Hi there
I am looking for an onshore board (85kg) in the 90+ lt category for 4.5 to 5.7 sails mainly I have a fanatic grip 82 lt and i am very satisfied with its planning potential (great) jumping potential(very good) and waveriding (not the most radical but super).
I am looking for a good mix of early planning good jumps speed in the turn and good waveriding in weak onshore waves. I ve tried the super mini quatro but didnt like it .My options are Flikka custom 93lt 23 rocker not so good in tight back foot turns average control and not so good for aerial transition in the wave BUT good for early planning jumps very light 6 kg Witchcraft Reaper 93 not so gripy but good for jumps early planning fluid sytle in waveriding good for aerial transitions in the wave mainly backfoot waveriding Quatro cube 2020 93 or 98(not sure) pretty good in every aspect early planning jumps aerial transitions in the wave keeps speed in the turn power quad mode for waveriding back or front foot Great control in the wave or high wind
Thanks in advance

- Full budget or looking for pre-owned (I despise that saying)
- guessing not just a larger Fanatic?
- glad to see you actually disliked a board & Quatro boards are pretty wave focussed for more ideal conditions
- perhaps JP thruster 93lt (?) but not many second hand or Severne (might be a few about)

Select to expand quote

Snapfigure said..
Hi there
I am looking for an onshore board (85kg) in the 90+ lt category for 4.5 to 5.7 sails mainly I have a fanatic grip 82 lt and i am very satisfied with its planning potential (great) jumping potential(very good) and waveriding (not the most radical but super).
I am looking for a good mix of early planning good jumps speed in the turn and good waveriding in weak onshore waves. I ve tried the super mini quatro but didnt like it .My options are Flikka custom 93lt 23 rocker not so good in tight back foot turns average control and not so good for aerial transition in the wave BUT good for early planning jumps very light 6 kg Witchcraft Reaper 93 not so gripy but good for jumps early planning fluid sytle in waveriding good for aerial transitions in the wave mainly backfoot waveriding Quatro cube 2020 93 or 98(not sure) pretty good in every aspect early planning jumps aerial transitions in the wave keeps speed in the turn power quad mode for waveriding back or front foot Great control in the wave or high wind
Thanks in advance

Since you like the Grip, what about Fanatic Stubby TE 89? I found the Stubby allot more nimble than the Quatro Supermini, which is a fun board but a bit dull perhaps for you?

Goya 92 Surfwave thruster b tha ducks nuts for those conditions

About the stubby and parallel rails (narrow boards) Some thoughts from a very experienced guy
When the outline is rounder, wider mid section and narrower tail. that is why I call it a compact shape, not a stubby.To get planing you have a wider midsection and when going fast you use the narrower tail. And the rounder outline turns better.Basically the square stubby is a mistake. When you have a flat rockered windsurf board (compared to surfing), you need outline taper. Outline taper gives a bigger wind range and turns better. It was just for marketing, they are always desperate for something new. You also see these brands going back to round outlines now. JP already went back the next year.

About quatro "Quatro boards are pretty wave focussed for more ideal conditions" thats exactly what i am afraid of but taboul is the best quad fin boards shaper super mini was a breakthrough for quatro and onshore shapes The new cube is a combination of the old cube and old super mini(discontinued) the power quad speed turns claim from quatro even in onshore is a temptation (anyone feedback?)

About the bigger fanatic grip 92 Could be a very good solution i am not sure for jumps early planning but taking into consideration the smaller grip must be ok

I have the 2017 Quatro Cube as my cross onshore wave board. I only sail in less than ideal conditions. I am extremely happy with it in those conditions. It is as good as or better than any onshore biased waveboard I've tried. I previously owned the Fanatic Stubby as my cross onshore board and the Cube is as early planing but definitely a better wave riding board. I found it holds speed better than the Stubby in cross onshore DTL bottom turns.

