Hello everyone

I had been using neil pryde equipment for 10 years and overall I was quite happy with it. However the great looks and raving reviews of severne gear got me into the process of gradually updating my equipment with the red sails. First rig I bought was a 2015 8.6 overdrive, a 190-240 alu race boom and a 460 SDM90 mast. The following year I added a 7.0 NCX to my quiver. All equipment bought new. Generally both rigs are performing admirably but I do have some concerns regarding their quality/durability – issues I never had with neil pryde gear and I believe they are worth noting.

First I noticed that the grip foam of the boom started falling apart even from day 1. I have to add that I mostly rig the sail on pebbles but still my x6 neil pryde boom was going strong for at least 10 years on the same rigging area. And then, last summer, after a couple of days sailing overpowered I got seriously soar palms – I am talking about craters at the metacarpal-phalange joint area that took at least 2 weeks to heal! Well this had not happened to me before! I don't know whether the alu race's tube thickness is responsible for that (is seems a bit thicker), but I seriously believe the boom foam should be made both more durable and softer to the hands…

Then it is the ropes. Well, either the clew rope is too thick or the holes on the boom edge are too narrow. Anyway I find it really difficult passing it through. Next it is the rope on the extension (race HD); it started falling apart on the edges (making it really difficult to pass it through the pulleys) and last summer (season 2 – approximately 30 times in the water) it got cut while I was rigging the sail. Thank god that didn’t happen in the water.

Now regarding the mast (460 SDM90): Last summer the two parts started getting stuck to one another giving me a hard time separating them after each session, although I had made certain the inner tube was perfectly clean and free from salt and sand. Eventually I resorted to applying some olive oil before each session to prevent this. Again, 10 years with neil pryde equipment I had never experienced something like this.

Now about the NCX; I noticed some serious wrinkles on the upper body on the first day I rigged the sail. I really am not sure whether I did something seriously wrong but the damage is pretty obvious.

And finally, and most annoyingly, although I love the overdrive’s performance on a straight line, the cams are impossible to rotate on their own! Approximately 30 times in the water, and yes, although the sail overall became softer and certainly much easier to rig (at first it was impossible to apply full downhaul and the top and middle cams kept popping out before attaching the lower one), cam behaviour is virtually unchanged and still require some kicking or heavy pumping in order to rotate (and yes, I have removed all cam spacers). I am pretty sure I 've read elsewhere as well that the 8.6 especially has issues with cam rotation - I don't know whether this was improved in 2016.

I really wish severne address issues like those because overall I am very happy with the sails’ performance and besides these concerns I still can't wait to get my sails to the water.

Cheers!

Didn't hear any problems that aren't seen by all brands. If one brand could do everything perfectly they'd have an absolute monopoly. Where i live severne pretty much do. Tells me that they have the best performance to problem ratio.

If you thread your boom more than once you're doing it wrong. Just leave a loop. You should change your downhaul yearly. Costs almost nothing to be safe.

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Gnotukker said..
Have an NCX, never an issue. The clew issue and wrinkles in particular make me wonder if its something in your rigging routine? I am far from expert but isn't monofilm simply monofilm and the boom rope should just pass through? happy to be corrected of course

Be interested to hear what, if any issues you've had with your NP gear?

Well, a saber, excess and combat are in excellent condition after 8-10 years of moderate use. Bear in mind the combat and excess are x-ply sails, not the saber though. My 8.2 2013 H2 (monofilm) got a small tear after around 40 times in the water over 2 years. I 've covered it with a sticker and it is still perfectly usable (not thrilled with its performance when the wind picks up though). I ve got the feeling the monofilm used on the overdrive is stronger. I actually believe the overdrive is generally a very strong and durable sail, more so than the NCX. That's one of the reasons my next sail will probably be an overdrive instead of an NCX (that and the fact that its bottom end power is greater).

I had a small issue with an X6 mast however where the inner plug that kept water from entering the mast started letting small amounts of water get trapped inside. Most mast manufacturers don't use that plug anyway, I was adviced to remove it altogether which was what I did. I also had some errosion issues with an X6 boom at the head area (the rope attachment) which was I believe was due to salt water being left to dry for extended periods of time. That was fixed for free by my local dealer BTW. I much prefer the alu race's stiffness than the X6's though.

