In the other thread with a similar title, it was suggested that we don't care enough about what's happening locally.
What are people thoughts on WA's new firearms legislation and the buy back

www.police.wa.gov.au/About-Us/Our-Agency/Police-Licensing-Services/Firearms-Licensing/Firearms-Act-Reform

www.wa.gov.au/government/media-statements/Cook-Labor-Government/Historic-reform-to-deliver-toughest-firearms-laws-in-the-nation-20231016

I live in the CBD and don't have a firearm so have no dog in this gunfight, but it seems like over-regulation and overkill. There is already plenty of legislation in this area and there is no issue of gun violence in WA. Of the sports shooters and farmers I know they are all responsible people who have to jump through a lot of hoops to overcome a perceived risk that doesn't exist.

If stealing firearms is a problem, address theft and organised crime rather than making owning firearms more difficult. There are better and more urgent ways to spend $65m.

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IanR said..
In the other thread with a similar title, it was suggested that we don't care enough about what's happening locally.

I guess i did kind of suggest that but I was more intereseted in the over-caring about things that happen elsewhere, which is a social media driven phenomenon (I think). Good luck with your discourse, I'm guessing a "vaccines kill more people than firearms" post inbound in 5...4...3...2....

Vaccines kill more people than firearms. Firearms only killed 49,000 people in USA in 2021. Covid killed over 450,000 people in USA in 2021. Not even a contest.

There, do I get a prize for posting first?

Wait, what do you mean I don't understand difference between a disease and the vaccine against it? SMH!

ps have you ever fired a fully automatic machine gun? It's freaking exhilarating. I want one!

machinegunamericaorlando.com/experiences-new/

of course you have to select the "man card" or you're not a red blooded American man

Definitely worth a discussion.

Obviously the majority of the population doesn't own any, and quite possibly have no desire to. Equally the barriers to acquiring them may already be seen as sufficient to deter casual or impulse acquisitions.

There's definitely more to know and discuss when talking about the difference between firearms as personal weapons and tools/equipment for businesses to operate.
In this state, there is such a wide range of applications where a firearm is necessary.

It does seem as though some people expect them to be treated the same as vehicles.

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CH3MTR4IL5 said..
I live in the CBD and don't have a firearm so have no dog in this gunfight, but it seems like over-regulation and overkill. There is already plenty of legislation in this area and there is no issue of gun violence in WA. Of the sports shooters and farmers I know they are all responsible people who have to jump through a lot of hoops to overcome a perceived risk that doesn't exist.

If stealing firearms is a problem, address theft and organised crime rather than making owning firearms more difficult. There are better and more urgent ways to spend $65m.

I think like most people you have no interest in them and therefore unaware of many of the loop holes that surround them. The legislation changes will have no effect on the majority of gun owner.
The government is limiting the number of guns a licence holder may have under one licence to 5. Farmers and Club shooter can have 10. If you are competing in State or National events you can apply for more

I think you might be surprised how many people own firearms in large city's. There is no compatible site for WA but this is an example for suburban Sydney

www.toomanyguns.org/2134?rq=2134

Here are a few recent Perth Firearm incidents

www.news.com.au/national/crime/bunker-concealing-guns-and-ammunition-discovered-beneath-couch-in-perth-home/news-story/a24d301828787a23bf6645848506e8b6


www.watoday.com.au/national/western-australia/teenage-boy-arrested-after-gun-fired-at-perth-school-20230524-p5dayp.html#

www.abc.net.au/news/2021-12-20/sniper-who-murdered-ex-rebels-bikie-boss-nick-martin-sentenced/100713382

I do hope they do implement the regular mental health checks but I doubt it because the police cannot even keep up with the amount of guns safes that are required to be checked


www.9news.com.au/national/gun-owners-in-western-australia-to-face-mental-health-screening-under-firearms-law-reforms/a7e4f796-e971-44e9-9e7c-37edd286ea19

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IanR said..

