times. There's more but I forget

And the slowpoke forces overtakes, a dangerous move, and that would be less frequent if they did the speed limit.

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psychojoe said..
Your equation is missing a few key factors. Any self respecting hoon has the very best brakes and tyres, this in itself can dramatically decrease braking distance. The speeder is a more focused driver with much quicker reaction times. There's more but I forget

A key factor! Wish full thinking. But if you're going to generalise to justify a position I'd argue that any "self-respecting" hoon these days drives a double cab ute.


And most "self-respecting" hoons have accrued a few demerit points. The stats don't lie about their relative probability of having a crash in the next 12 months.
www.monash.edu/__data/assets/pdf_file/0017/217043/muarc116.pdf

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Mark _australia said..
And the slowpoke forces overtakes, and dangerous move, and that would be less frequent if they did the speed limit.

Are you talking about those who have to always overtake a vehicle travelling at anything under the speed limit? In which case it's safer passing a vehicle doing 85 than one doing 95. Allowing for the exposure time you'll possibly have an opportunity to safely pass a vehicle going 85 before a long-enough gap turns up to allow you to safely pass one doing 95. You'll be back up to 100 kph with less interruption and get where you've got to be half a minute sooner.

In fact, I just checked, it's almost impossible to legally pass a car doing 95 in a 100 kph zone. The bloke doing 85 is doing you a speedsters favour.
www.carsguide.com.au/car-advice/is-it-illegal-to-speed-while-passing-69901

That video is a lot of effort to go to, to show what we all know already...?

No I'm talking about 3 lanes across doing 90 in the 100 zone - frustration. Doesn't matter if its right or not to get frustrated, but it's human behaviour

Talking about 80 or 90 for no reason at all on the highway . .... and then 115 at the overtaking lane aargghhhhh

Here's a real fourby worth putting on the track



The standard 700hp Trackhawk is a beast - a bit more herbs and its indescribable

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Mark _australia said..
Talking about 80 or 90 for no reason at all on the highway . .... and then 115 at the overtaking lane aargghhhhh

I am pretty sure this is an effect from people getting into two lanes and feeling safer, so they speed up to the speed limit.. and then slow down to 20 below once it gets back to one lane. I am sure these people are clueless about why they are doing it and just doing it instinctively.

I have tried something novel once or twice when towing. I got to the overtaking lanes and actually slowed down, as I figured it was a chance for people to get past to me because it really bugs me when some moron towing a caravan at 80kmph speeds up to over 100 when they hit the overtaking lanes.

Why don't they put a "ram air" snorkel on that Trackhawk? It'd blow that Tesla away then. For sure.

Strewth I had no idea the standard sporty one was so damn quick. 10's !!!!! That full torque all the way from zero RPM huh.
Makes sense though, brushless RC cars were immediately on par with the nitro ones (which have the most power for capacity of any naturally aspirated motor I think... 600 HP per litre or something)

I think I will still want the noise

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Ian K said..
Why don't they put a "ram air" snorkel on that Trackhawk? It'd blow that Tesla away then. For sure.

I think I might add a few snorkels to my cars and drive past you one day and wait for the rage to kick in. You don't like them do you?

A neighbour 2 doors down had a Tesla a few years ago and said there was some mode that you put it into where it just gave it everything and it was scary quick. A dangerous feature to use around town I expect as a lot of people will not expect you to be able to move that fast and will change into your lane before they realise you are already there or just about to be.

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FormulaNova said..

Ian K said..
Why don't they put a "ram air" snorkel on that Trackhawk? It'd blow that Tesla away then. For sure.

I think I might add a few snorkels to my cars and drive past you one day and wait for the rage to kick in. You don't like them do you?

A neighbour 2 doors down had a Tesla a few years ago and said there was some mode that you put it into where it just gave it everything and it was scary quick. A dangerous feature to use around town I expect as a lot of people will not expect you to be able to move that fast and will change into your lane before they realise you are already there or just about to be.

It's not that I don't like them. it just intrigues me that they have become so popular as a fashion item. The charging, trumpeting elephant. A good look.

Air is pushed down the inlet by atmospheric pressure 101,325 pascals. The static pressure of air at a typical 4wd speed of 20 m/sec (72kph) is 250 pascal. The manufacturers know this. All original equipment snorkels have the inlet to the rear. Toyota, Ineos, Mercedes ...( though I think I've seen a toyota-branded one succumbing to fashion). Not sure of the reason manufacturers face the inlet rearwards, maybe a little cyclonic aircleaner effect of dust being less inclined to turn a corner, or maybe the turbulence interferes with the MAFS? And you still can't drive through water! The extra air-resistance around the A pillar - carefully designed in a wind tunnel - would surely negate any 250 pascal of "ram air" benefit?