I believe there are different monofilm qualities, gaastra probably using one of the strongest quality at least in terms of durability against UV radiation.

I admit I could have done something wrong while rigging the NCX because it was quite windy at the beach. But the clew thing, it really is straightforward as you say, it just doesn't pass through easily, I need to twist it several times and grab its edge to pull it through.

Finally, to comment on mclovin's remark, I indeed only thread the boom once. Moreover the fact that severne monopolizes your surfing spot doesn't say much about performance to problem ratio. If it did, it would be a monopoly across the world which it isn't (except if they ship the best samples to your area, leaving the rest for the others). It most likely has to do with your local dealer's service, pricing and marketing.

Regards

I've been using severne sails (amongst a few others) for quite a while now, and aside from the cam rotation issue, I can honestly say I've not experienced any of the problems you're experiencing.

I'm guessing it's a severne sdm extension you've got? They come with formuline downhaul rope, ive not had anything other than normal wear and tear happen to mine? The end fraying can/will happen to any rope with time, regardless of what extension it's on. It's a quick job to fix with a lighter/match as well.

The cam rotation on the overdrives isn't great I admit. Unless you're racing and need the extra stiffness that the 90% mast gives you, change it out for a 75%, I've found out the hard way as you have that the extra pressure on the roller cams from a stiffer mast means they work much less effectively.

As for the quality of Neil pryde, at the price they charge for new sails compared to everyone else, you'd want the quality to be top notch I'd think.

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my7thlife said..

I believe there are different monofilm qualities, gaastra probably using one of the strongest quality at least in terms of durability against UV radiation.

I am fairly sure the Severnes are made in the same factory, and I am sure they would be using the same supplier for materials. Obviously they might have different laminates etc but the monofilm is most likely the same.

Mast getting stuck together isn't really a brand issue, it would occur more easily to a new tight fitting connection, just tape it if you have a real problem.

Al

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Subsonic said..

As for the quality of Neil pryde, at the price they charge for new sails compared to everyone else, you'd want the quality to be top notch I'd think.

Never had a problem with the quality of NP sails or the value for money. But then I don't buy new at Aus RRP, just wait for the obligatory price reductions that inevitably bring them in line with other brands.

Don't know about the other stuff but I will tell you how I rig my Severne overdrives.

1. I downhaul enough to get the boom on and then using an adjustable outhaul pull it to the setting marked on the sail.
2. I then loosen the downhaul slowly till it is about 10cm from the setting and try to get the bottom cam on first.
3. If I can't get it on I slack the downhaul about 1cm at a time till I do.
4. Once the bottom cam is on I then pull on about 4cm of downhaul and put the other two cams on. If I can't get it on slack a little or if they pop off tighten a little.
5. I check the bottom cam is square/straight then downhaul to the setting on the sail or setting plus one cm.
6. Done except for the tack strap.
With your cam rotation try and back off the batten tension a bit and put more tension using the reflex system.

Admittedly my 8.6m is the hardest to rotate, but have changed my gybe technique a bit lately flipping the sail earlier and giving the boom a good yank when sailing a bit above downwind, before bearing up and the cams have been rotating pretty good and my alphas have improved a bit. However I actually think that you could afford to change to a carbon boom that may solve a lot of your problems. A carbon boom will be a lot stiffer and when you gybe and give the sail a pump that force will be transmitted to the sail. With an aluminium boom it tends to bend and bow and wears you out as you constantly flexing the aluminium instead of popping the cams.

The three biggest things that have improved my sailing are using Patrick boards (glass bottom but carbon top which keeps me in control), carbon fins (I use select Select Vmax which are really good value in Australia and nearly the same price as glass ones and don't seem to spin out anymore and can use a fin 2cm shorter) and using a carbon boom great for cam rotation and stops the draft moving around in the sail when powered up. I really like my overdrives and find they are the best sail for me being a reasonable price and the right mix of usability and speed being light weight

Good luck and I think it always take a bit to get used to a new sail brand, and that's why I never mix and match brands so my rigging is quicker.

surprised to hear any concerns on Severne products ...

as far as cambered sail rigging - especially wide luff race sails, i did a post on the subject
joewindsurfer.blogspot.com/2013/06/rigging-cambered-race-sail.html

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Dean 424 said..
Don't know about the other stuff but I will tell you how I rig my Severne overdrives.