CH3MTR4IL5 said..
I live in the CBD and don't have a firearm so have no dog in this gunfight, but it seems like over-regulation and overkill. There is already plenty of legislation in this area and there is no issue of gun violence in WA. Of the sports shooters and farmers I know they are all responsible people who have to jump through a lot of hoops to overcome a perceived risk that doesn't exist.

If stealing firearms is a problem, address theft and organised crime rather than making owning firearms more difficult. There are better and more urgent ways to spend $65m.

I think like most people you have no interest in them and therefore unaware of many of the loop holes that surround them. The legislation changes will have no effect on the majority of gun owner.
The government is limiting the number of guns a licence holder may have under one licence to 5. Farmers and Club shooter can have 10. If you are competing in State or National events you can apply for more

I think you might be surprised how many people own firearms in large city's. There is no compatible site for WA but this is an example for suburban Sydney

www.toomanyguns.org/2134?rq=2134

Here are a few recent Perth Firearm incidents

www.news.com.au/national/crime/bunker-concealing-guns-and-ammunition-discovered-beneath-couch-in-perth-home/news-story/a24d301828787a23bf6645848506e8b6


www.watoday.com.au/national/western-australia/teenage-boy-arrested-after-gun-fired-at-perth-school-20230524-p5dayp.html#

www.abc.net.au/news/2021-12-20/sniper-who-murdered-ex-rebels-bikie-boss-nick-martin-sentenced/100713382

I do hope they do implement the regular mental health checks but I doubt it because the police cannot even keep up with the amount of guns safes that are required to be checked


www.9news.com.au/national/gun-owners-in-western-australia-to-face-mental-health-screening-under-firearms-law-reforms/a7e4f796-e971-44e9-9e7c-37edd286ea19

I am familiar with it as I do know a lot of sports shooters and farmers. Out of the three examples you have given, 2 are organised crime with unlicensed guns- these are typically coming from overseas and interstate. Increased legislation is not going to prevent or change these scenarios.

The school incident relates to the licenced gun owner not securing their weapons responsibly. This legislation won't do much for that scenario either.

so what problem does this legislation solve? We don't have a gun violence problem in WA at present.

I agree on the mental health side, statistically this is how people die from guns.

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IanR said..
In the other thread with a similar title, it was suggested that we don't care enough about what's happening locally.
What are people thoughts on WA's new firearms legislation and the buy back

www.police.wa.gov.au/About-Us/Our-Agency/Police-Licensing-Services/Firearms-Licensing/Firearms-Act-Reform

www.wa.gov.au/government/media-statements/Cook-Labor-Government/Historic-reform-to-deliver-toughest-firearms-laws-in-the-nation-20231016

If this is a pro guns or no guns question for W.A. right now, I would vote no guns.

Interesting article on gun ownership in Israel popped up recently.

www.abc.net.au/news/2024-03-14/israelis-buying-guns-and-carrying-weapons-in-public-foreign/103572200

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myscreenname said..

IanR said..
In the other thread with a similar title, it was suggested that we don't care enough about what's happening locally.
What are people thoughts on WA's new firearms legislation and the buy back

www.police.wa.gov.au/About-Us/Our-Agency/Police-Licensing-Services/Firearms-Licensing/Firearms-Act-Reform

www.wa.gov.au/government/media-statements/Cook-Labor-Government/Historic-reform-to-deliver-toughest-firearms-laws-in-the-nation-20231016

If this is a pro guns or no guns question for W.A. right now, I would vote no guns.

Interesting article on gun ownership in Israel popped up recently.

www.abc.net.au/news/2024-03-14/israelis-buying-guns-and-carrying-weapons-in-public-foreign/103572200

I only scrolled the article so maybe I missed it, but the writer did seem to omit Stolen Palestine's mandatory service policy, so all of these "parents" are actually former soldiers.

