G'day everybody, I was hoping to get your input on a few thoughts floating around in my head. But first a quick bio to help the situation a bit. I started sailing at 8 years old, windsurfing at 18 years and I'm 46 now. My technique is ok but my body isn't. Arthritis and type 1 diabetes mean that the mind is willing but the body has other ideas lol.
My gear is an old 12 foot raceboard built by andrew reagan. It's a dinosaur and I do love it so lol. I also have a seatrend 68 about 10 years old, It's an old "flapper" style race board about 270 x 70 cm. It was one of the early generation when boards went from long and skinny to short and wide. It goes well upwind and reaching but gets a little "catapulty" off wind. Last but not least is a bullet proof caveman custom slalom built by john gillis. It's 9 foot by 20 inches and about 70 to 80 litres I guess. It's not just dated, it's carbon dated. It's rediculously small by modern slalom board standards lol.
My sails vary from ok to prehistoric. I have an 8.2 sailworks NX that goes ok and a 7.0 sailworks retro that is nice. after that my sails get a bit dated, 95 to 97 models.
So now that you know my gear, My question is, how much better is the new stuff?
I've been idle from the sport for about 8 years due to marriage but now its time for one last hurrah before my joints fuse together. I always try to do my homework when buying gear and I like the look of the starboard futura's. I'm dithering a bit over volume between the 101 and 111. I dont want to go to big as that role will be filled by something else. I weigh about 80 kg's and the biggest sail I would carry on the futura would be my 7.0 and smallest about a 5.5 . Severne is my choice of sails. taking into account performance, quality and price they look pretty good. And after reading some very helpful posts on this forum I will be using 70% carbon masts :-)
I am also thinking seriously of getting into formula. I want some light wind gear but light wind slalom is not what I want, I like to sail upwind for a few km's and reach home again so the upwind/broad reaching nature of formula seems appealing. when I was younger I would regularly beat 10 km's into a southerly with an OP sail just so I could reach home again at any angle I want lol.
I understand the formula gear is challenging, however as soon as I can get going on the futura the formula will very likely be put away. so it's light to medium conditions it will be used in. There is a local sailing club about 2 km's from where I live that races formula so I will definately rock up and get my BUTT KICKED lol.
So getting to the point of my second question, am I kidding myself about the formula and should I just go light wind slalom? I have some physical limitations from my arthritis and to a smaller degree my diabetes but to be honest my mindset is it's only pain, stop whinging and harden up lol.
Any input much appreciated, cheers everyone.
Cluffy,
Good to hear you getting back into the sport. Feel free to come down to the club at Marmong on Saturday from 1:30pm and say gday. We have some formula gear in the club that you can have a try on. You might find that your 8.2 goes well on a formula board, just for light wind cruising, so bring it along. The bigger sails (ie 10-11m) aren't too bad once you get used to handling them.
Cheers,
James
This question is straight forward considering the following points:
1. You have a great Lake to sail on and explore all parts of
2. You have a great little club and group of guy's down the road that races every weekend
2. You don't want to pump around all the time in the light to medium winds on slalom kit
3. Sounds like you have been fully into the sport previously
4. You want to get the most out of every opportunity you can get on the water
Answer
1 x Formula Board
1 x 11m sail
1 x 110l slalom board
1 x 7.6
1 x 6.6
That should cover pretty much all bases, well at least to 20 -25knts
Get on down to Marmong, come up to the down under pro at Hawks Nest and have a look around, Formula is really one of the best sailing classes going and the NSW racing scene is exceptionally well organised and attended.
I don't plan on missing a season anytime soon.
All the best.
Basically muz720 is right, but I'd be cautious about committing to big formula gear straight up. Yes, I know the NSW formula scene is packed with ridiculously buff geriatrics, but I thought I'd offer an opinion from *outside* of the genetic elite ;). So, best if you can try it first. It really does demand fitness and some strength. If you are happy/able to get on a fairly steep fitness improvement curve, fantastic. If not, you'll get a lot more TOW and less pain out of a long board.
To give you a comparison: I'm 46, no arthritis, no diabetes. Been sailing since 6, windsurfing since 15. When I first got my formula gear I could sail downwind in a straight line for 30 seconds before I had to sit down and rest, and one hour was a looong session. Now I can go two hours but I'm knackered. On my raceboard I can cruise around 4-5 hours in any wind and still have a spring in my step. Not that I mind being knackered, but that's how much more intense the formula is.