Since my board came out at the same time as the mini thruster, I would assume the 2020 Cube is even better in cross onshore conditions if it has absorbed some of the onshore attributes of the mini thruster.

Select to expand quote

Snapfigure said..
About the stubby and parallel rails (narrow boards) Some thoughts from a very experienced guy
When the outline is rounder, wider mid section and narrower tail. that is why I call it a compact shape, not a stubby.To get planing you have a wider midsection and when going fast you use the narrower tail. And the rounder outline turns better.Basically the square stubby is a mistake. When you have a flat rockered windsurf board (compared to surfing), you need outline taper. Outline taper gives a bigger wind range and turns better. It was just for marketing, they are always desperate for something new. You also see these brands going back to round outlines now. JP already went back the next year.

About quatro "Quatro boards are pretty wave focussed for more ideal conditions" thats exactly what i am afraid of but taboul is the best quad fin boards shaper super mini was a breakthrough for quatro and onshore shapes The new cube is a combination of the old cube and old super mini(discontinued) the power quad speed turns claim from quatro even in onshore is a temptation (anyone feedback?)

About the bigger fanatic grip 92 Could be a very good solution i am not sure for jumps early planning but taking into consideration the smaller grip must be ok

That is a very broad statement & very subjective. In fact as far as it being a mistake, I think you are wrong. The parallel rail concept is firmly rooted in real world experience. Though the square nose may have fallen back out of fashion with some brands, the parallel rails & short tail remain - for instance the whole Severne line. The Fanatic Stubby has been tested & refined over several seasons now & still a favorite board for the Team in certain conditions. Adam Lewis even rode at Hookipa during the Aloha. The fact is stubby shapes work well, especially in crap conditions. They are an acquired taste though, that not everyone likes. Curvy outlines & pulled in tails will always have a place & definitely have a different feel. There have been some which seem to be very versatile shapes like the JP Ultimate, Quatro Pyramid & Goya Custom as well as your Fanatic Grip which all have a very tapered outline. Regarding Quatro I have talked to KT about the new Cube & one of the things he mentioned was more parallel rails & set back stance compared to last years shape. If you like the feel of curvier tapered outline & pulled in tail you will probably prefer a Pyramid or Goya, or of course the larger Grip. However, your first post specifically mentioned "an onshore board with early planning, good jumps, speed in the turn and good waveriding in weak onshore waves" ... These qualities perfectly fit the brief for boards such as the Fanatic Stubby, Severne Nano, or JP Slate... They may not fit your style or preference but IMHO they are no "mistake".

I use the predecessor to the Cube (Quad LS) 95L in those conditions. Personally I think its excellent in 5.8-5.2 and manageable in 4.7 at the same body weight.

Another local has a 2018 Cube and it seems much the same just shorter.

I'm picking up a newer 85L and found a good deal on a Quantum V3 which is supposed to fit a similar design concept. Might be worth looking at in the bigger sizes.

Select to expand quote

gorgesailor said..

That is a very broad statement & very subjective.............................. These qualities perfectly fit the brief for boards such as the Fanatic Stubby, Severne Nano, or JP Slate... They may not fit your style or preference but IMHO they are no "mistake".

I am not argueing about that. This is just a statement from a well known respected shaper I dont have the knowledge to either agree or disagree with the word mistake. Indeed fanatic stubby jp slate are excellent for crap onshore conditions but they have some negative aspects IMO ex wind range very wide tail planning in lulls due to the narrow midsection BUT it could be a perfect option for the onshore crap i am looking for Personally i like more the curvier outline WIth fanatic grip i can do a full speed carving turn in the rails even in side onshore mush and due to the straight rocker speed jump high Planning ability is also excellent for onshore. The new quatro cube seems very good in both front foot carve turns (not 100% sure) or back foot tight turns with top speed in the turn capable of aerial transitions in the wave and with very good planning ability and jumps with TOP control in chop high wind .JP Ultimate, Quatro Pyramid & Goya Custom are for better waves not so good for onshore. Anyway thank you

Select to expand quote

Snapfigure said..

gorgesailor said..