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CH3MTR4IL5 said..

Out of the three examples you have given, 2 are organised crime with unlicensed guns- these are typically coming from overseas and interstate. Increased legislation is not going to prevent or change these scenarios.

In the case of David Letizia He was a licensed firearm owner and I have found no connection to organised crime but he may have been hit in the head a lot

The Person who assassinated Nick Martin name has been suppressed but he was a WA resident and most likely a licensed firearm owner as the barrel of the rifle was exchanged to a gun shop which has been a crucial piece of evidence that convicted them

Did you not look at the example from a random Sydney suburb one owner who is not a registered collector owned 181 firearm

Why Does anyone need an arsenal that big in there home in Sydney

Surely any hobbyist shooter requires no more than 5 firearms

Most farmer I have meet in Oz only have about 5 firearm to cover vermin control

I would be interested to hear how you mates justify the need for more Firearms than the legislation allows

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IanR said..

CH3MTR4IL5 said..

Out of the three examples you have given, 2 are organised crime with unlicensed guns- these are typically coming from overseas and interstate. Increased legislation is not going to prevent or change these scenarios.

In the case of David Letizia He was a licensed firearm owner and I have found no connection to organised crime but he may have been hit in the head a lot

The Person who assassinated Nick Martin name has been suppressed but he was a WA resident and most likely a licensed firearm owner as the barrel of the rifle was exchanged to a gun shop which has been a crucial piece of evidence that convicted them

Did you not look at the example from a random Sydney suburb one owner who is not a registered collector owned 181 firearm

Why Does anyone need an arsenal that big in there home in Sydney

Surely any hobbyist shooter requires no more than 5 firearms

Most farmer I have meet in Oz only have about 5 firearm to cover vermin control

I would be interested to hear how you mates justify the need for more Firearms than the legislation allows

Surely no windsurfer needs no more than 5 boards, but I have more, I hate people telling other people what they need.

Its stinks of envy and/or socialism, we will all be living in a 3x3 box with a sink and a dunny if we only have what we "need"

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cammd said..

IanR said..

CH3MTR4IL5 said..

Out of the three examples you have given, 2 are organised crime with unlicensed guns- these are typically coming from overseas and interstate. Increased legislation is not going to prevent or change these scenarios.

In the case of David Letizia He was a licensed firearm owner and I have found no connection to organised crime but he may have been hit in the head a lot

The Person who assassinated Nick Martin name has been suppressed but he was a WA resident and most likely a licensed firearm owner as the barrel of the rifle was exchanged to a gun shop which has been a crucial piece of evidence that convicted them

Did you not look at the example from a random Sydney suburb one owner who is not a registered collector owned 181 firearm

Why Does anyone need an arsenal that big in there home in Sydney

Surely any hobbyist shooter requires no more than 5 firearms

Most farmer I have meet in Oz only have about 5 firearm to cover vermin control

I would be interested to hear how you mates justify the need for more Firearms than the legislation allows

Surely no windsurfer needs no more than 5 boards, but I have more, I hate people telling other people what they need.

Its stinks of envy and/or socialism, we will all be living in a 3x3 box with a sink and a dunny if we only have what we "need"

Yeah, but I sleep so much easier knowing that the cops are the good windsurfers and they've got most of the boards.

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IanR said..

I would be interested to hear how you mates justify the need for more Firearms than the legislation allows

I personally can't see any need for hundreds of guns, but your examples keep going back to Sydney when we are discussing changes to WA legislation.

there are around 390,000 registered guns in WA and this law change will impact 13,000. How will that make things any safer?

again, don't really care but there is a cost to implementing this, and it is large, and it does not seem to be informed from any evidence-based argument. As every party involved has stated, it is introducing an arbitrary limit, just because.

www.abc.net.au/news/2023-10-16/wa-proposed-new-gun-laws-details-revealed/102979810

In WA there are 90 000 Licensed Firearms owner that posses 390 000 Firearms
178 of those own more than 25 firearms, 25 of those own more than 100
These are not Gunsmiths, Registered collectors or Business but private individuals.
It is less than 1 percent of firearms owners are effected by the limitation

On average in WA 1 gun is stolen every day at least.