Thanks for the advice fellas very much appreciated. Jamesf That's a very generous offer of a test sail that would be a big help. I might take you up on that! Maybe not this weekend though, big southerly coming apparently.
Jmetcher you hit the nail on the head regarding my concerns. I was watching the formula guys at marmong the other day and the sail sizes they were carrying stopped me in my tracks and made my jaw drop. That type of thing just isn't going to happen with me and it's not really what I want anyway. I'm just looking to be powered up in light to medium stuff but I do enjoy good upwind performance. I brushed over the formula rules last night and it seems I can run with 3 sails? If thats the case I'm happy to just carry something smaller and get left behind downwind. That doesn't really bother me to be honest.
Thanks for the help fellas
just a quick bump for closure.
I've decided to go with a starboard ultrasonic rather than a formula. I was out in a southerly today with my 7.0 retro and I was nice and comfortable. I tried my 8.2 earlier on and I wasn't really enoying it. I was watching the formula guys and they looked to be running 10 and 11 metre sails. that's not really my cup of tea sorry guys.
I love the upwind power of the formula's but I should of remembered that performance like that is going to come with a trade off. An ultrasonic with a 60 cm fin will satisfy my upwind needs just fine I think
The ultra sonic was a narrow winner for me over the JP super lightwind. In the end it came down to the tail width and the slightly narrower tail of the starboard suits me a little better I think.
Happy sailing fellas!
I was down at marmong on my old seatrend, watching the formula guys go around. Quite a few locals on these forums! good stuff.
I was watching them in the distance.I was crewing on a yacht.One of the buggers cutting up the water off Valentine.For once I didn't feel I was missing out as it looked pretty gusty..Great to get some rain but hope the NE's blow this week!
Sorry that you weren't convinced by our formula racing cluffy. I saw you sailing downwind of us but didnt get a chance to catch up with you.
The conditions on Saturday were great for racing! But it wasnt really light wind cruising. Most of us were maxed out on our 10s a lot of the time. If we weren't racing, most of us would have been on slalom boards with 7-8m sails like you had. You would get a better idea of the light wind capability of formula on a more gentle NE 10 knot day. We get plenty of those at Marmong unfortunately!
Anyway, your new ultrasonic should have a similar feel to an older style formula board, so should get you on the water in the light stuff. hope to see you back on the water again soon.
Cheers
james
i call the JP SPLW, the SB US and my BIC Techno Formula "free formula".
they are a little easier to handle, plane early and may not require such long fins.
i too have read that the SB US is slightly preferred over the JP SPLW.
here is a SB video showing that the US is NO slouch !!!
Joe that movie gives a good view of the rocker line of the ultra sonic. I've watched a few JP movies and I think I can see the 2 different trains of thought with the boards. The Ultrasonic looks to be more of a blown up Isonic, more slalom oriented in its design. The JP super lightwind seems like the designers started with a formula board and trimmed it down around the edges. The rocker line of the JP looks a lot more formula oriented. The JP also comes in a 165 litre model, and is 300 bucks cheaper than it's SB counter part of the same construction. Watching the JP movies, the JP super lightwind seems to gybe around effortlessly with a minium amount of rail. you gotta love that in such a big board.
My take on the 2 boards is the JP 92 will get me planning the earliest and is nicer to gybe than the SB US, but the US has great top end speed for a mother ship.
James you make a very valid point about conditions on saturday. It seems what I saw was the upper end of the scenario. I gotta hand it to you guys I dont think I saw one dropped rig despite the conditions. I've been looking closely at modern racing sails and it seems the designers have gone to great lengths to get the centre of effort of the sail as low as possible. That has to make life easier surely. One question, if that was maxed out with your 10's , what do you guys do when it gets windy? I was nowhere near the limit of my 7.0 metre. a 7.5 would have been perfect I think. That tells me the wind was not really topping 20 knots. 15 to 18 would be my guesstimate. Not that I'm critising the rig sizes of formula! I know all to well the marmong winter series conditions. Massive rigs and early planing, GOOD THING lol.