That is a very broad statement & very subjective.............................. These qualities perfectly fit the brief for boards such as the Fanatic Stubby, Severne Nano, or JP Slate... They may not fit your style or preference but IMHO they are no "mistake".

I am not argueing about that. This is just a statement from a well known respected shaper I dont have the knowledge to either agree or disagree with the word mistake. Indeed fanatic stubby jp slate are excellent for crap onshore conditions but they have some negative aspects IMO ex wind range very wide tail planning in lulls due to the narrow midsection BUT it could be a perfect option for the onshore crap i am looking for Personally i like more the curvier outline WIth fanatic grip i can do a full speed carving turn in the rails even in side onshore mush and due to the straight rocker speed jump high Planning ability is also excellent for onshore. The new quatro cube seems very good in both front foot carve turns (not 100% sure) or back foot tight turns with top speed in the turn capable of aerial transitions in the wave and with very good planning ability and jumps with TOP control in chop high wind .JP Ultimate, Quatro Pyramid & Goya Custom are for better waves not so good for onshore. Anyway thank you

Understood & agreed. Just felt like the shaper's comment was a bit dogmatic(they often are...). It's always best when we get to actually test a prospective board, because often it does not feel quite the way we imagine - even if we have a pretty good idea of the technical details... Alas, it's difficult to get to test a board these days...

German Surf magazine did test the 2020 Waveboards including Grip 92 and Cube 93.
The Cube seems a little better in onshore conditions regarding planing and drive through turns, the Grip turns a little better.

From my own experience I could recommend the Goya Thruster for what you're looking for. I use the 99 as my smallest board, having 91 kg.
The 99 liters never felt big powered up. The planing power of the board is amazing, perfect for onshore. But also turning quite well on pushing sideshore waves.
The 2020 Goya Custom 3 should have kept this characteristic.

German Surf magazine did test the 2020 Waveboards including Grip 92 and Cube 93.
The Cube seems a little better in onshore conditions regarding planing and drive through turns, the Grip turns a little better.

From my own experience I could recommend the Goya Thruster for what you're looking for. I use the 99 as my smallest board, having 91 kg.
The 99 liters never felt big powered up. The planing power of the board is amazing, perfect for onshore. But also turning quite well on pushing sideshore waves.
The 2020 Goya Custom 3 should have kept this characteristic.

Select to expand quote

Snapfigure said..
About the stubby and parallel rails (narrow boards) Some thoughts from a very experienced guy
When the outline is rounder, wider mid section and narrower tail. that is why I call it a compact shape, not a stubby.To get planing you have a wider midsection and when going fast you use the narrower tail. And the rounder outline turns better.Basically the square stubby is a mistake. When you have a flat rockered windsurf board (compared to surfing), you need outline taper. Outline taper gives a bigger wind range and turns better. It was just for marketing, they are always desperate for something new. You also see these brands going back to round outlines now. JP already went back the next year.

About quatro "Quatro boards are pretty wave focussed for more ideal conditions" thats exactly what i am afraid of but taboul is the best quad fin boards shaper super mini was a breakthrough for quatro and onshore shapes The new cube is a combination of the old cube and old super mini(discontinued) the power quad speed turns claim from quatro even in onshore is a temptation (anyone feedback?)

About the bigger fanatic grip 92 Could be a very good solution i am not sure for jumps early planning but taking into consideration the smaller grip must be ok

Some interesting points in that description but also a lot I don't agree with.
The guy didn't mention the need for rocker lines and outlines to work together. You can't say that a tapered or curved outline turns better than a parallel outline without considering how it works with a certain rocker line.
There's also a bunch of things to consider with rocker lines. Tail rocker and tail kick are not the only thing to determine how early or late a board will plane and how well it will turn.
You need to think about entry rocker, nose rocker as well as where your flat sections and angle changes are.
All the elements of wave board design need to work together.
I don't think it's right to say a certain style of board is s mistake. Some are designed well and some are not.

cheers, Hoops

Windtech Magic Bullet 95 does it all

For side onshore days I'd recommend a Severne Dyno 95. They seem to have taken over on our beach as the board to have for just those conditions.
It's simply a lovely early planing wave board that is also surprisingly loose on the wave face.