Fashion It's all entertaining. Do you remember those little plastic foils we used to add to our windscreen wipers to hold them down when speeding through rainstorms?

It's called Ludicrous mode.
www.autotrader.com/car-shopping/ludicrous-mode-ludicrous-plus-mode

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FormulaNova said..

Mark _australia said..
Talking about 80 or 90 for no reason at all on the highway . .... and then 115 at the overtaking lane aargghhhhh

I am pretty sure this is an effect from people getting into two lanes and feeling safer, so they speed up to the speed limit.. and then slow down to 20 below once it gets back to one lane. I am sure these people are clueless about why they are doing it and just doing it instinctively.

I have tried something novel once or twice when towing. I got to the overtaking lanes and actually slowed down, as I figured it was a chance for people to get past to me because it really bugs me when some moron towing a caravan at 80kmph speeds up to over 100 when they hit the overtaking lanes.

That's it for sure. It's not deliberate. I remember when the Supercars came to Canberra. There was a widish road bordering the Parliamentary triangle. Folks used to speed along it at 70kph plus. Parliamentary staffers engaged in inappropriate texting. Always a danger of a head on collision. For the supercar event the northbound lane was hemmed in with concrete barriers to form the non-overtaking section of the back straight. But it was open to the public for a few days before the event. Despite now being infinitely safer, speeds dropped to about 50 kph.


Our neighbours reported speeds on our residential street have noticeably dropped since we moved in. We brought in that east coast habit of parallel parking. Over here with no rain the gutters can be low and are no obstacle to just propping on the nature strip at any old angle. With no parallel parkers our street looked like a highway. It catches on. Once one person starts parking properly others do the same.

Parking is a cultural thing. There's one street in our suburb where everyone parallel parks. At the other end of the same street, other side of a cross road, all the cars are up over the curb on the dusty nature strip!

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Ian K said..

FormulaNova said..

Ian K said..
Why don't they put a "ram air" snorkel on that Trackhawk? It'd blow that Tesla away then. For sure.

I think I might add a few snorkels to my cars and drive past you one day and wait for the rage to kick in. You don't like them do you?

A neighbour 2 doors down had a Tesla a few years ago and said there was some mode that you put it into where it just gave it everything and it was scary quick. A dangerous feature to use around town I expect as a lot of people will not expect you to be able to move that fast and will change into your lane before they realise you are already there or just about to be.

It's not that I don't like them. it just intrigues me that they have become so popular as a fashion item. The charging, trumpeting elephant. A good look.

Air is pushed down the inlet by atmospheric pressure 101,325 pascals. The static pressure of air at a typical 4wd speed of 20 m/sec (72kph) is 250 pascal. The manufacturers know this. All original equipment snorkels have the inlet to the rear. Toyota, Ineos, Mercedes ...( though I think I've seen a toyota-branded one succumbing to fashion). Not sure of the reason manufacturers face the inlet rearwards, maybe a little cyclonic aircleaner effect of dust being less inclined to turn a corner, or maybe the turbulence interferes with the MAFS? And you still can't drive through water! The extra air-resistance around the A pillar - carefully designed in a wind tunnel - would surely negate any 250 pascal of "ram air" benefit?

Fashion It's all entertaining. Do you remember those little plastic foils we used to add to our windscreen wipers to hold them down when speeding through rainstorms?

It's called Ludicrous mode.
www.autotrader.com/car-shopping/ludicrous-mode-ludicrous-plus-mode

they face them rearwards so they don't ingest 50 + litres of water when you hit that bonnet deep puddle at 120kph (so im led to believe)

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Ian K said..
Our neighbours reported speeds on our residential street have noticeably dropped since we moved in. We brought in that east coast habit of parallel parking. Over here with no rain the gutters can be low and are no obstacle to just propping on the nature strip at any old angle. With no parallel parkers our street looked like a highway. It catches on. Once one person starts parking properly others do the same.

Parking is a cultural thing. There's one street in our suburb where everyone parallel parks. At the other end of the same street, other side of a cross road, all the cars are up over the curb on the dusty nature strip!

Yeah, parallel parking is not a thing over here is it! I sometimes get surprised myself when I see it as I am so used to not seeing it now. I think it is so uncommon that some people then don't realise you can't do it legally if the space is not wide enough (3m I think?).

I remember driving over here, and stopping on the side of the road in a country town, only to have some genius come up behind me and beep the horn at me to move. Despite a completely empty lane and absolutely no other cars around. I guess if you are not up on the nature strip you aren't parked, which is ironic as that's then illegal parking.

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I guess if you are not up on the nature strip you aren't parked, which is ironic as that's then illegal parking.

The rules are different here