How bad does gun violence have to get before it becomes an issue for you

As for the Sailboard analogy
They are not designed with the express intent of killing living beings. Obviously there need to be more control around something that is

I suppose having a gun pointed with intent at you does change your perspective.

How hard is it to get a firearm licence these days?

Easier or harder than getting a car licence?

I would say it's way easier to get a gun licence
Here are the requirements

www.ssaawa.org.au/faq/how-do-i-apply-for-a-firearms-licence

Another senseless shooting in Perth over the weekend
Two innocent women shot by a Gun nut with a registered hand gun
When will people start realising that all gun owners need regular mental health checks

Sad story, but I'm not going to resit my driving test every time someone else crashes a car.
You'll need a better strategy to eliminate these seemingly rare occurrences.

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psychojoe said..
Sad story, but I'm not going to resit my driving test every time someone else crashes a car.
You'll need a better strategy to eliminate these seemingly rare occurrences.

Exactly the same as the DV "crisis". Will we need to submit to mental health assessments soon because we are the "wrong" gender?

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IanR said..
Another senseless shooting in Perth over the weekend
Two innocent women shot by a Gun nut with a registered hand gun
When will people start realising that all gun owners need regular mental health checks

Yeah, I would support that. I am guessing that plenty of gun owners would also be fine with that. I suspect that modern day life is so stressfull for some people and having easy access to a gun makes it a risk. Potentially its a chance to actually fix emotional/mental issues instead of letting them fester.

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Subsonic said..

psychojoe said..
Sad story, but I'm not going to resit my driving test every time someone else crashes a car.
You'll need a better strategy to eliminate these seemingly rare occurrences.

Exactly the same as the DV "crisis". Will we need to submit to mental health assessments soon because we are the "wrong" gender?

"Not every man but always a man"

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psychojoe said..

Subsonic said..

psychojoe said..
Sad story, but I'm not going to resit my driving test every time someone else crashes a car.
You'll need a better strategy to eliminate these seemingly rare occurrences.

Exactly the same as the DV "crisis". Will we need to submit to mental health assessments soon because we are the "wrong" gender?

"Not every man but always a man"

I am in two minds on these sort of things. We are much more dangerous to women than women are to men. It's just one of those things. But its hard to not feel targeted just for being a man, and I would hope that the people out there direct solutions to these problems to the people that need it instead of saying it's all men's fault; 'fix it'.

I was watching something on TV the other day where they were talking about domestic violence in indigenous areas. They were wringing their hands and saying 'it has to stop', but I am not sure there was actually anything active about what they were saying.

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psychojoe

"Not every man but always a man"

www.aic.gov.au/sites/default/files/2020-05/ti584_female_perpetrated_domestic_violence-v2.pdf

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psychojoe said..
Sad story, but I'm not going to resit my driving test every time someone else crashes a car.
You'll need a better strategy to eliminate these seemingly rare occurrences.

What is your point in deliberately trying to force such a ridiculous analogy? There's no way that is anywhere near the same.

Car = mode of transport that can be used for commerce, tourism, recreation and, in very limited situations, a weapon.

Firearm = Weapon that can be used as such in almost limitless situations and, in limited situations, for recreation.

And the fact our road toll is higher? Not an excuse to ignore firearm violence

Yep, the President's son gets convicted of buying a gun while addicted to drugs.

And you think that's a reason the USA should NOT make it harder to purchase firearms?

Yet they're still taking him to court in September on tax charges.

Yep, definitely going easy on him.

Poor guy, he is just another victim of colonialism and climate change. Not his fault he got in trouble

Seems we have a few here in Australia too