Yea an amazing board but still a bit of a compromise. The OP said good waveriding so it seems he means proper waves and just a bit faster to plane than many?

I'd say Cube for sure out of his list.

Select to expand quote

Snapfigure said..
About the stubby and parallel rails (narrow boards) Some thoughts from a very experienced guy
When the outline is rounder, wider mid section and narrower tail. that is why I call it a compact shape, not a stubby.To get planing you have a wider midsection and when going fast you use the narrower tail. And the rounder outline turns better.Basically the square stubby is a mistake. When you have a flat rockered windsurf board (compared to surfing), you need outline taper. Outline taper gives a bigger wind range and turns better. It was just for marketing, they are always desperate for something new. You also see these brands going back to round outlines now. JP already went back the next year.
.......

Those are interesting comments - but I wouldn't quite agree.

If you just look at the plan shape of the board then, for sure, having a wide mid section means the minute you bank the board over the buried mid rail acts like a brake in the water and the board turns towards that side. But a board will also turn on its rocker line and with good sailor drive and with narrow boards you just need to commit with your weight more.
So we might say that boards that are wider in the middle will suit those intermediates just learning to gybe and starting to turn on waves, and a narrow tail may help for better control.
Where the parallel-sided hull shape comes into its own is in being narrower overall, which makes it faster, and the short length is better for tighter carved turns and for backfoot 'pivot' top turns.

The early planing is not about overall board width some much as a function of the hull width further back, under the straps - and that's why stubbies often have a relatively wide tail which is then pinched in for the very rear section. A wide tail can still be just as fast but will also support sailor weight in the lulls and transitions. You can usually keep good control as long as you don't sail the board over-finned.

Early planing is also a function of rocker line, and of course about having sufficient board volume for the weight of the sailor carried (float!).
Plus early planing is always about sailor technique and if there's a move back to traditional (longer and wider) shapes that's perhaps because intermediates find the step down to a narrow board that is just 215cms long a bit too much .

Most of us are more likely to enjoy a board that is easier to sail but the more active sailor can still reap rewards from a more radical stubby or compact shape. A lot of the new boards also need to be sailed off the front foot more and they won't work so well with sailors who still like to drive a board off the back foot.

Indeed Goya offers a very nice board What was the goya quad up to 2017 - a perfect all-rounder - is now the thruster.

Tail width a 30cm Goya 98 38.4 Cube 98 39 fanatic stubby 82 40.5 Jp slate 87 38.5 Witchcraft reaper 97 40.5 cm

JP wave slate maybe a little better for jumps ( maybe goya is a liitle better for waveriding in better waves) could also be a good choice with 5 fin box Witchcraft Reaper is a very good option too(maybe better waveriding) in the slate stubby category (category of early planning less carving more fluid back foot waveriding style more jumping)

The new Cube seems to combine everything
Here is a test www.2xs.co.uk/tested-the-new-2020-quatro-cube/
The words in the test : versatility -- jump high -- Cubes" comfortably turn in the pocket ---- this year's and previous versions of the Cube is the approach and performance in soft sloppy waves or waves without verticality ----- Lovely carving turns where you feel like you are accelerating through the turn.---- Easier and more rewarding turning capability in poor quality (less vertical) waves.---The rail just wants to engage and grip- Maintains all other high quality aspects of the previous version of the "Cube".
I wish a board could do all these in side onshore I hope its true
98 is a good option but i am thinking of 93 with bigger fins if needed for extra planning ability that will turn better

Mate you've got a fanatic you know and like just get the bigger version I'm sure it will have similar feel to your other one.
Reviews and tests are biased and subjective, most boards are good these days. If your going to follow reviews. list what's most important to your requirements in order of importance eg early planing, good top end and so on. Find the best reviewed match and go for it
Forget all this tail width measurements stuff.
Everyone is going to say how good their own board is as it's so subjective.