1. I downhaul enough to get the boom on and then using an adjustable outhaul pull it to the setting marked on the sail.
2. I then loosen the downhaul slowly till it is about 10cm from the setting and try to get the bottom cam on first.
3. If I can't get it on I slack the downhaul about 1cm at a time till I do.
4. Once the bottom cam is on I then pull on about 4cm of downhaul and put the other two cams on. If I can't get it on slack a little or if they pop off tighten a little.
5. I check the bottom cam is square/straight then downhaul to the setting on the sail or setting plus one cm.
6. Done except for the tack strap.
With your cam rotation try and back off the batten tension a bit and put more tension using the reflex system.

Admittedly my 8.6m is the hardest to rotate, but have changed my gybe technique a bit lately flipping the sail earlier and giving the boom a good yank when sailing a bit above downwind, before bearing up and the cams have been rotating pretty good and my alphas have improved a bit. However I actually think that you could afford to change to a carbon boom that may solve a lot of your problems. A carbon boom will be a lot stiffer and when you gybe and give the sail a pump that force will be transmitted to the sail. With an aluminium boom it tends to bend and bow and wears you out as you constantly flexing the aluminium instead of popping the cams.

The three biggest things that have improved my sailing are using Patrick boards (glass bottom but carbon top which keeps me in control), carbon fins (I use select Select Vmax which are really good value in Australia and nearly the same price as glass ones and don't seem to spin out anymore and can use a fin 2cm shorter) and using a carbon boom great for cam rotation and stops the draft moving around in the sail when powered up. I really like my overdrives and find they are the best sail for me being a reasonable price and the right mix of usability and speed being light weight

Good luck and I think it always take a bit to get used to a new sail brand, and that's why I never mix and match brands so my rigging is quicker.

Thank you Dean for the tips. I will try tweaking batten and reflex system tension and see whether things improve with cam rotation. I am afraid a carbon boom is not an option for me at the moment, not to mention my severne dealer insisted the alu race is as stiff as (if not stiffer than) the enigma (although I personally doubt that). I will definitely try and change my gybing technique as well. Changing brands indeed takes a learning curve but I feel the overdrive is a sail that is definitely worth it.

Regards

No worries, thanks for the acknowledgement. By the way I don't believe any aluminium boom is as stiff as a carbon. I know it is a problem as I could never pop the cams on my 10m Formula sail unless I was well powered up with my aluminium boom, changed to carbon and bang round they go. I have two carbon booms one enigma and one Gun. I think they are pretty much the same boom however the Gun is about a third cheaper.

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Dean 424 said..
No worries, thanks for the acknowledgement. By the way I don't believe any aluminium boom is as stiff as a carbon. I know it is a problem as I could never pop the cams on my 10m Formula sail unless I was well powered up with my aluminium boom, changed to carbon and bang round they go. I have two carbon booms one enigma and one Gun. I think they are pretty much the same boom however the Gun is about a third cheaper.

wow, will definitely look into the gun one then!

My Severne gear is holding up well, especially as the smaller sails are pounded by 30 -50 kts in some of these Tassie winds. My bigger sails are holding out well too, with long hours spent out sailing sometimes for distance in the gpstc. I sail Overdrives. The R5 to the most recent the cam rotation is a dream, the earlier models were a little sticky and I believe Severne has rectified that problem definitely now. I've had no problems with the masts sticking together, the salt on the mainland must be pretty harsh My carbon boom grip is showing the usual wear and tear that boom's have but I've had it for 3 years and it will go on for another 3 quite easily I'ld say. I always try to rig up on grass if possible as I'm sure that makes a huge difference to the wear and tear of a sail.

No issues here either, just usual wear and tear from use