R1der I partially agree with you as nowadays a board costs a fortune you cannot test it before you buy it in most cases and Personally i like to keep boards for a very long time 6 years or more (or otherwise you lose a lot of money).
I am trying to read between the lines in order to find the best choice.
I did that with fanatic grip and it worked. Feedback is always good.
I know its a bit subjective (i dont agree with the term so subjective). For example fanatic grip in the surf magazine scores 1 out of five in jumps but in the french wind and planchemag says its ok as for me it s very good. I can t imagine how good for example a jp wave slate jumps. The fanatic grip in bigger sizes is a very good choice but in lighter winds a design more onshore oriented is preferable (for early planning jumps keep speed in the turns and maintaining good wave-riding characteristics .Cube says does that with a good level of wave-riding. 93 lt with bigger fins is what i am thinking of I appreciate older cube feedback from you.
A custom board could be a solution too if you trust the shaper of the brand Like in the past 80ies 90ies the price of production boards have reached (maybe they cost more) that of a custom (like flikka withcraft ....) In addition custom offer a much better construction.
Anyway thank you

Sounds like snapfigure needs to take their fave board to a custom manufacturer and say "make me one of these but a bit bigger or looser or earlier planing" and be done with it.

It might not have missing parts, dry cloth sections, paint fall off, inserts pull or leak etc..... and might not cost $3000

Choose your stick


from 20 E

23.90 ?/?

Love that a small Italian Boardbuilder with global ambitions has come here and asked for advice with board choice, only to bag other established brands, shapers and manufacturers under the guise of a newbie initially and then to throw wicked witches and brooms into our faces when questions are posed...

Select to expand quote

baldrick said..
Love that a small Italian Boardbuilder with global ambitions has come here and asked for advice with board choice, only to bag other established brands, shapers and manufacturers under the guise of a newbie initially and then to throw wicked witches and brooms into our faces when questions are posed...

Which Italian board-builder are you referring to amico ?????????
bag ....... my established fanatic and seeking to bag another established cube ........
Regarding structure IMO custom board on average has much less structural defects than mass Chinese cobra production. Regular custom board could be twice as strong as semi custom Advanced custom structure Heavy duty dynema x10 times (even against rocks no water inside) I know sailors who needed 2 semi custom boards a year and moved to custom solution
But semi custom production structure is fine for most people
If i need 2500$ for a semi custom board which will cost almost half price one year later that is unacceptable IMO If we are moving to a noble windsurfing sport That is not ok That is my opinion and i am sorry if i dont agree with you

Thank you all Happy New Year

Hi

Nice one !
Have you gone 93 or 98 in the end ?
Seems happy on a 4.7.
I am contemplating the same board to replace my Starboard UltraKode 93 2018.
Was initially going for the cube 93 2020 but saw that the width of the 98 (60.5) is actually narrower that my SB 93 (61) with marginal volume difference. At 85kg the SB worked great on a 4.7.

Cube 98 would do 4.7 to 5.7 for me.

happy to get your feedback.

PPMAUI

Reasons for the 98
plus
-better planning ability
-Planning through lulls
-marginal winds
-Cube is the best in control in strong wind,chop and turns so few more liters is ok
-for sails 4.7 to 6 ideal
negative
2020 model less wavy than 2019 so compared to the 93 2020 it performs less on the wave but still very good (just 39 tail)

Reasons for the 93
plus
Better wave riding perfomance
Better windrange 4 to 5.7
negatives
-worse planning ability
-worse in planning through lulls

Thx Snapfigure